Sky Torpedoes

[Squidslinger Gilder]

Bringing this in here since it is a bit of theory crafting involved and I don't think people see it in the feedback section in this thread: https://gunsoficarus.com/community/forum/index.php/topic,1580.0.html

Original concept is for an aerial Torpedo I codenamed the Barracuda. Hammered out some ideas behind it. When it gets brought up in game there is quite a lot of interest in the weapon's concept. The term Torpedo alone seems to raise plenty of excitement among new and vet players. I personally think there is a opening for this weapon to be used in the medium mounts as well as the mere concept of it would bring some new strategies as well as new players to the game.

Note the initial concepts change in that thread by the end but the general idea stays intact. We were a little hung up on the firing mechanism and overall design. Whether or not it has a tracking capability of some form is also questionable. Some want, heat seeking...I kinda favor a magnetic effect like Ressorius, but balancing would be a greater issue with either method so a dumb fire torpedo is certainly fine.

[Lord Dick Tim]

I like this idea after reading the thread, and it reinforces my idea of the game being separated into different phases of combat in order to balance the use of weapons.
This weapon would be a counter tool for the Long range/buffing/support stage of a ship battle, forcing ships to evade quickly or move to medium range to get "under the guns".

[Squidslinger Gilder]

I've also been thinking up a new concept for a torpedo boat ship. Codenaming it the Lionfish. It'll have the dual front medium mount firing which I was kinda hoping the Manta would have but didn't. Will make it possible to have it as a torpedo boat with dual firing Barracudas. Maybe make it a sniper hunter. Will have similar regalia as the Goldfish. Still considering that. Would be nice to have some of the frills like the real Lionfish. Just haven't thought up all the component placements and balloon design. Or overall weight and mass other than it should be bulkier than a Goldfish.

[Plasmarobo]

I like the concept of making this have VERY limited pitch and yaw, something like 10 degrees.
Additionally I love that this thing would go off like a mine, and ruin everything near it. Basically dynamic area denial.
But I think what would make this awesome is dynamic arming time. Basically have timer settings on the torpedo. It would add a massive element of skill to get the range/timing settings correct.

I can see this being paired with a merc for devastating power in the correct hands. The gunner would either have to coordinate with the other gunner (gungineer's) torpedo or coordinate with his own by running over to another gun.

Additionally this system would have to be severely ammo limited (one shot, 15 second reload, max 15 second timer, min 5 second timer). Homing would totally break everything (may be mitigated by only homing to spotted targets, but I dislike the idea of fire and forget in this game).

Posting this here instead of the other thread.

[Boarchild]

I like this idea, but I also like the homing idea.

What if it was to home like an old school torpedo, very limited homing as if the ship is not moving very far, it would hit it, make it only be able to home in an arc of let's say 10 degrees. That would give a new dimension to game play where the crew spots an incoming torpedo, and alerts the captain that they have to move in order not to be hit. Make it escapeable. If you run, youäll be fine, but if you're distracted with other things, there is a chance it will hit you.

[JaegerDelta]

its interesting, but im not sure why you posted, or i guess re-posted, to the gameplay section.

[Squidslinger Gilder]

Ammo limited of course but how much may depend on the mount since these are large heavy warheads being fired. Also slow firing speed. I think it would depend on how the weapon launcher design looks. Whether it is a tube design or something more like a huge hwacha with animated tube doors. Either way, it would be neat to see a door or tube opening as the tip of a torpedo comes into view.

Yeah I think any homing would be very minimal if folks wanted one. Hence a magnetic effect if there was one. As it gets near, the torpedo would start to pull slightly towards the ship whether friend or foe. This could also work detrimentally as mines would have a magnetic attraction and you could use mines as a way to shield a ship from torpedoes. The turn would not be quick or sharp. A pilot could avoid it if they see the torpedo coming to start with.

I reposted it here because I see more activity here involving theory crafting as well as Muse chiming in on ideas.

[Moo]

If they are big and slow, and I imagine not very tough, they'd presumably be easy enough to shoot (and blow up)? So you wouldn't need to avoid them always.

[Squidslinger Gilder]

That is just the thing. How easy is it to shoot down mines? I've seen some try it but often times it is preferable to focus on evasion rather than waste time and effort on minesweeping. Even merely hitting a mine is not like dev app where your ship is virtually crippled. You'd have to hit 2-3 before you'd be in serious trouble.

The fact that you can do it, gives a defending ship an option in an emergency as a gunner sees a torpedo about to make impact. But you gotta consider in 2v2 or 3v3 engagements, that if torpedoes are being used, they'll be accompanied by enemy ships or other weapon fire. Sitting still to shoot up torpedoes will not be a viable strategy when you have a Pyra barreling down on you. Plus if long range engagement happens first, you'll have ships with all their gun points shot out before they can shoot down a torpedo.

When you combine it all with tactics, you could have a torpedo boat keeping the opposing team from getting comfortable while your wingman exploits it. Or other strategies. If the torpedoes are deadly enough, even if slow moving, they'll serve a purpose and be enough of a reason for a crew to be on their toes in spotting one incoming.

[Boarchild]

There would be a tactic in taking out the Engines first, then firing a torpedo, and just Watch them sit there, in desperation.. Keeping their Engines down :p

There is also a denial effect, if people camp a Place, you can have them vacate by firing Torpedos at them. Make them move, and herd them closer to somewhere else.

[Serenum]

While the idea may be interesting I think that it would change the meta too much and it would be too difficult to balance.

[Squidslinger Gilder]

While the idea may be interesting I think that it would change the meta too much and it would be too difficult to balance.

Which is exactly what many folks want. They want new weapons and new combinations. The same old loadouts forever get boring.

1.3 changed it some. The cqc game was altered enough where I think we should be seeing a resurgence of some flame based combat, which is good. Also the mines are adding another factor to deal with. This has returned some usefulness back to the gunner class.

The long range game is still being ran by merc/jack. Adding another standard mount weapon won't really change that. But medium mount weapon, that is where possibilities like torpedoes come in. Balancing wouldn't be as bad as you'd think. It would come down to speed, arming time, and power of the weapon just like any other weapon. The only other factor is combinations of the weapon on things like galleons. Jack/Torp combo could potentially be the most devastating combination ever unleashed in the game. But, with slow firing, reload, and potential for the torpedoes to be intercepted...there is the potential for countering it. Not to mention if the opposing team ran their own torpedo boat. The Jack/Torp would have to stay more mobile to be effective since the galleons move so slow that if they sat still firing, there would be the chance enemy torps would tear them up should they miss one, or if they got flanked by the torpedo boat.

That would be something, a light sniper boat drawing attention and fire to get a target spot to allow a fast Torpfish the chance to get in enough range to fire torps from a blind side. All the time using the bait boat as a spotter so the Torpfish could shoot from cover. How about that for your sniping meta!

[RearAdmiralZill]

Weapon mount: Medium
Range: Long
Rate of fire: Slow
Reload: Very Slow
Ammo capacity: 4-6 shots
Primary damage: Piercing
Secondary damage: Explosive

Piercing and explosive? Trololololol.

Seriously though, that's not going to fly by any stretch.

Beyond that, just how slow are we talking here in terms of projectile speed? It couldn't be much slower than flak shots, or it honestly wouldn't do much at range.

[Plasmarobo]

I think it was changed at the end of the thread to perform basically like the mine, only with forward movement and homing.

Personally, I'd like to just see a timed mine with a larger explosion radius that moves forward reasonably slowly.
Would very rarely actually hit, and more is a "Get the fuck out of whatever you are hiding in" sort of weapon. Pure area denial.
Homing is a bad idea. There are too many weapons that are easy to hit with, we don't need more.
I'm a fan of higher power weapons that even the best of the gunners have incredible difficulty with.

[Andrej Peribosky]

Weapon mount: Medium
Range: Long
Rate of fire: Slow
Reload: Very Slow
Ammo capacity: 4-6 shots
Primary damage: Piercing
Secondary damage: Explosive

Piercing and explosive? Trololololol.

Seriously though, that's not going to fly by any stretch.

Beyond that, just how slow are we talking here in terms of projectile speed? It couldn't be much slower than flak shots, or it honestly wouldn't do much at range.

I think speed should be around pyramidion maximum base cruise speed. Maybe kerosene speed.
Range should be the entire map.
The goal is here that the projectile is easy to evade if you see it coming. It is just a deterrent against staying still and sniping.