Messages

16

Gameplay / Re: Idea for new Game type?

« on: November 08, 2013, 11:30:39 am »

Going to totally rip off star conflict but:

Much like scrim's idea, however, one boat on each team is the "Fleet Admiral" which allows for respawns. The goal is to kill this boat so that your enemy stops respawning and you eventually win the game. 3v3/4v4.

This would be awesome and quite fitting with the setting!

17

Gameplay / Re: Harpoon gun discussion

« on: November 08, 2013, 09:46:33 am »

I assure you I did take it seriously and I've tried it before on a multitude of ships and situations.
Harpoon physics are quite simply broken and unpredictable and also counterintuitive, as I described in detail in the OP it's perfectly possible to have an harpooned ship pulling you to the right and yet being unable to turn your ship in that direction. Sometimes the harpoon rope looks like it acts like a solid, rigid pole connecting the two ships, preventing you from getting close or moving away from the harpooned ship. And so on.
But that's beyond the point.

What you don't seem to be getting is that a weapon that require so much effort in order to be even remotely useful is broken by default. This is a game, not a job, and it already has a steep learning curve. There is no justification for having a weapon such as the harpoon around to add frustration for new and experienced players alike.
No other weapon in this game is so hard to use and has so little benefits to it. Even the humble flare gun can at least be used to set fires on an enemy ship, aside from its more obvious role of countering clouds.

I honestly don't understand why would anyone try to justify the harpoon in its current form. Yeah it's good for shits and giggles once in a while when used in the occasional joke build, but aside from that? It's a pain in the ass.
And a tournament won't change that. The average player would still try the weapon, be frustrated by it and never use it again. Which goes back to my point that having an elite few mastering the weapon still dosen't mean that the weapon itself is fine.
I would even argue that IF such a tournament were to bring new life to the harpoon in the competitive scene it would make things even worse. Suddendly experienced players are harpooning ships left and right while the average player doesn't know how to react and is frustrated that he can't use it himself because let's be honest, most people don't have the dedication it takes to master even the basic weapons and builds, much less something like the harpoon.

I'm going to say this again.
There is nothing to argue here, no gray area. The proofs are right in front of us, nobody uses the harpoon. Just like the predominance of a weapon or combo in the public scene was enough to nerf the gat-mortar combo, the total absence of a weapon in said public games should be enought to warrant a redesign.

18

Gameplay / Re: Harpoon gun discussion

« on: November 08, 2013, 04:45:20 am »

Hm, maybe we should have some kind of tournament based around the harpoon. Just to see what teams can do when they actually (hopefully) try to make good use of it.

What would that accomplish?
I have actually tried to make good use of the harpoon. Other people have. In fact I would say anyone that has tried the harpoon even once has.
If a weapon is viable only in the hands of an elite few it's NOT a good weapon and most important it's awful design.

The situation is so clear that there is no need for further tests and proofs, the harpoon needs to be changed, period.

19

Gameplay / Re: Harpoon gun discussion

« on: November 07, 2013, 05:41:54 pm »

I think the harpoon would be more useful if the harpooning ship got a "Mass Advantage" for the ensuing wonky rope physics.

That would be nice, unrealistic perhaps, but I don't think it would bother anyone. The harpoon is a horribile weapon, if you actually manage to harpoon an enemy ship in a situation where it would be useful the least you should be able to do is to actually move him around and not be pulled around yourself.

20

The Docks / Re: Hey there GoI! Do you like Cake?

« on: November 06, 2013, 10:11:32 am »

I am stunned by how quickly you are leveling B'elanna. 

21

Gameplay / Re: What ship is good for me?

« on: November 04, 2013, 05:10:37 pm »

Squid, not even the shadow of a doubt.
Hit and run, brawling, chasing, running away, diverisons... The Squid is a much deeper ship when it comes to strategy and tactics.

22

Gameplay / Re: 1.3.3 PILOT, PILOT SKILLS, AND SHIP BALANCE

« on: November 04, 2013, 10:48:31 am »

A general question to the community, then: How do you see the Mobula? What would you want to see a floating gun platform used for, and how would you like to see it handled? MUSE has stated in this thread that they're looking at the Mobula, so maybe we can help them narrow down what we'd like to see the Mobula become.

As I said before, I'd like to see a complete redesign when it comes to gun placement.
First I'll explain my logic: front facing guns are boring when you are piloting a ship and I play mainly pilot. I have the most fun when I can make hit-and-run tactics, which are best accomplished with side guns or even rear guns.
Plus, most ships already have front facing guns and the Mobula is getting really similar to the Spire right now.

What I would like to see for the mobula is more of a side weapon configuration, 3 light guns on each side with trifecta possibile if the enemy is in the sweet spot, no front gun nor back gun, but the side weapons can fire a bit towards the back if the weapon has enough firing arc.

Alternatively make it REALLY crazy and simply change place of the guns: all facing back! It would be unique and could be open to some interesting loadouts and strategies, plus combo ability with things like tar, harpoons+moonshine to "tow" ships (assuming it works like some people say), mines and so on...

23

Gameplay / Re: 1.3.3 ENGINEER AND REPAIR TOOL BALANCE

« on: November 01, 2013, 01:13:09 pm »

What if chem spay lasted much longer, but instead of fire immunity it granted the parts stacks of "cool" so in order to burn that part the fire stacks would first subtract from the cool stacks, once the cool has been negated fire works as normal.

We have suggested that, but it was discarded.
Basically the only tweaks that are viable, if I understand correctly, are the simple numerical values of things like cooldown, stacks of fire removed and duration of the fire immunity.

24

The Docks / Re: Hey there GoI! Do you like Cake?

« on: November 01, 2013, 07:25:04 am »

Hello there, Mr. Cake! Many of you probably have seen me flying around, especially Orangey and other nice peeps. I've always thought you were the nicest peeps around, and we both love flame throwers. So let's take the fight to the Crimson Skies, together!

 (also, I like cake).

Though I am unsure who this "Mr. Cake" you speak of is, we welcome you all the same! Free free to change your clan tag, join the steam group and hit some pastries up in-game!

I am Mr. Cake.

James T. Kake, if I'm not mistaken.

I'm calling you that now.

Gonna keep calling you Games T. Cork.

Is that right server?

Does it matter?

Uhhh quote pyramid! I love those!

25

Gameplay / Re: Harpoon gun discussion

« on: October 31, 2013, 01:41:37 pm »

I'm certain we both agree that the Harpoon should not be a damage dealer, even less an armor shredder.

We do not agree on this.

The harpoon should be a viable weapon in and of itself with some interesting utility added on when they fix the harpoon mechanics. 

I'd imagine the harpoon to be a piercing weapon weaker than the mercury and gattling with shorter than gattling range but the utility of a new and improved harpoon mechanic.  This would make it similar in a way to the carousel which loses out on dps to other explosive finishers but gains the added benefit of pouring on fire stacks.

Agreed...
One thing I thought about was making the harpoon a "damage over time" weapon, once you are harpooned your armor or harpooned component keeps taking damage, but it can do any real hull damage.
I think it would be a nice risk-reward weapon if that was the case, since it's as much as an obstacle to those that use it as to those that are subjected to it.

26

Gameplay / Re: Harpoon gun discussion

« on: October 31, 2013, 01:00:45 pm »

Moving things with the harpoon doesn't have nearly as much to do with mass as it does with thrust since everything is suspended in air.

Speaking from the perspective and recollection of the former glorious harpoon, it was always good on the front gun of a Junker and rear gun of a Squid and of course excellent on a Galleon.  Should the armor piercing modifier be properly buffed putting one on the front of the Pyra should yield excellent results as it reels you slowly into its mortar with repeated harpoon shots.  It should also be quite good on a mobula, which if you look at the stats, isn't nearly as fragile as people think (though it really does hate rams, vertical acceleration usually makes them a non issue though).

Unless you know something I don't I'm gonna have to say that this isn't true or at least not commonplace.
I've harpooned ships with my squid, full speed, kerosene and I still got horribly stuck. You can tangle them and make their manouvering a bit awkard, just like yours after harpooning, but towing? Never seen it happen. Maybe if the enemy has the engines turned off and for some reason he doesn't use them to resist?

Otherwise both ships get stuck pulling away from eachother and that's it.

27

Gameplay / Re: Harpoon gun discussion

« on: October 31, 2013, 09:41:36 am »

Old harpoon (pre-mass adjusting patch)

[5:00 - 06:15] http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=X7bDT4IUTr4#t=300

[02:25 - end] http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=dMF_1929eus#t=146

Stick around for my favorite line of commentary ever at 09:27.


Last week:

[30:48 - end] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWmt_AdfxRQ#t=1849


My opinion:
The harpoon is exactly as useful as the players are imaginative.

You did exactly what I asked not to.
You present exceptions and try to justify the current state of a useless, underused and straight out counter productive weapon with them.
This doesn't work.

28

Gameplay / Harpoon gun discussion

« on: October 31, 2013, 07:04:11 am »

I recently got the achivement for killing 4 harpooned ships and it was a pain in the arse.
I've never  been a fan of that gun, I tried using it with a couple of builds and I've always found it lacking. But grinding for this achivement made me realize just how bad it was.

Now I've heard in the past that the harpoon is supposed to simulate perfecty the effect of a rope tying the two ships together, but I think it goes beyond that. The harpoon takes away all control from your ship.
With this achivement I went for a ramming Pyramidion armed with harpoon and mortar on the front guns. Each time I harpooned something that was in front of me the ship would start turning to the opposite direction.
Then I would find myself with the enemy on my right, pulling me to the right. You'd think that this would make turning the ship to the right easier since there is a whole ship pulling you in that direction. No, it made it IMPOSSIBILE.
I had to turn all the way to the left, with the harpoon rope cutting through my ship like it wasn't there and after doing an almost full 360° turn I was able to have the enemy ship in front of me again, for a brief moment before this hellspawn of a gun decided that SOMEHOW having a rope between me and my target in front of me was preventing me from going foward, towards said ship, and insted pulled me to the left again.
I had to resort to firing the harpoon at the last second just before killing the enemy ship.

Now, putting my rant aside, I think the harpoon gun is useless. Right now it's a joke weapon and any constructive way of using it requires a disproportionate amount of effort. In public games it's virtually non-existent, aside from the occasional joke build.
Is this right? Is the harpoon supposed to be a joke weapon, that no one would ever use seriously?

Oh and please don't start posting things like "I can use the harpoon, here's how". Allright, some of you might be able to put it to good use. I'm not arguing that. I'm arguing that it requires disproportionate effort to manage that and I'm arguing that it's so counter intuitive and hard to use that it's basically non-existent in any given match, which I think proves it's a flawed weapon, regardless of exceptions.

29

Feedback and Suggestions / Re: New Game Mode - 2v2v2/1v1v1

« on: October 31, 2013, 06:41:35 am »

2v2v2 is an interetsing concept, even if I would like it better if it was something like the old resource race. Not strictly a deathmatch but an objective based game.

30

Gameplay / Re: 1.3.3 ENGINEER AND REPAIR TOOL BALANCE

« on: October 30, 2013, 02:35:16 pm »

Could be displayed by a number or indicator on each component when you look at them directly, just like the buff meter.