Fire Tool Reload

[Indreams]

Any experienced player knows that fire tools are imbalanced. Chem Spray >>>>>> Fire Extinguisher. I know this very well.
I've argued for Fire Extinguisher before. Man, that was the hardest argument I've lost. Truth is, Chem Spray is far better than Fire Extinguisher.

There's many ideas to balance these tools. This is my little something.

Fire Tool Reload

Basic Mechenics

Chem Spray:
After about 5~6 sprays, the engineer needs to replace the chem spray canister. The reload is done by the second mouse press. It can be done quickly while moving.

Fire Extinguisher:
After about 10~12 sprays, the engineer needs to replace the fire extinguisher canister. The reload is done by the second mouse press. It is done sightly slower than the chem spray. It can be reloaded while moving.

Advanced (Possible) Mechanics

These Mechanics could be implemented individually with testing to twick balances.

• Engineer movement slowed during reloads
• Reload is slower, but can happen with out the fire tool being active.
• Potency of the fire tool is reduced as the canister depletes.
• Amount of fire tool left is visible/invisible.
• Engineers have set number of reserve canisters. They are refilled from a canister station/over time.

These could make balance changes without number changes.

My Thoughts

A reload mechanic such as this can impact the balance of fire tools without technical number changes (which often doesn't solve the problem and/or is difficult to do right).

I don't think a fire tool reload mechanic will impact the game play much. If it is too complicated, the reload can be made automatic.
And reload mechanic shouldn't be much of a nerf to fire tools. 5~6 chem sprays will cover half a ship, and its about the number of components a typical engi is charged with.

A reload mechanic will

• give other ways to balance chem spray to fire tool
• make fire prevention strategic and fun (one must to decide which components get priority)
• make fire tools a lithe more realistic. GOIO is Hollywood realism, but we can't just scrap realism.
• replace the mindless, constant chem spraying of engineers with some interesting game play.
• rehabilitate the chem spray addicted engineers by putting limits to chem sprays.

This is a thought experiment. I'd like your thoughts on it.

[Indreams]

So... is this a bad idea? No comments?

[Kamoba]

I can see how it fits LORE wise, but am still thinking about the balance implementations... and also if a reload or perhaps a stand where youget a new ext/chem from... thinking..

[BlackenedPies]

I don't think it would go over well because players are so used to constantly running around and chemming.
It would add a new element of strategy but let's not forget how ridiculous the flamethrower is.
Adding a reload makes the flamethrower even more powerful, and every little second counts when you're getting cooked.

I refuse to use the flamethrower because it's a pointless weapon. If they have good chem nothing happens. If they don't then they die with no chance whatsoever.
Let's not buff the flame anymore please. It's not fair to scrubs. It already has superb arcs, clip, range, and it's the easiest gun to shoot.

[DJ Logicalia]

I meant to comment on this yesterday and then forgot it existed.

The engineer game in it current state can't really allow for something like this. I chem spray everything all the time, and having to watch what I do and don't spray is a frightening idea. That being said, I think this is a super rad, super original idea and would be great if chem was over powered. If this reload thingy decreased the cooldown time on both fire tools, and you eliminated the reloading on the extinguisher, I could see this being a pretty good ext buff 

[Indreams]

I meant to comment on this yesterday and then forgot it existed.

The engineer game in it current state can't really allow for something like this. I chem spray everything all the time, and having to watch what I do and don't spray is a frightening idea. That being said, I think this is a super rad, super original idea and would be great if chem was over powered. If this reload thingy decreased the cooldown time on both fire tools, and you eliminated the reloading on the extinguisher, I could see this being a pretty good ext buff

This +1

It's probably how it should be added. Remove fire tool cool down and replace it with a reload. So the strategic decision isn't mallet v extinguish, but what takes priority fire fighting.

[Crafeksterty]

If thats the case, ide remove fire cooldown, and have like a few shots before reload. Like 2-3 chemsprays before reload, 6 fire extinguishers before reload.

[Indreams]

So, here's what I'm thinking...

• Remove/reduce fire tool cool downs.
• Add fire tool reload
• Chem Spray has 5~6 uses
• Extinguisher has 10~12 uses
• Reload will happen without having fire tool active. (You can whack stuff with your mallet while fire tool is reloading)
• Reload time for Chem Spray should be little about the time it takes to go from Galleon bot engines to top engine, or Pyra balloon to main engine.

I think 5~6 uses of Chem spray is a good balance. That should cover about half the components on a ship, and that's about the number of component engineers are charged with. Galleon bot deck - 6, Pyra main - 6, junker top deck - 6, etc. etc.

10~12 for extinguisher so extinguisher can put out every fire on the ship.

Reload shouldn't be too long. I'd want it to short enough that the window to set fire on the ship is not longer than 5 seconds.

I want to buff pub match fire tools, but also buff competitive-level flames.
Right now flames either wreck your ship or do nothing at all.


I'm kind of worried if this is too drastic a change to the game. Stamina doesn't seem too popular, I wonder how majority of people will receive this...

[Squidslinger Gilder]

Anything to stop perma chemming rotations is a good thing. Theres just something wrong when running around spraying stuff defines a good engineer from a bad one. Man I remember a time when engineers really had to be on their game. It wasn't about rotations but actually watching the battle and being flawless with timings. Then relying on the pilot to get them out of trouble and buy them time to shine.

Stamina is awesome. It just needs tweaks but it is a step in the right direction to really give this game a good shot in the arm that it needs. Just some that are terrified of it breaking the game. Their concerns are unfounded as Stamina is still a far cry from what this game used to be like and back then no one said it was "broken."