Default Ammo Type [As a selection]

[Crafeksterty]

Ok, so i was thinking of ideas and suggestions on how to make the gunner more viable. And i noticed something.
It is going to sound dumb, but hear me out.





The pilot And engineer have 2 ammo types.
The gunner has 4.


Remove the default ammo type, and instead make it a selection. Now you have...


The pilot And engineer have 1 ammo types.
The gunner has 3.





This severily limits the choice of ammo type for the pilot and engineer much like how gunner and engineer have little pilot tool choice, and gunner and pilot for the engineer. Bring in the AUTORELOAD mechanic that was once tested, for all the classes (So it is no longer a one class specific thing that ruins a bit of the emergent system in Goio AND makes it so that the weapon that was used reloads the last persons ammo type) and you have made gunners more valuable.


I feel like this was suggested before.
Please tell me the drawbacks and why this is a bad thing. Cus i can only think of the goodness of it.

[Piemanlives]

This has in fact been suggested before, I won't contribute to the conversation because I have nothing useful to say about the idea at this moment, what I will say is that it has been shut down before, but for everyone who follows after my post, give it some serious thought alright?

[Thomas]

I think it's an interesting idea. Default ammo actually isn't all that bad, but it's often trumped by the gunner ammo types. However, it's usually a better choice in certain situations than the single ammo type you brought as an engineer. Lets say all you brought was incendiary, and the enemy is doing a great job of keeping their chem spray up. In this situation, incendiary is worse than normal. So you'd want to just load normal. Without that option, it'd be very difficult for engineers to be effective gunners more of the time.


The downside is that you'd have to load up your gun at the start of the match, and then what happens when you're not on the gun when the reload finishes? Does it stick in the ammo you selected, or does it stay empty?

Overall I kind of like, but not a whole lot.

[Crafeksterty]

Also, i did say that it would sevirily limit the ammo choices for the engineer.
n'
You forgot the concept of the auto reload mechanic.

[Thomas]

Well the auto-reload currently works by loading in the default ammo when you're not actively on the gun. With default ammo now being a selection, what should it load at the start of the match? And would they have to change the auto-reload to automatically put in the last ammo type that was in it, or could you 'cheat' the system by jumping off the gun and letting it auto-reload normal ammo?

[Mattilald Anguisad]

Crafek meant the mechanis when the ammo that was selected at the start of the reload sticks instead the ammo that was selected at the end of reload cycle.
It would mean guns start with default ammo and after that keeps ammo you selected after that.

[Thomas]

Ah, you're right. D; I totally missed that part in the OP. My apologies.

[Crafeksterty]

No one has inputs?

Add the concept of one ammo type for engineer and pilot, and 3 for gunner.
With the added preloading autoloading mechaninc that was once in the dev app.

No inputs?

[Captain Smollett]

I think everyone knows the solution to make gunners more appealing is to remove the buff hammer's ability to make a flat increase on gun damage.

This however is wildly unpopular in certain circles and likely never to be implemented.

With the current reload mechanics, the proposed solutuon is actually a buff to engineers as they can hit reload and then proceed to do whatever they want.

[HamsterIV]

Giving two types of ammo to engineers under the current game system would negate the need for gunners in many instances. Right now you need a gunner to either fire multiple weapons with different optimal ammo, or fire one weapon with appropriate ammo for different ranges. An engineer with two ammo types can handle two different weapons or operate a multi range weapon with almost the same efficiency as the current gunner.

For making a 2 ammo engineer/ 4 ammo gunner system to work, Muse would have to rejigger the whole weapon and and ammo systems in a way where choosing 4 ammo types provides a significant advantage over choosing 2.

[GreyTea]

@Hamster i think you should reread his post, he is classing default as an ammo type and suggesting remove it completely so gunners are more effective and engineer pilots have to rely on the ammo they brought..


 however i think for this to work perhaps default or standard could be a clip choice? very nice idea though

[HamsterIV]

My mistake, I read that the wrong way around.

As I read it now the default ammo falls to the last person who reloaded the gun. A gun would never default to vanilla unless a player chose to bring vanilla in the first place. So the mechanic where a person has to stay on his gun to ensure ammo choice sticks would be gone.

It could argue that this mechanic strengthens gunners since they are the only type of player that has nothing better to do than stick on a gun, and its removal would ultimately weaken the gunner class. However that is probably me arguing for argument's sake.

After I read it correctly I don't really see anything bad with the proposal aside from it being different from the current system.

[Dutch Vanya]

I think everyone knows the solution to make gunners more appealing is to remove the buff hammer's ability to make a flat increase on gun damage.

This however is wildly unpopular in certain circles and likely never to be implemented.

With the current reload mechanics, the proposed solutuon is actually a buff to engineers as they can hit reload and then proceed to do whatever they want.

What about the majority of players who don't run ships with meticulously organized buffing crews? The reason gunners aren't popular is in most cases: repair abilities > ammo variety.

[Spud Nick]

Gunners should be able to deal more damage than engineers and engineers should repair better than gunners.

[Crafeksterty]

Basicaly what this does is it forces the gunner to actualy run around, take a lap on the ship and place those ammo types that will put those guns in an advantage.

It does not buff gunners, as much as it takes away from engineers and pilots. Weapons like the mine launcher, artemis, flamer, hades and maybe some other are going to rely on a gunner being able to change the gun, while other classes are limited to work with  one all around asumed standard ammo type for those guns that are prefered to be changed.

There are still weapons where people prefer only one ammo type. Like the hwacha with the heavy clip. Place an engineer with heavy clip on that hwacha with the new concept and you only do 15 rockets of explosive instead of the difference of 20. Engineers and pilots will still be useful to the guns if they choose correctly, but gunners will have a better purpose because of the limits that pilots and engineers now have.

This fixes a bit the role of a gunner, doesnt buff it. But makes it more so. Add in potentialy new ammo types or ammo type overhaul for the future, all of a sudden. Gunners dont seem that useless.


The goal is to place the gunner in a more valuable position.