Spawn system feedback 1.3.4

[Byron Cavendish]

That's why I prefer dijornos

[awkm]

Fuuuu... okay forget about meatballs for a second.  We had a pizza (old spawn) and people wanted a pizza with toppings, maybe even a cheese filled crust.  Delivery, delivery messed up, we're putting the pie back in the oven.  Done.

Here are some more examples of what's going on in other maps:

Scrap on the Dunes



Canyons

Sorry, not pretty anymore.  Top and bottom are teams.  There are no initial spawns so randomly selected of the bottom and top.  The two gray dots are neutral so both teams can spawn there after death.  I've heard both good and bad things about it.  Good that is helps blue push north more easily.  Bad because it allows people to spawn behind you and etc... Maybe i'll just make the two middle ones eitehr all blue, all red, or one red one blue?  Any thoughts?



Fjords

Another hotly contested map.  It skews heavily towards the right because there's actually not too much room on the west for players to move into.  I might think about cutting out the west part of the map a little bit to make the map more square.  For this patch, I will only touch spawns so don't worry abotu the map bounds changing any time soon.  Just wanted to put it out there.

Blue and red dots are initial spawns.  3v3 is similar.




@chango

Well, that certainly doesn't make our lives easy now does it?  We do realize that and yeah, it's always a gamble.  Oh well.

[Captain Smollett]

Please don't cut out parts of the fjords map.

What if spawn choices were random, as you could only choose half of them at any time.

Sounds like a meatball pizza to me.

Is there definitely no chance for proximity to shut down spawn points?

[awkm]

Proximity and randomized subset are both options but will not make it in for hot fix.  We'll surely keep it mind, though.

No cutting for now, but if it's a core part of gameplay I'll need to reevaluate the hot zones and scrimmages to make it more balanced.  Maybe it's balanced the way it already is.  These things matter most for competitive play and you know Muse has no business in competitive leagues   Any comment on how the west is used in competitive.  I saw snipe camping up there a while back.

[Captain Smollett]

It's a very risky place to snipe from and also has a back door to the base via the south.  I think it adds to the richness of available strategies on the map.

[Tropo]

i also vote no to cutting up fjords

is that scrap in the dev app like that i would love to test that out

[Hekkthor]

Stop that pizzametaphor, I'm just getting hungry. Btw I prefer Steak grilled on the barrel of a carronade, with the smell of gunpowder after an intense battle in the mountains of the angleans, thats how real men eat their steak.
I hated this System from the very beginning. I started GoI yesterday, totally unaware of the update and it's contents. I started a game with and against some guys I didn't know. We killed one, and I was going for the other ship, thinking that I got all the time in the world. You could imagine what happened. That’s the point the most of us got, many tactics are useless now or getting you into unexpected big trouble. We all worked hard on our skills, as someone said before. We LOVE new stuff, but this is a change in the main gameplay, not an addition. Nobody likes to see his skills being useless, especially as a captain. You said before that its now easier for less experienced crews and captains to kill a better one. Thats right and thats the major thing I would complain about. We all developed ideas how to deal with every possible enemy loadout and now... but we heard enough about the update, hotfix is coming and one of the best parts of this game are the devs and their handling of the players. Thumbs up to the community as well.
Everything you are working on is for the improvement of the game AND for the adventure mode, right? We all remember the idea of two towns, two quests, one have to carry the sheep to another town, one is send out on a raid etc. The idea of two bases (directions from where you started) fits perfectly into this. We, the experienced players, have to change our tactics now to fit into the gameplay and with the bases there isn’t so much difference to the meatballs at all.
But never let an not well-tested update be released again. I never heard about the dev app before, but sorry, thats not my fault. Just write a few times “join dev app if you love us!” in the globechat ore sth like that
This is the best game I played so far and in my homeland we got a proverb that says: who climbs high can fall deep. We didn't expect something like that.

[awkm]

@Hekkthor

Yes, you're right.  This should have never been released.  However, due to several complications surrounding the implementation of this and the testing this past month... it was too late to pull when we found the bugs.

We're in the process of getting more thorough testing and creating stringent rules and quality tests to ensure that if features need to be pulled, they can be.

[awkm]

And also



We try.

[Hekkthor]

hehe, yes

[Hekkthor]

Here is my vote for the canyon: delete the grey spawns, based on the structure of the map they dont fit into the base system with the hot zone.

There is no tactical need for the spawn at D3, you can go there sneaky from D2 if you know how
Same for the one at B3, its easy to reach from the spawn at b1, also the way to b3 is nearly always covered with clouds. It only makes the game faster => less coordination => less value of a death

That was always something I loved about this game. You dont want to die, and you are trying everything thats possible to stay alive. A faster gameplay doesnt mean more action. just more deaths and I dont want to get used to that. You stated that you want to prevent 5-0 in general, but based on the arguments already written and the fact that this is a game where you can only win with skills and coordination, 5-0s only shows the superiority of the enemy.
But there is one question now: How can you attract new players with this concept? Do you want to improve the experience for the new players? I have no clue how a new player is thinking about this.

[Chango]

You guys do great things also I've been playing this game over a year and have had a great time with it. This is the first patch that made me a little silly. I think all the pizza talk made me a hungry grump.

[Feast on Thrones]

I really feel being able to spawn on an enemies backside a really limiting and detrimental factor in this choosing spawns malarkey. There should be implemented a system where if you are within I dont know around 600 metres of the opponent you cannot spawn in that grid because the proximity to enemies is too great. If in fjords for example if Blue are camping Red's Spawns then it defaults to a tertiary neutral spawn.

In terms of Raid on the Refinery or any crazy king, it killed the game. Being able to spawn 15 seconds away from the point in contest having just died means that the point can never be recaptured once a team has it. Because try wiping an entire team and capturing a point in 15 seconds from the first death on the opposing team. Yah, its not going to happen.  Choosing spawns in this situation ruined that experience on those maps for me. In this situation spawns should be chosen from 3 spawns at least 1.5k away from the contested point otherwise there is no point playing that gamemode since it comes down to first team there that wins the initial engagement wins GG with no ability to fight at a point at contest well.

Edit: Sorry this really riled me up. I love the game and the development, but this patch... Most certainly should not have gone past dev stage.

[awkm]

@Feast

All fixed.  Hot fix is coming next week.

@hekkthor

Will probably delete.  Actually have lines of scrimmage.  We'll see as more people test in Dev App the next coming day or two.  Final fixes must go in Friday.

[Chango]

Damn so Friday Night would be too late for testing?