An open letter to Muse

[Kestril]

I didn't claim that you "had to" do any of that Narayan. It's every player's responsibility to watch their own actions and not be a toxic detriment to other players. Whether you do that by patiently explaining, quitting the match, negotiating with other players to balance the lobby, or captaining/crewing with only experienced people you know to avoid frustration is up to you.

I can say I've turned a noob ship into a well-oiled death machine on more than one occasion, so I can testify to the effectiveness of my methods. 

[BlackenedPies]

Finally, I do think loadouts should be able to be declined and selected be engies/gunners. It put's too much power in the hands of the captians and may make players feel very insignificant in the engineer or gunner role. Furthermore, I think it places an undue importance on the role of captianing, and makes the information burdern for new captians even higher, as a new captian will have to learn what loadouts to equip other players with in addition to their ship.  It's not that hard to explain about the correct loadout. I do think that loadouts should be limited to one fire-extinguish tool, however. This will ensure that any engineer loadout will have at least one repair tool and we won't see chem/extinguish/buff trollout ever again.

In tough matches there's often only one correct loadout for each crew member and one wrong loadout can mean defeat for an entire team. Loadouts are not optional for the very reason that each role is significant, and that's why captains are forced to leave rather than play with a wrong loadout. Captain is objectively most important role on the ship: they choose the ship, loadouts, and when the match starts

On the contrary, I think it's essential that crew and captains learn these loadouts. Crew learn tools / ammo for a position, and captains learn how to better manage ships. If you think there's a better option for the loadout you're given, explain that to the captain. In the current system, the loadout gets declined and players start off pissed. The captain starts from a source of frustration and this escalates. This is the #1 cause of all reports I've seen, so much so that Muse removed the ability to spam loadouts - which captains resorted to as an alternative to leaving their precious slot

To clarify, loadouts should be auto-accepted but you'll still be able to change it afterwards. There shouldn't be an ability to decline loadouts - which is unnecessary and the biggest source of conflict in the game

[Kestril]

Interesting point, pies, I'd love to go over this in more detail in a second thread. I'm coming from the angle of player retention and the "knowledge burden" new captains often get saddled with.  Good point with how it does seem to escalate tension. And there ARE less captians then crew in any given match. So there'd be less players overall that make loadout mistakes. I'll chew on this for a while.

But yeah, I don't see what's wrong with a message saying "The captian has changed their ship. Your loadout has been modified."--or something along those lines, as long as engineers can modify their load out after the ship has been changed.

It may bring some frustration to new captians that don't know what ammo/loadout is needed. But to be fair that's an issue already with ship loadouts.

[Narayan]

There you go again kestril you say it's every players responsibly to behave, but we all know the only ones held accountable are veteran players like sparkle dust. The noobs just come in and troll and there are no consequences. I feel like you don't think things thru before you post them here.

[BlackenedPies]

Interesting point, pies, I'd love to go over this in more detail in a second thread. I'm coming from the angle of player retention and the "knowledge burden" new captains often get saddled with.  Good point with how it does seem to escalate tension. And there ARE less captians then crew in any given match. So there'd be less players overall that make loadout mistakes. I'll chew on this for a while.

But yeah, I don't see what's wrong with a message saying "The captian has changed their ship. Your loadout has been modified."--or something along those lines, as long as engineers can modify their load out after the ship has been changed.

It may bring some frustration to new captians that don't know what ammo/loadout is needed. But to be fair that's an issue already with ship loadouts.

I don't mean that players should automatically be given loadouts based on the captain's setup, rather the same system of giving out loadouts but without the ability to decline - the notification of the loadout pops up with an OK button (or similar). There are plenty of times where you don't want to give out loadouts, like if you don't have one ready, are using an alternate setup, or the crew already has an acceptable loadout

A notification for the captain when crew changes loadout, such as the crew's loadout icon becoming highlighted, would be useful

[Kestril]

There you go again kestril you say it's every players responsibly to behave, but we all know the only ones held accountable are veteran players like sparkle dust. The noobs just come in and troll and there are no consequences. I feel like you don't think things thru before you post them here.

Unfortunately, that's the internet these days. And the low population means that any player is more likely to encounter these trolls. I encountered a troll-clan the other night and it was unfortunate. It does feel very unfair that new players that don't have any stake or emotional connection to the community here come in, troll, and leave. Feelsbad  . The best recourse is to use the report and block function. I do think that more moderators online could solve this issue. However, outside of the "fight the devs" matches, the public matches don't have the mods to police and kick these disruptive players for an instant action to correct this trolly behavior.

I do think this is where muse can improve things on their end, offering volunteer moderator positions to those CA's that have demonstrated their cool-headedness and helpfulness to the community. But yeah, the low population and low price of the game is the two issues this whole problem seems to stem from. I think muse can take action by either playing and moderating the game more themselves, giving some long-standing CA's some limited moderation ability, implementing a well-thought-out kick system, or addressing the "loadout frustration" that sparks this powder-keg, as pies mentioned.

I don't mean that players should automatically be given loadouts based on the captain's setup, rather the same system of giving out loadouts but without the ability to decline - the notification of the loadout pops up with an OK button (or similar). There are plenty of times where you don't want to give out loadouts, like if you don't have one ready, are using an alternate setup, or the crew already has an acceptable loadout

Alright. Pies, you've swayed me. After some critical thought, I'm on-board for this change. But I also think that a passive notification is less intrusive and more "inviting" or "friendly" than the big pop-up that you get recommended in the lobby. A passive notification may give more of a sense of "that's just how the game works" response rather a  "MY CAPTIAN IS FORCING THIS LOADOUT ON ME HELP I DON'T KNOW WHAT THIS MEANS" response. Strictly from a new player's point of view.

[Atruejedi]

Interesting point, pies, I'd love to go over this in more detail in a second thread. I'm coming from the angle of player retention and the "knowledge burden" new captains often get saddled with.  Good point with how it does seem to escalate tension. And there ARE less captians then crew in any given match. So there'd be less players overall that make loadout mistakes. I'll chew on this for a while.

But yeah, I don't see what's wrong with a message saying "The captian has changed their ship. Your loadout has been modified."--or something along those lines, as long as engineers can modify their load out after the ship has been changed.

It may bring some frustration to new captians that don't know what ammo/loadout is needed. But to be fair that's an issue already with ship loadouts.

I don't mean that players should automatically be given loadouts based on the captain's setup, rather the same system of giving out loadouts but without the ability to decline - the notification of the loadout pops up with an OK button (or similar). There are plenty of times where you don't want to give out loadouts, like if you don't have one ready, are using an alternate setup, or the crew already has an acceptable loadout

Interesting concept. I, the captain, design the ship and the loadouts. My crew mates are automatically sent those classes and loadouts, passively and without obstructing notifications. If I change the ship or loadouts, they receive a passive notification. If they alter their loadouts, I receive a passive notification. I could get behind this, at least to try it out. But, as it stands, this is not a priority for me and I think the system is pretty tolerable. I'd rather we #AdaptTheMaps and #BringBalanceToTheForce--, pardon, Game-- with nerfs to certain ammos. Oh, hell, just dropping these hashtags here: #NerfGreased #NerfBurst #RestoreLoch #ChangeCharged #HowAboutAHowitzer #SkyballOverhaul #AuditTheSpawns #LuckOfTheSpawn #BalloonLivesMatter

[AbbyTheRat]

Heya! First off, there's some awesome talks about loadouts and passive notifications, these can be started in a new topic or sent in an email to feedback@musegames.com

Secondly, the reason I've locked this thread is that the Original post is talking about disciplinary action which is against the forum rules, any talks about disciplinary actions taken by muse should be sent to muse at abuse@musegames.com, the forums is no place for that. They read every email when they can, and if possible or needed will reply to them. They extremely rarely read the forums, if you're looking for any response from them, emails is always the best way.

Re: https://gunsoficarus.com/community/forum/index.php/topic,27.0.html -

6. Do not back-seat moderate.

If you see an objectionable post which you believe violates the Community Standards or the forum rules, please use the "Report to moderator" flag at the bottom of the post to flag it, and do not reply to or comment on it. Moderation matters such as flagging, thread closing, banning or other corrective measures should only be discussed via private message between the moderators and the parties involved, and are not open for public debate. Please bring any moderation concerns you may have to our attention at abuse@musegames.com or feedback@musegames.com.

Thirdly, if you have any issues with the CA teams, again, send an email to feedback@musegames.com and they will read it. Believe me, there have been a lot of actions taken behind the scenes, there have been efforts to improve this aspect.

Thanks for reading.