The worst things about skyball

[Daft Loon]

1st - People who suck at it and/or just mindlessly absorbed the hate whineing about it and refusing to even try play it properly.

Very distant 2nd - The lost potential of a still un-fixed harpoon gun.

3rd - Moderate squid related balance problems.

[Guagadu]

3rd - Moderate squid related balance problems.

Only moderate? If you saw the Sprocket League Cup, a double-squid team only lost once - to another double squid team. This obviously shows how overpowered is in the current state of the gamemode. In 2v2s, the only somewhat viable team compositions seem to be squid-squid and squid-goldfish, the two fastest ships in the game. Obviously, something needs to be changed to increase variety. After the event, there was a small discussion of how to balance the ships in the Guns of Icarus Discord server. If I remember correctly, the general consensus was that being attached to the balloon had to slow down the ship it controls, and have a larger affect on the faster ships, like Squid and Goldfish, than on the slower ships, like the Junker. While this may not solve the issue entirely, it might be a step in the right direction.

[Daft Loon]

Competitive matches tend to exaggerate problems with balance and even then we saw a team with a mobula seriously contest at least 1 match.

Making the balloon slow the carrier would be good but its tricky to do with the way the games physics and ship stats are done, the squid simply has the most thrust of any ship and so will get slowed the least by any combination of mass or drag given to the balloon.
The best I can think of is giving the ball a hard coded maximum speed of maybe ~32 and either it simply cannot be pulled faster than that or the rope breaks and drops the ball above that speed. Tweaking the squid's mass, drag and thrust to keep its speed etc the same but make it worse at towing things could work but the effect of mines/rams/minotaur/harpoon on the squid would start to become silly(er than they already can be sometimes).

[Atruejedi]

1st - People who suck at it and/or just mindlessly absorbed the hate whineing about it and refusing to even try play it properly.

Very distant 2nd - The lost potential of a still un-fixed harpoon gun.

3rd - Moderate squid related balance problems.

1. I do refuse to play it because it sucks. Sorry. I'm not going to punish myself by testing publicly what I tested privately with Muse and was released too early with little feedback considered.

2. Agree completely! Harpoons and Minotaurs affecting the ball would make Skyball so much more interesting.

3. Eh... Squids suck at King of the Hill (generally) and excel at Skyball (generally). I can deal with it because I'll just take a weapon or two that can punish a Squid (Banshee, Gatling, Hwacha, etc.).

Making the balloon slow the carrier would be good--

lolwut

This would just result in even MORE killing and even MORE defensive spawning and even LONGER matches. Right now we have to play Skyball like Crazy King; that is to say, killing can reward the enemy so it's best to disable and run away. So I think your idea is a bad idea.

-- but its tricky to do with the way the games physics and ship stats are done, the squid simply has the most thrust of any ship and so will get slowed the least by any combination of mass or drag given to the balloon.
The best I can think of is giving the ball a hard coded maximum speed of maybe ~32 and either it simply cannot be pulled faster than that

Eh. You've made the idea above a bit better by elaborating, but I still don't agree for the aforementioned consequences.

--or the rope breaks and drops the ball above that speed.

lolwut

Do you really expect pilots to watch the throttle so carefully? I'm already raging at accidentally dropping the ball.

Skyball is fundamentally flawed and it isn't the Squid's fault. Skyball, like VIP, shouldn't even be considered (or balanced around) 2 vs. 2. Want to improve Skyball? Here:

[Daft Loon]

lolwut

This would just result in even MORE killing and even MORE defensive spawning and even LONGER matches. Right now we have to play Skyball like Crazy King; that is to say, killing can reward the enemy so it's best to disable and run away. So I think your idea is a bad idea.

I've yet to actually witness a too long skyball match, the game has 2 parts, the lobby which sucks and the matches which only suck if nothing is happening. Nothing happening is never a problem in skyball. The only way to get more time actually playing the game (unless muse actually streamlines the lobbies some day) is to make the matches longer. People who dislike skyball would want it to be shorter so they can return to lobby and vote not skyball sooner but that's not really a solution that helps anything, they will just hate it for 5m instead of 5-20m

--or the rope breaks and drops the ball above that speed.

lolwut

Do you really expect pilots to watch the throttle so carefully? I'm already raging at accidentally dropping the ball.

Could make it a count down to avoid the guesswork/allow for short bursts of speed.

As far as accidentally dropping the ball have you considered changing your keybinding to one you don't hit by accident? It might help a little bit.

Skyball is fundamentally flawed and it isn't the Squid's fault. Skyball, like VIP, shouldn't even be considered (or balanced around) 2 vs. 2. Want to improve Skyball? Here:

It would be a massive waste to remove VIP and skyball from 2v2, 80% or thereabouts of matches are 2v2 and they really needed the added variety.

Pictures

Agree on the crossbars, they should just be a rope with lights on it or something (not built by water hazard rope-bridge inc)

Those spawns would be terrible. Having to do a 180 to attack the ship that just scored and is now camping behind the spawn point, no thanks. Or I suppose i could take one of the outer spawns and let them snatch the ball and score again while I am miles away.

Dust storm removal - yep and from dunes too while they are at it.

[Atruejedi]

Do you really expect pilots to watch the throttle so carefully? I'm already raging at accidentally dropping the ball.

Could make it a count down to avoid the guesswork/allow for short bursts of speed.

Actually, that could work. But I'm still against it.

As far as accidentally dropping the ball have you considered changing your keybinding to one you don't hit by accident? It might help a little bit.

Oh, I meant as a future-event. I'm already raging about accidentally dropping the ball by going over the speedcap in the future if your suggestion is implemented. Sorry for the miscommunication.

Skyball is fundamentally flawed and it isn't the Squid's fault. Skyball, like VIP, shouldn't even be considered (or balanced around) 2 vs. 2. Want to improve Skyball? Here:

It would be a massive waste to remove VIP and skyball from 2v2, 80% or thereabouts of matches are 2v2 and they really needed the added variety.

80% of matches shouldn't be 2 vs. 2 because it is vastly inferior to 3 vs 3 (and even 4 vs. 4). Removing those modes from 2 vs. 2 encourages more play in larger lobbies, where the game (and the modes) really does (or could) shine.

Pictures

Agree on the crossbars, they should just be a rope with lights on it or something (not built by water hazard rope-bridge inc)

Those spawns would be terrible. Having to do a 180 to attack the ship that just scored and is now camping behind the spawn point, no thanks. Or I suppose i could take one of the outer spawns and let them snatch the ball and score again while I am miles away.

How would you tweak the spawns?

Dust storm removal - yep and from dunes too while they are at it.

Hell no. Dunes master race. Dunes is an awesome map when you don't snipe every god damn match. Just don't sit in rows 5 and 6 and actually attempt some flanks (of which I am the king).

[Daft Loon]

80% of matches shouldn't be 2 vs. 2 because it is vastly inferior to 3 vs 3 (and even 4 vs. 4). Removing those modes from 2 vs. 2 encourages more play in larger lobbies, where the game (and the modes) really does (or could) shine.

Getting more 3v3s would be good but I don't think it will happen without a fundamental (or a lot of incremental) change/s to matchmaker. Like removing the matchmaker part and finding something better to do with the actually now fairly good mmr/underdog system. And surely if 2v2 VIP and Skyball are widely disliked removing them from 2v2 will make people stay rather than seek out 3v3's?

How would you tweak the spawns?

Initial thoughts would be to take the outer four, turn them 90 to face inwards and make them shared. Possibly adding spawns as close to the north/south map border as possible in B and E facing north/south, also shared.

Dust storm removal - yep and from dunes too while they are at it.

Hell no. Dunes master race. Dunes is an awesome map when you don't snipe every god damn match. Just don't sit in rows 5 and 6.

I'm fine with dunes as pilot, I can just take my squid and fly under it all. It's being crew that is the problem, even if explaining where the dust storms are every match worked it would be too tedious, as it is people don't listen 50%+ of the time.