Messages

1

The Lounge / Re: Community Gets More Toxic With Every Update

« on: May 07, 2015, 01:15:24 am »

Just to point out, Muse posted in another thread that they are gonna start taking a more active role in community moderation so whatever that means.

Chipping in my 2c on the topic. I don't really see too much toxicity in this community compared to say Dota 2 or EVE online, and even then those communities thrive with all the bad apples. Take EVE for example, you have players whose sole purpose is to ruin other peoples days, the 'bad guys' aren't entirely shunned by the community as a whole (save for their victims) so I'm not gonna say that some loud mouthed players are to blame for all the communities problems.

I'm sure Muse would read their feedback and go 'Oh this special little snowflake' Look at this recent update for instance, a few bittervets left and made a ruckus about it. Muse is still going on their design plan and just readjusting the reasonable things with reasonable feedback provided by the reasonable community members.

It's not bad having these bad apples in our community since they can see things which most reasonable players wont be able to see. Keep them but put a leash on the primitive behavior.

2

World / Re: What faction will you fight for?

« on: May 07, 2015, 01:09:12 am »

Definitely Anglea, they kinda remind me of viking/russo raiders. Not much hospitable land to grow crops or raise cattle but highly defensible which would make it more appealing to steal from neighbors. That and their high technology vaults with all those advanced steam goodies.

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Feedback and Suggestions / Re: Novice tools.

« on: May 03, 2015, 07:53:50 am »

Sounds cool, But that definitely should be only applicable to novice status players. Once you 'pass' novice the assist turns off and you should know most of the gun arcs and range by that point. There's still plenty of effects to learn from ammo types and the ships speed/movement after the novices graduate and I guess they come with time too.

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Release Notes / Re: Release 1.4.1 Notes

« on: April 30, 2015, 07:39:59 am »

Awesome release guys, Good to have the notes on all the weapons and ships.

Think I noticed a bug in the character screen not updating properly when changing class.

5

Feedback and Suggestions / Re: Level inflation and "noob problem"

« on: April 28, 2015, 08:50:44 am »

Sorry for the wall of text.

On the tutorial it could be reworked into stages with text and voice since some people seemingly refuse to read;

Have the basic gunning stage which we all know, Explain different ammo gun combos and how the guns should be used and of course encourage players to try them so they can see what is and isn't effective. Explain main role and any back ups that the meta uses.

Second stage would be the engineer, explain tools and what each is used for. Explain basic repair urgency orders, the difference between chem sprays and extinguishers, mallets and spanners, etc. Give them an idea of how battle stations work (Main engi, Gungineer)

Third stage give them the captains overview, let the player decide what ship to bring and what its loadout will be. Explain the crew forms/lobby capabilities (Ship names, recommending crew loatouts, etc. You could then give them the basic flight tutorial and explain pilot tools.

Then you can move onto the basic meta of how a ship should run, maybe the metamidion since it's really simple. What the loadout is and its intended role, what the engineers do, where the gunner should be, how to fly it and what basic tools and ammos to bring for that ship. Give them a spin on combat maneuvers and then let them be thrown into the game. You could throw some reading materials at them too, recommended forums posts, official dev guides, etc.

Award achievements  but no experience so players remain first level. Give them some virtual swag like the cap and hairstyles or whatever, probably dyes to colour code them better and attach them to each of the achievements or tasks so newbies are encouraged to finish the tutorial, give them some form of motivation.

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Feedback and Suggestions / Re: Level inflation and "noob problem"

« on: April 28, 2015, 08:07:14 am »

@ Crank,

Yeah I can see your point, I guess it's more a social problem than a mechanic or gameplay problem. Apart from a sorting system like a vet/competitive lobby or a social system like kicks/block parties I'm not sure what else to suggest.

@ Maxy,

Totally missed the point there. Not angry about being called a newbie (I accept it since my playtime and experience is limited compared to everyone in this thread) I'm just sick of the 'broadstroke' paintbrush approach to newbies, I can see why it happens. Granted I'm not at the level of some of the players in this thread so I can't see all of the problems, and Crank is decent enough to point out the things I missed in regards to bad apples.

Also I don't really see your points being parroted. I'm pretty sure you're just complaining about the problem and blaming it on newer players. We should really be working together to try and suggest something to alleviate the issue somewhat.

@ DJ,

All good, takes more than a bittervet to throw me off. I do play EVE after all, tolerance to them is pretty high. xD The only difficulty encountered is the insta block which kinda cripples exposure to the better players. That's the gold right there, vets.

Back on topic though, the point made on tying novice to each class would help substantially and raising the limit from 8 to 12 or higher so players remain in novice with the restrictions enforced for longer periods. You could also have a forced tutorial with minimum tasks completed to proceed so it makes sure everyone goes through it.
 
On the interface and mechanics;
To help explain how ships work to newer captains and crews add a description of what its basic role in the team is. Basic strategies, crew stations and setups, etc. in the ship window when we click on names. Also a description and basic loadouts for each class would help, with light meta injected. The text pop ups mid match kind of help but plenty of newbies don't read them, expanding them probably won't help unless you make the damage icons obscenely noticeable so it forces players to solve the issues at hand. There should be a flight course for newer captains to try out so they can get a feel for ship movements/capabilities, try that out with each ship and maybe tailor it to each ship.

Right now if I play gunner I just look at the guns on ship and choose ammo accordingly most newbie captains aren't sure what works. As an engineer? Spanner/Mallet and Chemspray so I can practice chem cycles. I'm not so sure on the novice captaining as a good idea (this is where patient and experienced vets come in handy) but I guess it helps sort the gems from the filth.

On the social side;
Don't anyone say 'Oh we got YouTube for that'. No, no we don't, watching a game being played by someone else and actually playing it yourself are two different things. Sure you can learn all the tips and read about it on the old forums and the new, but if you can't use it effectively because of small details you missed or meta, it won't mean a thing unless you can pull it off effectively.
I've watched the videos both the basic overviews and the competitive matches but playing the game is something else, You can't pause mid match to look up most effective ammos for each gun, sure you'll remember some of the basic novice locked guns and the ammos which work well for them, like everything it comes with time and dedication.

Really the only other changes would be how lobbies work, vet lobbies and vets hosting 'Block parties' so all the bads can be blocked into oblivion. Forcing tutorials on newer players (I didn't try but I wonder if you can invite a crew and try out the different things on the ship as each class)


Final note to all, I'd be stoked to play with you guys, if you'll have me of course, and I promise I won't hijack boats or jump around uselessly (most of the time) =D Lobbies of Icarus can be fun but I paid to play this game not sit in matchmaking talking to random people on the internet.

7

Feedback and Suggestions / Re: Level inflation and "noob problem"

« on: April 27, 2015, 09:37:17 am »

Newb player, reporting for dooty sir! o7

On a serious note I can see how some people get easily frustrated and I do agree with you Crafeksterty. On that I can't provide any new suggestions apart from a separate league for higher level/vet players. Or a lobby similar to how novices have their specific bracket lobby.

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Feedback and Suggestions / Re: Level inflation and "noob problem"

« on: April 27, 2015, 04:30:55 am »

this ignorant implication that the whole majority of the vet haven't at some stage tried to teach every noob they encountered... only to be met with retards who don't know simple commands like forward, stay and BIG RED THING MEANS MOVE YOUR ASS AND REACT!

How about, newer players learn like every other newb in every other competitive community. They git gud and learn by themselves out of sight of vets.
And when they demonstrate an average level of competence, vets bother actually teaching them without having their patience and time wasted.


because frankly? Teaching those I deem worth my time and under my wing and under my clan tag? Much less stressful than some random yob who I would actually punch, if I ever encounter them in a IRL team-based activity. Especially if money (and the quantity of) is involved in the quality of the general result.

Right, and you 'got gud' I assume? Your high and mighty opinion shouldn't weigh on people who are just starting out. I'm pretty sure CA's should have a heavier opinion in the matter with how the newer player system works. I'm with you guys on the trolls though that doesn't mean I support an entire noobicide because of a few bad apples.

I'm on my way to 'gitting gud' it's just difficult to get a good match especially in the novice pool and I'm not ignorant to the way vets treat newer players. I get that treatment BEFORE the match even starts because I'm 'too low level' or 'not enough matches, not worth my time, got back to novice scrub *insta blocked*' That attitude needs to crawl in a hole and die. I can seriously count on my hand how many level 35+ players I've played against. 2 of which are in this thread.

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The Docks / Re: Become a Devil Today! Are you Devilish Enough?

« on: April 26, 2015, 11:45:55 pm »

Haha as of today I got level 6 in all classes.

Should consider joining no? =D

10

Community Events / Re: The Teaching Tournament!

« on: April 26, 2015, 09:17:54 pm »

I'd like to be apart of this as a pupil if that's okay =D

I want to get better at this game and hopefully this will give me the break I need!

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Feedback and Suggestions / Re: Level inflation and "noob problem"

« on: April 26, 2015, 09:10:45 pm »

I'm pretty much with this thread although the only downside I can see is the massive hit to fun newbies like me will get. I enjoy hoping into advanced games (for me it's just another match =D)
But some of the opinions in this thread are a bit concerning. Matches played does show dedication but if you're a dedicated troll or hell bent on playing your way you could easily play 1000+ games blissfully ignorant of the meta or learn any nice hints and tips. Also look at it later, all the vets now who have say 2000+ or so would be an even higher number while the novices would finally get to 1000 games so we would essentially be in the same spot since they would lack the experience. That bar would just keep rising? No?
Wins are pretty much irrelevant as long as you're having fun and if that means playing matches regardless of opponents K/D ratios and what not then that's got to be a good thing, means more play time which is what you guys want right?

I do have a suggestion that could apply to the novice bracket in particular,

I was thinking something with the commendation system because right now it's just a virtual stroke, it literally means nothing. It could be reworked with three different options to choose from which represent a different opinion on the player being commended. Obviously these would be from higher level players playing with novices who've decided to join advanced games. Let the players weed out the weak so to speak, if you're tired of Muse's methods.
Have the current thumbs up commendation which basically tells the player they've done a good job. Doesn't provide any positives apart from being a nice pat on the back and letting the novice player know they did good in the advanced match and maybe they could play another one.

The second commendation is the thumbs down commendation and that would basically ensure the player is stuck in novice matches for some time (1hr or so)

Players that ignore commending a novice would have no say but they would narrow the votes cast down. I guess that is the third option

The commendation result could be the majority commendations voted.

On the levels issue I'd say an overall reduction to exp rewarded for wins and matches played for everyone. Definitely tone down the achievement exp.

If you have 1000 matches and you play only to troll, which takes at least 500 hours...



It 'may' be less fun for greenhorns (although I don't think it will), but it 'will' be far less frustraiting for everyone else, especially dedicated high-lvl players.

To have fun you have to play with an enemy of similar level. K/D ratio is the stupidest way to determine it (in GOIO), but it is 'some' way.

About current recommendation system being pointless - true. Discussed. Devs don't care / they don't see it as priority.

I don't think another recommendation mechanic is necessary, especially when greenhorns can go into the advanced games anyway and this new system is supposed to allow us to remove them and put them into novice matches for an hour. If you want to do that - just add votekick and we'll be happy.

No it generally isn't as fun as learning and playing. I mean the it's bad not knowing the mechanics of the game and not enjoying it but then it's much worse having people who know the mechanics and not bother showing people how to play.

On the troll example. I also said bad players that just want to play their way. Kinda like trolls. It wouldn't surprise me if we had that happen, you've got people who like to play game because they're entertaining, while some people may not be good they play because they enjoy it.

If you're worried about the dedicated high level players why not teach more newer and inexperienced players who are dedicated to grow that part of the community? If anything set up a separate lobby for the higher tier players that novices or mid ranks can't access unless invited. I myself want to get to that level of gaming in GoI but every time I'm in lobby higher level players refuse to play with me on the same ship simply because I have a low match count or level.

How do newbies get higher match count and level if we're playing Lobbies of Icarus all day? (I live in Australia and the community here is almost non existent. especially since the sudden drop in Japanese/SEA players, so staying up in ungodly hours on my spare time waiting to play only to be refused time and time again is quite irritating)

12

Feedback and Suggestions / Re: Level inflation and "noob problem"

« on: April 23, 2015, 08:38:44 am »

I'm pretty much with this thread although the only downside I can see is the massive hit to fun newbies like me will get. I enjoy hoping into advanced games (for me it's just another match =D)
But some of the opinions in this thread are a bit concerning. Matches played does show dedication but if you're a dedicated troll or hell bent on playing your way you could easily play 1000+ games blissfully ignorant of the meta or learn any nice hints and tips. Also look at it later, all the vets now who have say 2000+ or so would be an even higher number while the novices would finally get to 1000 games so we would essentially be in the same spot since they would lack the experience. That bar would just keep rising? No?
Wins are pretty much irrelevant as long as you're having fun and if that means playing matches regardless of opponents K/D ratios and what not then that's got to be a good thing, means more play time which is what you guys want right?

I do have a suggestion that could apply to the novice bracket in particular,

I was thinking something with the commendation system because right now it's just a virtual stroke, it literally means nothing. It could be reworked with three different options to choose from which represent a different opinion on the player being commended. Obviously these would be from higher level players playing with novices who've decided to join advanced games. Let the players weed out the weak so to speak, if you're tired of Muse's methods.
Have the current thumbs up commendation which basically tells the player they've done a good job. Doesn't provide any positives apart from being a nice pat on the back and letting the novice player know they did good in the advanced match and maybe they could play another one.

The second commendation is the thumbs down commendation and that would basically ensure the player is stuck in novice matches for some time (1hr or so)

Players that ignore commending a novice would have no say but they would narrow the votes cast down. I guess that is the third option

The commendation result could be the majority commendations voted.

On the levels issue I'd say an overall reduction to exp rewarded for wins and matches played for everyone. Definitely tone down the achievement exp.

13

General Discussion / Re: Fellow Ex-Gunners Of Icarus Lend Me Your Ears!

« on: April 23, 2015, 08:15:58 am »

Has anyone tried mentioning having say a limit on specific ammo types? Say I dunno 300-400 rounds per ammo slot. Gunners would clearly have the bigger advantage here.
You could also limit the ship but give it more along the lines of 600 or so per gun on board.

Metamidion ran out of gat? Guess you can start doing broadsides from the portside. Mobulas would work interestingly. I think the Squids and Goldfish would suffer most with this suggestion.

Sounds pretty basic but it could help flesh out gunners more and provide more opportunities to learn how different ammo works for newer players.

14

General Discussion / Re: Fellow Ex-Gunners Of Icarus Lend Me Your Ears!

« on: March 20, 2015, 07:40:54 am »

I admit it does feel somewhat biased as far as the need for a gunner. But then that depends very much on what ship you happen to be on with what guns. There are guns that excel with one ammo type, but then there are others that do with many types...this is where having a gunner can make a decent ship into a more efficient one.

When maxing out gunner, I fully admit that I had help. As in, I play most with my fiance, Alistair, whom of which favors pilot. This was a huge advantage. We would work together, he comparing ship builds and I working with him on plays. And with us working together, it made it so that even ships where three engis are seen more often (like squid) he insisted that I stay gunner to utilize every gun he brought. We have done some crazy stunts working together, and I got my max levels with this class. As a result, I got good enough to the point that others request me staying gunner. The downside is that Alistair doesn't like playing without me gunning for him since we have such good synergy together.

While not a very satisfying reply, I suggest to a gunner, if you can, buddy up with a pilot. Play together long enough and you'd be surprised what you can accomplish.

Also, I like the idea of more hats. Hats are awesome.

But even better would be more ammo types. More ammo types means more need for them and more need means a gunner is a must. I'm all kinds of alright with this.

I see your point with how you work in a team with Hubby, but more ammo doesn't mean more demand for the class if all classes have access to it. It just means Heavy and Burst round for engineers will change to the "Ammo of the month" Instead if you shuffle ammo between classes or provide something else to fill that single slot it should bring gunners back into competitive perspective.

Gotta love drunk posting. Also just gonna salute you because the cider tells me too...

15

General Discussion / Re: Fellow Ex-Gunners Of Icarus Lend Me Your Ears!

« on: March 19, 2015, 08:21:42 am »

Hey guys I'll start off and admit I read up to page 10 and then thought that maybe what we're dealing with isn't simply a mechanics issue but possibly a social issue too..

The Engineer should be the default class players get. That way when they quickjoin a match they can learn the basics of how to play, using and switching tools, getting accustomed to the "slang" used for certain ship fits/weapons/etc. and also the priority of repairs on a ship. Then the next step is the gunner to learn the finer points of using weapons, seeing what they're effective against and at what ranges, how the ships speed and momentum affect bullets and what effect the ammo types provide. Then the last step is the Pilots which dictate ship positioning and in the case of a captain pilot the overall strategy of the boat and guidance for the crew.

So let's start out with the pilot class. I'll provide two examples of what I see;
First point is the tool under the piloting category that the pilot will almost never use because it isn't useful for them and they will almost exclusively be on the helm steering the platform. I'm talking about the spyglass, it naturally grew as a responsibility for the other crew to spot and mark enemies so the gunner can get to work promptly dismantling them.
The next point relates to how I've seen some of the Russian crews of yore manage their ships. The gunner would generally be the captain playing the game a la time crisis (Think arcade "on-rails" shooter) and this was surprisingly funny and effective.

The Pilot's responsibility whether they're captain or not is to provide the window for the gunner to deal damage with the hull mounted guns. Now the gunner should be glued to the main gun or moving between guns.

Next the Engineer. Which I have some experience with. Mainly keeping the ship in running order so the gunner doesn't suddenly lose arc because the balloon popped or one of the turning engines got blown and caused  the ship to spin out and ultimately lose the gunners arcs.

The engineer spots for the gunner and pilots to position and battle enemy vessels. The engineer gets all their usual role tools they also get the one ammo type this is where I will propose a change. While having two assigned to different components of the ship generally one will have enough down time during buff/chem cycles to don another weapon and possibly prepare for a bifecta, or even if the main engineer gets time a trifecta, this helps immensely with damage output.

Now what if we provide an item that would similarly be useless for the gunner to use since he's always gonna be planted on a gun which provides a little bit of convenience for the engineers and helmsman. Give them a flintlockesque pistol the gungineers could use to slow down opposing crews (not ships) movement speed and possibly interrupt certain mounted actions. This provides the convenience of covering blindspots (somewhat) and affecting enemy crews minimally enough to have an effect while not making the gunner useless and reinforcing their role as the heavy weapons that hurt.

The item could cause a noticeable but not completely debilitating affect on crews movement speed (Since engineers mostly move around to pilots who rarely move around) It could have a small interrupt effect on mounted crews (gunners and helmsman and any gungineers) Give it one shot then a slight reload this way it's not an auto spam and if you have two it's likely to interrupt some steering/chem/buff cycles. The worst that could happen is 2 engineers and the pilots use it simultaneously which  makes the ship vulnerable to being outmaneuvered and having cycles miss or out of tune slightly. The aiming shouldn't be super accurate but also not a massive spread so that you'll get a hit'n'miss from mediumish distances and maybe a more profound effect up close.

I'm against scaling passive boosts since that can easily spiral out of control and make it more frustrating for newer players to join and doing arbitrary cuts on classes right now doesn't seem to be good. The only other thing I would recommend is shuffling who can use what ammo but I'm not sure that's a super idea either.

It's just a small idea but let me know what you guys think.