[Commander] Sanity keeper - Improved block function & /kick

[Arnox]

Greetings,

As titled, it would be nice if we could have :

- an improved block function, avoiding the blocked player to join the blocking commander. At the moment, the blocklist is only avoiding us to read people, griefing is doable at ease.

- a /kick [player_name] command avaliable in both lobby and match (commander only). Again, if you want to grief someone you just have to stay aboard, doing nothing, avoiding the system to detect you AFK, avoiding the crew to benefit the presence of another player of IA. Serious annoyance for the crew and the team.

regards,

Arnox

[-Muse- Cullen]

the /kick function seems a little out of place for GoI:O- I like being able to weasel my way onto high level crews. If that function existed, then some players would have a lot of trouble finding their way into any sort of high-level play, due to the fact that most people dislike teaching new players in the middle of a match.

However, I think that the block function should exist. Should it bar a player from entering the crew of the one who blocked him or her? The effect would have to occur once the two players leave the lobby, though, or else people would abuse it as a /kick.

[Pickle]

A compromise suggestion..

If a player is currently blocked by more than 3/5/7/other players, the blocked player is then barred from joining crews under Captains that have blocked him.  This stops spiteful blocking, but does leave the door open to abuse by block-blocking of a player by teams/clans/friends.  Perhaps blocks should have an expiry date and lapse after 7 days?

I personally don't like adding a kick option, although I admit that some players can be frustrating.

[IvKir]

Is it possible to add something like a vote for kicking player off? Because sometimes i got captains, who don't tried to communicate with crew and just flying around, don't even responding to the plea of the crew.

[Arnox]

It was not focused on new players and newbies. Every one starts somewhere after all. I'm glad to have mixed crews, show the ropes, make them green. New blood is helping. I was not even talking about the Powder Monkeys. They are part of the GoIO mythologia. An Endless source of jokes, cries and such. I was aiming the "other" players. The guy who doesn't care about the game, the match nor the crew. He just here to piss you to death. The more he will grief, the more he will be happy. Again it's not intented to favor elitism propagation, just good behaviour. I think if a player is kicked 2 or 3 times in a raw due to griefing, he will think twice about it next time. Being "bad" because you are new to the game is not and should not be a reason to be kicked, ever.

As for the compromise : why not a /vote button ? The function exists in Team Fortress 2 for example :

X started a kick vote against "UmadBro" :
- YES
- NO

[Helmic]

It gets pretty frustrating when someone joins your crew, jumps on the main gun, and just sits there the entire round.  Now that the community isn't just hovering around 30 players waiting, there's a good number of people just looking to grief.  Kicks weren't included specifically to foster a more cooperative community, but not having kicks makes this a griefer's paradise.  Votekicking is going to be tough to include because usually only those on board the ship can actually tell whether someone is being a problem, allowing other ships to vote just makes it susceptible to social engineering.  If it's just those on board, it's not hard for two people to just join a game and votekick the captain and then leave.

[HamsterIV]

I am all for expanding the block function to exile blocked players from joining your ship. If you can't communicate with them there is no point flying together. However last time this idea was brought up Muse equated it to a kick which they have all but sworn not to implement. Here is a link to the discussion on the old forums:

http://gunsoficarus.com/community/forumarchive/discussion/545/we-need-a-kick-option-sooner-rather-than-later/p3

[Helmic]

Griefing's becoming more of an issue as the population picks up, if there isn't going to be a kick feature there has to be some way of dealing with griefers without just waiting for a report to not do anything about it.  Preventing blocked players from joining your crew sounds like the best compromise, there's no way you can block someone you haven't met before but you CAN block someone you've played with and know to be a griefer.  It'd be inconvenient enough to make abuse for teamstacking impractical, especially if there's a limit to how many players you can block.  For just dealing with the odd griefer it's enough to just clean out your block list every once in a while.

[nake]

I think a votekick is starting to get needed, gentleman.
Most of the players are very friendly, so I'm not sure about that elitism thing. And if it's a vote kick instead of just kicking out people, it's a lot more difficult to abuse it.

My proposal would be:
Crew member: 100% of the crew except himself should vote kick
Captain: 80% of the team should vote kick
If those conditions are satisfied then the guy is kicked and banned for the whole match.

Some clans could abuse this, but IMHO I think a few people abusing this is better than an increasing number of non-fun matches because of just one griefer in your team.
And as I said, there are better ways that I think would still be used when clans want to play together: saying to move to other ship with the microphone, or using password-protected matches.

This and adding some kind of reward to high-level people that help newbies and it should work pretty well, don't you think?

If it doesn't work out, muse can always just disable the option again.

[Helmic]

Well, part of the problem with votekicking is that with a bit of social engineering you can con people into voting off anyone.  I have a friend that regularly wipes out entire Gmod RP servers just by tricking people into kicking each other.  While that's a bit different as Gmod RP servers aren't known for their intelligent patrons and you aren't physically close to each other to verify the votekick reason (people will vote yes given the slightest justification, even try to convince others to votekick even though the original reason's complete bullshit), I'm sure that's on Muse's minds.

I don't disagree that the slight bit of trolling and elitism that would come from that feature probably isn't going to outweigh the relief we'll get from being able to kick griefers screaming racist obscenities into the mic while hogging the front hwacha shooting into allies.

[Pickle]

No kick of any kind.. I think most of the active community have been against any sort of kick option from the start.

I'm not sure if griefing is any more or less prevalent now than it was a couple of months ago.  Something that hasn't changed though is the periodic mic bug where one player on a team is effectively inside their own comms bubble and can't hear anyone else's mic or be heard themselves.  I've had that happen a few times to me, and been able to establish that it's happened to a crew member - in which case we make sure someone transcribes the essentials so s/he can follow what's being said.  It would be very easy for a new player to fall into the comms bubble bug and not realise it was happening, s/h could then find themselves being repeatedly kicked from games for no apparent reason and be left thinking the game was played by antisocial types.

Some sort if beefed up block would be better, as I suggested up the thread.


(incidentally, the only fix for the comms bubble bug is to close down the game and restart - sometimes you may need to close down Steam and restart that as well)

[nake]

Well, part of the problem with votekicking is that with a bit of social engineering you can con people into voting off anyone.  I have a friend that regularly wipes out entire Gmod RP servers just by tricking people into kicking each other.

Wait, there is still people that plays gmod? xDD
However, as I said in my post, the only option you'd have is to votekick people in your crew and/or in your team.

If it's your crew, they all have to agree. You can only do that social engineering thing with newbies and kids, and I can't see an scenario where all your crew/team members are newbies AND someone wants to kick one of them because he is low-level. See what I mean?
I can't see this happening with, let's say, lvl5~8 people in your crew.

I've played gmod a lot, usually SP or in private servers because people in public servers where mostly mingebags, noobs, or just too young kids. This game it's different (or at least I hope so xD).

[Helmic]

No kick of any kind.. I think most of the active community have been against any sort of kick option from the start.

I'm not sure if griefing is any more or less prevalent now than it was a couple of months ago.  Something that hasn't changed though is the periodic mic bug where one player on a team is effectively inside their own comms bubble and can't hear anyone else's mic or be heard themselves.  I've had that happen a few times to me, and been able to establish that it's happened to a crew member - in which case we make sure someone transcribes the essentials so s/he can follow what's being said.  It would be very easy for a new player to fall into the comms bubble bug and not realise it was happening, s/h could then find themselves being repeatedly kicked from games for no apparent reason and be left thinking the game was played by antisocial types.

Some sort if beefed up block would be better, as I suggested up the thread.


(incidentally, the only fix for the comms bubble bug is to close down the game and restart - sometimes you may need to close down Steam and restart that as well)

We'll have to assume that any relevant bugs are going to be fixed.  More pressing than that is the language barrier (and the people with fake Russian accents using it as a cover), there's people who legitimately can't understand you and there's people who pretend they can't understand you to avoid any possible moderation troubles.

Well, part of the problem with votekicking is that with a bit of social engineering you can con people into voting off anyone.  I have a friend that regularly wipes out entire Gmod RP servers just by tricking people into kicking each other.

Wait, there is still people that plays gmod? xDD
However, as I said in my post, the only option you'd have is to votekick people in your crew and/or in your team.

If it's your crew, they all have to agree. You can only do that social engineering thing with newbies and kids, and I can't see an scenario where all your crew/team members are newbies AND someone wants to kick one of them because he is low-level. See what I mean?
I can't see this happening with, let's say, lvl5~8 people in your crew.

I've played gmod a lot, usually SP or in private servers because people in public servers where mostly mingebags, noobs, or just too young kids. This game it's different (or at least I hope so xD).

Well, let's take a four man ship.  You're there to be an asshole, one guy is competent, and you've got two retards.  You put up a votekick for the competent guy, con the retards into voting for him for as much of a bullshit reason as you can manage, rinse and repeat with one of the retards, proceed to grief the everliving shit out of the survivor.  If someone new comes in, pretend it was the other guy that's causing trouble so you can "finally" votekick him, repeat as desired.  If you're coming in with a buddy, you can take over any ship you want.

[Lord Dick Tim]

I'm opposed to vote kicking as I rarely ever need to kick somebody.  I've had bad crews and fellow captains for sure, but they are never around long enough to make things difficult.  And the few glaringly bad players I've had join up I've had some success teaching them how to play.

But my opinion is also heavily bias, I rarely play anything other then captain, so I don't get bad captains, I've got a patience that is longer then most trolls have the energy to wear thin, and when I do have a troll I go all harpoon squid and rock it. 

No kick option, cause I loose my harpoon squid.  Love that ship.

[nake]

Well, let's take a four man ship.  You're there to be an asshole, one guy is competent, and you've got two retards.  You put up a votekick for the competent guy, con the retards into voting for him for as much of a bullshit reason as you can manage, rinse and repeat with one of the retards, proceed to grief the everliving shit out of the survivor.  If someone new comes in, pretend it was the other guy that's causing trouble so you can "finally" votekick him, repeat as desired.  If you're coming in with a buddy, you can take over any ship you want.

Hmm... Good point.
I was think in why would he do that, he looses his crew, so he plays alone. Which I suspect won't be fun for a troll. But then, they are trolls, so they don't need a reason to do that kind of stuff.

So maybe you were right and there should not be an option to vote-kick.