Community > Community Events

Sunday Community Skirmish: Are official pauses needed?

<< < (4/7) > >>

Kamoba:
I've not experienced any salt from a pause request, had a pauses denied because of combat/spots.
Once paused at enemy request while enemy was visible and in range, but still accepted the pause...
Most salt I've seen from pauses I've been part of is after the pause...
But still undecided...

Caprontos:
Personally.. I actually don't care.. (like most things).. I can see the benefits of having or not having them..

But in my experience.. I have only seen 2 pauses that were really unfortunate for one of the teams.. An one was an unofficial pause(the pause was denied, but the players paused anyways, that might have ruined a good ambush... Though it was the team doing the ambush who requested the pause.

The other one just the clouds issue, where people who weren't spotted and could of been closer before being see were seen early...

I think it should just be.. If both teams agree to a pause (IE one captain from both teams says pause), the clock stops for 1min max(or is the current rule 2? I don't even know).. Otherwise no clock stop. This way the teams themselves decide.. But their is no clock penalty for being nice.

Dementio:
I like pauses. Disconnects or some weird bugs can always happen and it is nice that pauses enable teams to deal with these issues even when in-game.

Pauses can cause other issues, like already mentioned, ship respawning during a pause or that the pause ends with clouds bringing one team into a disadvantageous position. Both of these could be prevented by a ref simply not allowing a pause when one ship is dead or not unpausing immediately when a team is in a more disadvantageous because of clouds. It may just be me, but I have a feeling that a lot refs don't really care about these kind of issues and just want to watch the teams kill each other, regardless of their current position, otherwise the refs would have addressed these issues to the organizers, I would imagine.

Refs have no power whatsoever to ensure that a pause is a pause, yes, but they also don't have the power over anything at all in reality. I don't see the ref's lack of ability a reason to remove a feature a tournament or event introduces, because you might as well not do the entire tournament or even to begin with for the very same reason. Really, nobody has to surrender or ready up when an invisible timer runs out, the teams just play along, all tournaments and events in GoIO are just a "gentlemen's agreement".

Refs also sometimes call pauses seemingly randomly and different refs don't always pause in the same scenarios. That is because of how simple the pause rules are. So, either trust your referee to know what's best or make your own impeccable pause ruleset for refs to use in the future.

Teams also don't instantly react to pauses and some teammembers don't read the chat. However, I do suppose it is fair to believe though that at least one out of eight people has the time to notice a change in the chat, while being outside of any engagements, and is able to tell his pilot about it via voice-chat who in return can tell his co-pilot. Although some time for teams to react should be calculated in by the ref when calling a pause.



I would also rather have an official pause than something that teams have to request from their enemy. I find it much better for players to have to deal with the ref following a very loose ruleset than for players to call other players mean names and accuse them of winning through "unmoral behaviour", when players start requesting for pauses in unacceptable situations, like when they are about to die.

Considering consequences, well, pauses are more of a convenience and the players themselves are responsible for being able to play on their own pc during the time of their match, so it is not wrong to say that it is their own fault, even when more than half of issues requiring a pause are out of people's control. I guess to make teams pay more attention to pauses they could be given a silly title when they failed to do so multiple times, like "Least Chat Attentive Team of the Week" or something, nothing mean of course, because that would be mean, although that example may already be mean, depending on oneself.

And if a ref doesn't respond at all, then the teams decide if they want to be nice and pause or just follow the rules of when a ref doesn't say anything, then the match continues normally. If the ref is not able to respond for multiple occasions, I imagine for the future it should be thought about replacing said ref or adding a secondary ref until the primary ref got his stuff back together.

BlackenedPies:
Better pause rules. One idea is to allow teams to move to nearby hard cover during a pause. If you're using clouds you wanna stay hidden. After unpause you might not have the clouds but at least you won't be in the open.

Another problem is momentum. During a pause you lose momentum which affects ships differently. To benefit the pausing team we might need a 3 second head start and maybe extra for pyra/galleon. Ref can call headstart Blue, then unpause Red.
Slow acceleration: galleon pyra, mid slow: fish, mid: mobula junker spire, very fast: squid

If you have one buff hammer you could go from buffed engines to fully buffed during a pause. Crew can agree to only maintain current buffs. I don't think drifting makes enough difference.

KitKatKitty:

--- Quote from: Skrimskraw on September 15, 2015, 02:58:01 pm ---there are absolutely no tools in order to control or call pauses correct.

there are no consequences for teams that move around during pauses, and they are often called without reason or wrongly.
It is something that varies from referee to referee meaning that you cannot rely on it.

the argument for people dc'ing is somewhat valid, but pauses cant be called during engagements anyway. + honestly the players participating are required to have pc's and connections that cna play the game. its really the team's own fault if someone dc's.
the only valid pause reason that I see is a gentlemans rule.

i think it would be better to remove the pause function to avoid confusion between refs and teams, because often teams themselves call off pauses and start moving, before the referee recognizes that the pause is over. its annoying for the ref and have no consequences.

it would be better to remove it and if teams are thinking about the timer running out during an unofficial gentleman pause, then just raise the game time to 22 minutes or something like that.

--- End quote ---

I have never liked pauses (hence no pauses in VIP, yes I'm aware this isn't competitive play) and had a rather large discussion about making competitions without pauses recently. Even as a competitive player, I have always found dc's more of a problem than a benefit. I agree with everything Skrim says here. The only thing I suggested adding was 20-25 seconds at the start of any match to allow for everyone to load in before starting...granted there is no feature for this so it's similar to a pause in that function BUT as long as the pilots don't get on the helm the ships wont move. This allows for any potential problems with initial loading in or people that are slower to load in.
I think part of being on a competitive team is making sure that you have members that don't dc, or at least not on any regular basis. I'm aware that the servers aren't perfect but competitive players play this game for hours on end...if they don't know if they dc frequently enough to be a problem in competitive play than they shouldn't be on a competitive team. Pauses cause way more issues with concerns to ships drifting (this can make a large difference), pauses not being called fast enough or clear enough or if teams are to allow pauses do to gentlemanly behavior, what is appropriate engagement range based on each ship build and spots...even if spots aren't down that doesn't mean that ships aren't spotted...some teams will see ships but keep them not spotted in order to keep a sneak approach.
This isn't even mentioning all the tactical issues that pauses can cause.

How I see it is a dc can cause a disadvantage to a team,agreed, but a pause can also cause a disadvantage to a team and sometimes it's the team opposite of the one calling for the pause and that seems less fair than just having the team that dc'd deal with the dc without a pause. Pauses also can cause a lot of stress to refs and some refs get flak for "bad calls".

TL:DR: Pauses are way more of a problem than a benefit.

Navigation

[0] Message Index

[#] Next page

[*] Previous page