1.3.5 Balance Changes

[awkm]

artemis spam is still pretty much death in pug matches.

Grumble.  Artemis should still be viable so I don't want to do too much DPS or muzzle nerfing.  Yaw speed will make the gun feel crap to use but still maintain its destructive output given some additional preparation time.  Other suggestions welcome.

[Imagine]

artemis spam is still pretty much death in pug matches.

Grumble.  Artemis should still be viable so I don't want to do too much DPS or muzzle nerfing.  Yaw speed will make the gun feel crap to use but still maintain its destructive output given some additional preparation time.  Other suggestions welcome.

I will say that hitting nimblers ships like squids at a distance while they're moving is a lot more difficult, but triple artemis mobula absolutely destroyed galleon/spire/pyra. (And once again, pug match, opposing captains being lvl 3-5)

I can see the changes being a fine deterrent for one artemis, but that was never really the problem... it was usually double and especially triple artemis spams that became overbearing.

I'm not sure if this is a route anyone would want to take but... all I can think of is to put in some sort of diminishing returns for having multiple types of the same gun?

[The Djinn]

Other suggestions welcome.

I'll reiterate my previous suggestion of decreasing the downward arc and adding an arming time to the projectile then. I'd probably change things to make the gun's primary shatter damage and its secondary explosive. This would do two major things.

Firstly, flying at the top of the skybox to exploit the huge downward angle becomes less possible, as ships will be able to simply slip underneath you. Making the Artemis have a tremendous horizontal range but narrow vertical range allows height counterplay while making it a dominant force in the hands of a captain who can match altitudes.

Secondly, adding an arming time and making the Shatter damage the primary makes the gun a disabler/hull killer at range, but limits it to simply disabling at close range: this gives an obvious counterplay (fly close), while allowing the Artemis ship to disable engines to regain their distance. The gun remains effective in its primary role (disabling) even at close range, but isn't the end-all of versatility that it is at medium/long range.

Just thoughts, of course.

[Captain Smollett]

Currently secondary damage has aoe while primary doesn't.  A change that drastic would alter the soul of The weapon too much.

The shot still travels significantly faster than hwacha so there's room to play there. 

Finding a way to reduce its damage vs armor would allow the gun to keep its primary function with less of its undesirable latent all purposeness.

[The Djinn]

Currently secondary damage has aoe while primary doesn't.  A change that drastic would alter the soul of The weapon too much.

I'm not convinced about that (I'd keep the AoE on the primary damage for this theoretical change...it would just arm with direct Explosive damage), but I will grant you that it would be a drastic change.

Finding a way to reduce its damage vs armor would allow the gun to keep its primary function with less of its undesirable latent all purposeness.

The issue is that Shatter damage is good against both hull and components. Without changing the damage type it's hard to alter that.

[Crafeksterty]

The yaw speed as a drawback is to fight versus reaction. Making it less likely to be effective on ships that whip by quickly.

I havent seen or played yett with the changes on actual competetiveness or pub games. But i am willing to believe that ide feel safer. But first, i must confirm it.

[Sammy B. T.]

The issue is that Shatter damage is good against both hull and components. Without changing the damage type it's hard to alter that.

Shatter does .2 damage to armor.

[The Djinn]

Shatter does .2 damage to armor.

...derp.

Got my damage types completely confused for a moment there.

[Captain Smollett]

At 55 armor damage per shot the 24 from shatter makes up half the armor damage.

Admittedly on paper the number seems quite small however times 6 times 5 that number becomes huge.

[Frogger]

All other points aside, I'm really enjoying the visual effect of the lowered muzzle speed. It looks like you're actually shooting a missile, as opposed to a jet of compressed air.

[Squidslinger Gilder]

One thing that isn't noted on those changes is that the CP caps changed from 200 seconds to 100 seconds.

IMO, this is far too quick. Before it helped speed up CP and make matches a bit more intense but now it feels like fighting over scraps. With 100 seconds it isn't about getting to the next point first but getting 2 points ahead first and having a ship stall the other point long enough to prevent them from gaining much.

Art feels fine. It is proving to be a very challenging weapon for people to utilize and one which is heavily affected by ship lateral movement. I faced a few ships with full art builds and they could only manage to land a 1/4th of their shots against an evasive flier. The lesser aoe effect helped this more. If there is any tuning needed then I say bump up the speed a tad but keep the aoe reduced.

Think we're going to have some complaints about arts being nerfed but it doesn't feel faceroll good anymore. You have to put effort into it.

[awkm]

@Gilder.

That's a bug.  should be fixed momentarily.

[Wundsalz]

@Gilder.

That's a bug.  should be fixed momentarily.

momentarily as in within this week? This bug could very well ruin the long planned Aerodrome tournament which is supposed to start this saturday.

Edit:

artemis spam is still pretty much death in pug matches.

Grumble.  Artemis should still be viable so I don't want to do too much DPS or muzzle nerfing.  Yaw speed will make the gun feel crap to use but still maintain its destructive output given some additional preparation time.  Other suggestions welcome.

What makes the artemis powerful are:
- the extremely wide field of operation (both with regards to the turning angles as well as the distance)
- very strong disabling power
- decent hull damage

nerfing the artemis on any of these layers alone should be sufficient to get the artemis back along the line with the other weapons.
I personally wouldn't mind the gun to be either less powerful when it comes to disabling equipment OR to completely get rid of the explosive damage. The insane field of operation alone would ensure that it stays a viable pick nevertheless.

I dislike the idea of reducing the turning speed of the artemis. It's quite low already and having to lift and move the mouse repetitively in order to point at the stuff one wants to hit isn't a fun mechanic.

[awkm]

@wundsalz

As in, 2 minutes after I posted that it's been fixed.

You'll be fine int he aerodome.

[Wundsalz]

Nice to hear that. Thank you!