An Idea for a Ranged META softcounter

[Volgair]

Watching the fire side chat videos from last week and noticed a call to arms for both a new Heavy ship and more art. I have an idea for one and can suffer at figuring out the other.


Jörmungandr/ Jormungand- Heavy Interceptor
http://imgur.com/a/yVXNm

Strengths
- Forward Firing Guns
- Devastating Inline Rush boat (Like the Pyra but Hyper Specialized)

Weaknesses
- Turns slow (Slower then a Gali)
- Thin Armor (Goldfish)
- Easy to over tax your engineers
- Long and Tall making it difficult for anything other then open maps


I am interested to see what you guys think about my idea. Keep in mind I have not designed it to have a specific motif, just fill a roll that I feel is missing in an asymmetric pattern. I think it looks kind of cool, and at a minimum unique. If any one wants to make a more detailed lay out or flesh out the design with a photoshop still action pic feel free.

[Volgair]

Nobody wants to even play with the idea? I was going to use this thread as a segue into possibly getting a mod framework for assisting Muse, by way of producing user generated lateral content. For the purpose of keeping interest high, and our population a bit more regular. The model that Mojang has adopted.

Mind you I realize this is not Minecraft... There would need to be some kind of board or counsel to govern additions but it would allow new ideas and game play Meta's to be explored while Muse improves the vertical structure/content of its software. Think of it like this folks, in this instance you could be modding for the chance of your mod to become cannon. How cool would that be.

I suppose I will close like this, It doesn't NEED to be a mod frame work, It could be something as simple as regular contests. But I feel something like this has to be implemented for a small design team to like muse to keep a large population interested in a lobby shooter. (Yes that is what it is right now, regardless of how different it is from the mold that casts most of the genera.)

[Skrimskraw]

a lot of players speculate and create their own images of what they want in the game.
However Muse is a indie company, with limited people working. Right now they are working on coop mode which might or might not have heavy ships in it.

However Muse love getting ideas from the community, but they dont like it to be forced.
If they read something they like, they might work on it.

[Omniraptor]

Mod support would be nice, but it takes a lot of work and would generally be impossible without dedicated servers. Muse has other much more pressing tasks on their plate than fixing the netcode, creating dedicated server software, and only then adding an sdk for mods, all for a very uncertain return on investment.

Right now they're working on matchmaking first and co-op mode second. Designing, sculpting, texturing, animating, testing/balancing new ships is a ****ton of work, and muse has set very high standards for how the ships/guns look and act, compared to say a new block or object type in minecraft.

This means a weekly 'art contest' would most likely not be worth it in terms of time lost vs. content gained. I really don't want it to become a bloated incoherent mess a la TF2.

Regarding the Jormungand, the first thing that comes to mind is "wow that looks really cool", then "wow that's a lot of hardpoints", and then "gun arcs really do not work that way AT ALL"

also lol @ "large population"

[Skrimskraw]

mind you it is unity, and Awkm have said some of their coding is fixed and hard to change around without having to recode the entire thing to fix it. - makes modding kinda complicated.

its not source engine or unreal engine. MUSE jumped on unity as some of the first to bring it to the table.

[JaegerDelta]

as far as the ship goes, its not really a counter to ranged ship builds, you have alot of walking distance over the whole ship, specifically the engines, being spread out laterally and vertically, would be a nightmare to keep repaired against your own tools, let alone incoming fire from enemy ships. Furthermore, a ship like this, meaning designed for frontal charges with not alot of maneuverability, is really open to getting its main weapons systems and baloon knocked out. the easiest long range shots for a gunner to score hits are on a ship moving in a straight line, no matter how fast you are going (well up to a point but that point would be so ridiculously fast that it would never be achieved by the level tech that is in the game). especially with mercs or artemis. With the low ship health in this design what do you do once you close with the enemy? you are then in a slugging match with a ship that has more armor than you (most of the time) and that has a better ability to turn to its secondary weapons and keep those guns on you while they move around your ship to the starboard side if they are not there already (again, most of the time). secondary weapons that are more than likely set up to handle emergency close range combat.


and from a lore perspecitive, where would this ship fit in the world of GoI:O? since it is so long it couldnt attack or defend against enemies in tight spaces. so the factions and private enterprises of the world would only be able to use it in large open areas of the world, but because it lacks maneuverability it would require a convoy of support ships to defend against ambushes. I suppose, due to its large compliment of large guns it could be used as a siege vessel for attacking fortified positions, settlements and the like, but then why would it need to be really quick for charging in. maybe for blitzkrieg type attacks with other support ships doing the mopping up, but you would need alot of them for a settlement of any real consequence due to them being so fragile in the armor department.

it is an interesting ship design though, definitely unique and i kinda dig the looks, but you gotta ask yourself why did someone build this ship this way. its gotta fit in both the world and in the 1's and 0's of the game mechanics. i can see this as a spire definite spire killer, but what isn't?

if you are looking to design ships as a counter against long range fire you should probably look more toward a ship that can change direction and altitude rapidly. Since the enemy has to lead shots due to the ballistic properties of the projectile, the ability to be hard to predict while closing with them is much more valuable than closing with them in a straight predictable path. 

[Ivan Malik]

Been lurking these forums for a while now, enough is enough. This is less so directed at Jaeger, than the other two.

Two ideas to deal with two of the "largest" issues in the GoI community: range spam, and a less stratified community. Someone actually did something crazy and took a stab at fixing them instead of just complaining. So how is it responded to, in true Victorian style: that is impossible, change is bad, your idea is dumb, let me mitigate you into a lower caste since you are not a part of "the group," etc. This guy just served up two half way decent ideas, that can make more progress in the community than bickering about tournament results or how to get people into the broken strife bringing tournament system that usually graces these forums, if the ideas are actually discussed and not simply shoved down. Are his ideas perfect, no. However, he rolled out the red carpet to have a conversation. He even provided a nice picture, in response to something that he saw in a fireside chat with the devs, to entice some of those who don't like walls of text. Point is he just tried to engage with this community, through its chosen medium, and you guys just spat in his face. Considering his first post was just a few days ago, you guys have done a fantastic job of alienating another new community member. Congratulations on being a part of the problem, refusing to have a civil discussion about how to maybe fix it, and perpetuating the norm.

Also I think you missed the point of what he meant about the moding. He proposed a system to lighten the load on Muse in the future, with the chance of explosive growth, without hurting the core of the game in anyway, could increase the amount of developer to player interaction, and most importantly a discussion about how a system like that might work. How a proposed system can't be done because x, really adds no value to any discussion if there is no solution to be made in place.

His idea would ultimately result in a less stratified community because when the boredom set in because of how slow development is for skirmish or for coop and adventure in the future, to no fault of muse they are just small, there would be other options than to beat the living crap out of everything that moves in a pub or doing the same old thing in adventure/coop. This would keep interests high for longer periods than just when players get the game at a sale or an event, filling the ranks of experience, and put a stop to this ridiculous caste based community. I understand the need for some to embrace the genre that is largely based around the Victorian era, but somethings like values are better left in the past. Look past the ship, I'm fairly certain that was just the worm, and think about all of the options, new game modes, new tools, if a group gets really ambitious new guns and maps. There are a ton of possibilities for far less resources than Muse could test them out themselves. He is essentially proposing crowd sourcing development. So how would you do it? What tid bit of knowledge do you have to make this discussion more colorful? What did Volgair get wrong and if so how can it be improved to be right? Even the dumbest idea can turn into a great one after a threadnaught and a few dozen brains working on it.

[Imagine]

Been lurking these forums for a while now, enough is enough. This is less so directed at Jaeger, than the other two.

Two ideas to deal with two of the "largest" issues in the GoI community: range spam, and a less stratified community. Someone actually did something crazy and took a stab at fixing them instead of just complaining. So how is it responded to, in true Victorian style: that is impossible, change is bad, your idea is dumb, let me mitigate you into a lower caste since you are not a part of "the group," etc. This guy just served up two half way decent ideas, that can make more progress in the community than bickering about tournament results or how to get people into the broken strife bringing tournament system that usually graces these forums, if the ideas are actually discussed and not simply shoved down. Are his ideas perfect, no. However, he rolled out the red carpet to have a conversation. He even provided a nice picture, in response to something that he saw in a fireside chat with the devs, to entice some of those who don't like walls of text. Point is he just tried to engage with this community, through its chosen medium, and you guys just spat in his face. Considering his first post was just a few days ago, you guys have done a fantastic job of alienating another new community member. Congratulations on being a part of the problem, refusing to have a civil discussion about how to maybe fix it, and perpetuating the norm.

Also I think you missed the point of what he meant about the moding. He proposed a system to lighten the load on Muse in the future, with the chance of explosive growth, without hurting the core of the game in anyway, could increase the amount of developer to player interaction, and most importantly a discussion about how a system like that might work. How a proposed system can't be done because x, really adds no value to any discussion if there is no solution to be made in place.

His idea would ultimately result in a less stratified community because when the boredom set in because of how slow development is for skirmish or for coop and adventure in the future, to no fault of muse they are just small, there would be other options than to beat the living crap out of everything that moves in a pub or doing the same old thing in adventure/coop. This would keep interests high for longer periods than just when players get the game at a sale or an event, filling the ranks of experience, and put a stop to this ridiculous caste based community. I understand the need for some to embrace the genre that is largely based around the Victorian era, but somethings like values are better left in the past. Look past the ship, I'm fairly certain that was just the worm, and think about all of the options, new game modes, new tools, if a group gets really ambitious new guns and maps. There are a ton of possibilities for far less resources than Muse could test them out themselves. He is essentially proposing crowd sourcing development. So how would you do it? What tid bit of knowledge do you have to make this discussion more colorful? What did Volgair get wrong and if so how can it be improved to be right? Even the dumbest idea can turn into a great one after a threadnaught and a few dozen brains working on it.

There's about a trillion and a half threads about new boat ideas. I'm not exactly sure why you think this one in particular was supposed to get special treatment.

As for adding something like the Steam Workshop to GOIO, it's been discussed, but the implementation and control is difficult, and frankly, most of the stuff communities end up creating that's not cosmetic end up being complete crap, or completely overpowered, or just not holding up to the standards and balance of the game. Balance is already hard enough to maintain in this game already without people going at it willy nilly.

Yes, the idea that the OP might be interesting, and it's something that could, perhaps, be looked at by someone dev live for new ships. But I don't quite understand how you think it's alienating a new member. Seriously, take a look at threads and count the multitudes of completely new members who come romping in saying I HAS BEST IDEA EVAR, not understanding game design like... at all.

[JaegerDelta]

lol well that got derailed in record time.

but keep up the ship designs volgair. i like looking at them. should probably post future designs on the suggestions board but thats not really a big deal.

[Schwerbelastung]

Hey there,

just popping in this thread to say that I, like many others, love reading new ideas. Also, about the Steam Workshop being part of Guns of Icarus Online - it's already in the "Approved Projects" board, meaning that the developers consider it an idea that should be implemented as soon as they get the time for it. It was a question that was brought up in the latest Friday dev chat on Twitch.

Link to the dev chat thread, which has a lot of questions asked by the community members, all of them answered by the devs & some additional announcements thrown in: https://gunsoficarus.com/community/forum/index.php/topic,3776.0.html