Author Topic: Buff the Junker  (Read 12897 times)

Offline Dev Bubbles

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #30 on: March 14, 2013, 07:32:33 pm »
Greetings everyone!  Making a guest appearance on the forum :D 
And I want to just chime in from my own point of view, as a player (an average pilot).
On the junker, I'm a bit torn, as I feel that in certain situations, it's pretty awesome.  And if I'm not totally retarded, it's the 1 ship that can get 3 guns on a target at the same time.   But the slowness of speed does limit it in mid to short range combat. 

On the pyra, I'm unofficially making a claim that it is the easiest ship for new players, so I'm not surprised at all that it is more in use at the moment.  However, I agree with Pickle and Zill in that it is far from OP.  I still prefer my galleon, but I just need to bribe Ataris, Vasylko, CFG, or Rethburn to crew with me as my gunner.  I'm not too picky. 

Offline Pickle

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #31 on: March 14, 2013, 07:53:49 pm »
I'l disagree on the Pyra as the best for new players - I find that the Goldfish is better if you're playing a match with new players, and the Junker is better for teaching in Sandbox.

Offline Helmic

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #32 on: March 14, 2013, 08:41:59 pm »
I have a much easier time getting three guns to bear on a Pyra than on a Junker.  All I have to do is turn slightly to the right side of my target and they're simultaneously set on fire, have their hull down, and are taking direct hull damage.  The Junker is NOT the only ship that can get three guns on a single target, and I'd argue that it's harder since it has to move laterally from its target while the Pyramidion can more or less face forward.

Offline N-Sunderland

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #33 on: March 14, 2013, 09:04:59 pm »
You guys are missing something obvious.

The best ship at getting three guns on one target...

...is the Galleon.

Offline Phoebe

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #34 on: March 14, 2013, 09:10:05 pm »
You guys are missing something obvious.

The best ship at getting three guns on one target...

...is the Galleon.


Even a squid can get three guns on one target.   Approach a galleons port side and carefully stop in the dead centre hugging the galleon;- gatlings on two ends can now hit the Galleon and you have your starboard gun.

:P

Offline N-Sunderland

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #35 on: March 14, 2013, 09:12:22 pm »
You guys are missing something obvious.

The best ship at getting three guns on one target...

...is the Galleon.


Even a squid can get three guns on one target.   Approach a galleons port side and carefully stop in the dead centre hugging the galleon;- gatlings on two ends can now hit the Galleon and you have your starboard gun.

:P


Sitting in a Galleon's broadside with a Squid? Great idea.

Offline Phoebe

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #36 on: March 14, 2013, 09:13:37 pm »
You guys are missing something obvious.

The best ship at getting three guns on one target...

...is the Galleon.


Even a squid can get three guns on one target.   Approach a galleons port side and carefully stop in the dead centre hugging the galleon;- gatlings on two ends can now hit the Galleon and you have your starboard gun.

:P


Sitting in a Galleon's broadside with a Squid? Great idea.

But I'm not wrong!

Offline awkm

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #37 on: March 14, 2013, 09:14:30 pm »
The Galleon dies in 40 seconds
The Goldfish dies in 25 seconds
The Pyramidion dies in 25 seconds
The Junker dies in 15 seconds
The spire dies in 10 seconds
The Squid dies in 10 seconds

Correction

For continuous Medium Flak damage at range against full armor and full health, no skills, and no one repairing:

Junker takes 35 seconds to kill. 
Goldfish 28 seconds just to put it into perspective.

Therefore, the numbers you have come up with are not correct.  There is no way that constant armor repair + increased damage can be less than these numbers.  I can only conclude that there were unexpected variables in your tests (e.g. other ships firing upon your junker).


Furthermore, the Junker has been 500 HP 700 Armor for a pretty long time from what I remember.

Offline Phoebe

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #38 on: March 14, 2013, 09:17:21 pm »
unexpected variables

Huge rock pillar.  :P


edit: sorry eric I'm in a playful mood

Offline N-Sunderland

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #39 on: March 14, 2013, 09:25:11 pm »
For continuous Medium Flak damage at range against full armor and full health, no skills, and no one repairing:

Junker takes 35 seconds to kill. 
Goldfish 28 seconds just to put it into perspective.

Mr. Arrow did say Charged Flak, but I guess that won't account for the difference at all.

Offline awkm

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #40 on: March 14, 2013, 09:27:29 pm »
Huge rock pillar.  :P

Yes, this would certainly change the results dramatically lol.

But yeah... the Junker is quite a tank.  Armor + slimmer (and less) hit box that Pyramidion.  Just FYI, the metal bits on top of the pyramidion and over the balloon are hull hit boxes.  The pyramidion has a lot more hull surface area to hit compared to a junker.

Offline awkm

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #41 on: March 14, 2013, 09:28:22 pm »
Mr. Arrow did say Charged Flak, but I guess that won't account for the difference at all.

Just apply the same % modifier to those times, it still is higher than Mr Arrow's results and he's repairing too.

Offline Phoebe

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #42 on: March 14, 2013, 09:30:38 pm »
  Just FYI, the metal bits on top of the pyramidion and over the balloon are hull hit boxes.  The pyramidion has a lot more hull surface area to hit compared to a junker.

I wonder what would be more effective;- try to directly gun the hull down and funnel all their engineer stress into a single component; or just keep spraying the Pyramidion balloon to take the hull down a little slower;- but force their topgun engineer to leave his gun... I guess it's a little situational.

Although;- that's useful information I didn't know yet being relatively new still

Offline N-Sunderland

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #43 on: March 14, 2013, 09:33:00 pm »
  Just FYI, the metal bits on top of the pyramidion and over the balloon are hull hit boxes.  The pyramidion has a lot more hull surface area to hit compared to a junker.

I wonder what would be more effective;- try to directly gun the hull down and funnel all their engineer stress into a single component; or just keep spraying the Pyramidion balloon to take the hull down a little slower;- but force their topgun engineer to leave his gun... I guess it's a little situational.

Although;- that's useful information I didn't know yet being relatively new still

Target the hull directly for sure, unless you have a balloon-killing gun like the carronade.

Offline N-Sunderland

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Re: Buff the Junker
« Reply #44 on: March 14, 2013, 09:35:47 pm »
Mr. Arrow did say Charged Flak, but I guess that won't account for the difference at all.

Just apply the same % modifier to those times, it still is higher than Mr Arrow's results and he's repairing too.

Looking back at his stats, they definitely can't be right at all. 10 seconds for a Spire to go down?

Maybe... Maybe there were two flaks? Then the stats would be sort of close to right...