A Suggestion for the Echidna Light Flak Cannon

[Lieutenant Noir]

Okay, as much as I don’t like the idea that the Flak needs to kill in two clips (Mainly because the time between armor breaks was the moment where engagements went brawl or disables start hitting for me).
I think I’ll go with it because the enemy hitbox is relatively big at mid range and most of you agree that the Flak is pretty easy to shoot.

So… onto the calculations!!!


Galleon Health (1400) / Explosive modifier (1.4) = 1000 Explosive damage

Damage for two full clips 1000 / 2 = 500 Explosive damage per clip

If taken into account that 2 full clips would kill a galleon
Each clip would need to do Greater than or equal to 500 explosive damage
This would mean that you would be bringing back the Current Flak’s ability to one clip a Mobula (Considering 500 x 1.4 = 700 hull damage)............      use that suggestion as you will   
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New suggested Flak stats!!

Total explosive damage for a Normal (4 shot) clip = 520 explosive
with each shot being 130 explosive damage

Bear in mind that 1 clip means 1 armor break (since it's an explosive explosive weapon keeping in mind the reload time)

Greased rounds:
(Total clip damage: 520)  w/ Explosive modifier of 1.4 = 728 hull damage
Increase clip size to 5
Decrease Arming Time
Increase rate of fire

Charged Rounds:
(Total clip damage: 507) w/ Explosive modifier of 1.4 = 709.8 hull damage
Decrease clip size to 3
No decrease in Arming Time
Decrease rate of fire but load next clip quicker

Heatsink rounds:
(Total clip damage: 539.5)  w/ Explosive modifier of 1.4 = 755.3 hull damage
Increase clip size to 5
Decrease Arming Time
No change in rate of fire

Normal Rounds:
(Total clip damage: 520) w/ Explosive modifier of 1.4 = 728 hull damage
Clip size 4
No decrease in Arming Time
No change in rate of fire


In terms of keeping the 5/3 ratio of Direct to Aoe damage,
130 / 8 = 16.25
16.25 x 5 = 81.25
16.25 x 3 = 48.75

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Honestly it would be easier to go
Direct damage = 80
Aoe damage = 50
and you kinda keep the ratio~

[Mr.Bando]

You may want to rethink having the mini flak destroy a ship within 2 armour breaks cos the gun is a light weapon and some ships have more than one light weapon slot that share the same arcs. I remember reducing a spire to burning debris in one armour break with a hades + dual flak mobula. They never stood a chance. That was before the spire HP buff. A 2.5 clip of mini flak would be a reasonable amount of punishment most ships should endure. More if they lack speed to evade.

[Daft Loon]

The galleons hull takes around 7s to rebuild with a spanner.
The current light flak using charged rounds can 2 clip a galleon in 7.9s, buffed greased takes 6.4s.
In practice a lot of other factors are added in but with a slow engineer and a fast gunner it should be possible to take out a galleon inside 1 armor break.
Compared to that double greased banshees take 9.5s and double burst artemis takes 16.3s, greased mortar takes 4.7s but needs every single shot to land, burst mortar can afford 2/14 misses but takes 7.3s. Compare the projectile speed of 350 for charged light flak and 100 for greased mortar.
Charged and burst light flak can also 1 clip the mobula as is.
Pyra, Junker, Mobula and galleon can all die in 1 armor break to the current light flak and the pyra and junker can't rely on arming time to save them any more than 10% hull.
Squid, Fish and Spire probably shouldn't die in 1 break because breaking thier armor is so easy.

[Byron Cavendish]

A proper galleon will have a minimum of two spanners, if not 3. The armour takes long enough to go down that you can call a full tank well in advance. Every galleon should average 3-4 rebuilds per death.

[Daft Loon]

A proper galleon will have a minimum of two spanners, if not 3. The armour takes long enough to go down that you can call a full tank well in advance. Every galleon should average 3-4 rebuilds per death.

That is true, although a good light flak can deliver 700 out of 1400 hull damage in 2s + travel time which is a threat to all but the best tanking.

[Lieutenant Noir]

The current Light Flak has capabilities in two clipping ships in two armor breaks so all I would be doing would be making it more able to two clip/kill in two armor breaks.
I would say that there is always possibilities in missing shots with the inconsistencies of shots as I mentioned before.
It also has Arming time and relatively slow projectile speed to predict the shots.
Not to mention there is always inconsistencies that happen in the time of that second armor break.
Also adding a second Flak means sacrificing disable potential from an Artemis, or Banshee.

While you could argue that it would make the Heavy Flak less effective...
The Heavy Flak kills all ships in one clip/armor break, except the Galleon in two clips/armor breaks
The suggested Light Flak would kill the Junker, Pyra, and Mobula in one clip/armor break but everything else in two clips/armor breaks

[PixelatedVolume]

I think flak should be buffed vs. balloons and engines, to give it a little more utility.  It's kill range works, but it could use a little tweaking.

[Kamoba]

I think flak should be buffed vs. balloons and engines, to give it a little more utility.  It's kill range works, but it could use a little tweaking.

This would just make is a duplicate of the banshee.

[Dementio]

You could increase its AoE radius.

[BlackenedPies]

^

[MightyKeb]

Can I be informed on what  AoE does aside from doing component damage while hitting the ship?

[BlackenedPies]

At 50% of the radius it deals 100% of the secondary damage. After that the damage decays linearly to 20% at the edge of the radius.

On average it would deal more damage to everything.

[Lieutenant Noir]

I think flak should be buffed vs. balloons and engines, to give it a little more utility.  It's kill range works, but it could use a little tweaking.

You could increase its AoE radius.

-If I'm guessing this right you would increase the Flaks chances of breaking armor because it would be spreading the total Explosive damage to more around the ship.
Kinda like how a Buffed Burst Mortar can finish off a Pyramidion by itself because it is capable of breaking armor relatively easily by spreading the damage over more armor.

-If you increase the Aoe radius you also make it so that you increase the chances of hitting secondary damage farther away from the hull while the Flak is out of Arming Time (Maybe even hit the Balloon).
Kinda like how (because the Aoe radius of the Lumberjack is so high) you can kinda still pop a balloon if you hit armor with a Lumberjack.

-You also increase the chances of breaking components
If you hit the Balloon component enough times with the burst damage from Explosive, you can even pop the Balloon
You might even increase the chances of causing fires
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You would essentially get a Burst Flak with normal rate of fire
-While I do kinda like these changes, the Flak still wouldn't be very good at Breaking Armor, Popping Balloons, Breaking components, or starting fires compared to other Disabling guns.
-It would be nice but other weapons would be able to do the job at a much more reasonable rate.
-In my opinion, the only way to increase its utility would be to switch its Secondary or Primary damage type for something that causes fires, disables, pops balloons, or breaks armor.
Because it's a Flak, I don't know if I would be okay with that idea considering it has a very popular big brother that brings pride to the "Flak" family name.

[Dementio]

-While I do kinda like these changes, the Flak still wouldn't be very good at Breaking Armor, Popping Balloons, Breaking components, or starting fires compared to other Disabling guns.

None of these are jobs that the Light Flak should exceed in or even be good at, so of course it won't be good at those things.

Last SCS there were a few Light Flaks and I think they did rather well.

[Lieutenant Noir]

None of these are jobs that the Light Flak should exceed in or even be good at, so of course it won't be good at those things.

@_@