Main > Gameplay
Some interesting math about the Mercury Field Gun.
N-Sunderland:
--- Quote ---Also, allow me to use your math against you. You are saying that the Mercury with default ammo takes 2 shots to kill a heavy weapon. Ok.
Last time I checked the Mercury had only 2 shots and a slow reload time. So what you are saying is that even a simple gunner with a rubber mallet can simply keep its heavy gun perfectly operational even under constant mercury fire.
THe mercury shoots, the gun takes damage, immediatly the gunner hits it with his mallet, second shot comes, the gun is still alive, mercury reloads, gunner finishes bringing the gun back to full health.
And if you use 2 Mercs to disable a single component I'm sorry but not only this isn't doable on many ships but you are basically committing all your firepower to disable a single weapon. This doesn't seem like a smart strategy.
--- End quote ---
This bit's a little moot seeing as it only takes one shot to disable a heavy gun.
Serenum:
Yeah I got distracted, I had it deleted right after posting, but you ninja'd me.
Anyway it's irrelevant.
Echoez:
--- Quote from: Serenum on July 30, 2013, 07:55:24 am ---Echoez, most of your complaints seemed centered around the "OMG GOLDFISH IS USELESS AGAINST A MERCURY" argument and the fact that it can disable components too well.
Please tell me how is changing its ability do do permahull damage going to fix that? I can still snipe your Goldfish or Galleon or wathever and by the time you get close I'll just finish you off with something that deals explosive damage while keeping your guns disabled 100% of the times, at least this seems to be your opinion.
--- End quote ---
Both the Goldfish and the Spire have very low armor, penetratably by 2-3 Merc shots, unlike most ships though if those shots hit consecutively you have no chance to repair armor, so unlike most ships, the permahull damage it does harms them way more due to a fast armor destruction. You can disable my gun but you do not get an unfail permahull advantage as well. Especially seeing as how a ship like the Spire can be destroyed by 2 full volleys from 4 Mercs, something not so uncommon.
--- Quote from: Serenum on July 30, 2013, 07:55:24 am ---It seems to me that your opinion is heavly biased against this gun, meanwhile the few people that support the idea of changes to the Mercury do so because they play in the competitive scene where apparently long range spamming is an issue.
An issue with the players, in my opinion, not the guns, but I've already voiced my opinion on the matter in other threads.
--- End quote ---
If it can be abused, it is an issue with the gun, the players just want to win, can you blame them for that and say that "You guys are the real problem of this game for spamming a broken weapon" are you serious?
--- Quote from: Serenum on July 30, 2013, 07:55:24 am ---I never had the impression that the Mercury can absolutely dominate a game, it's a strong weapon no doubt, but you are basically denying all its flaws and pointing at your math as your only argument, which in the complex reality of a real match I'm sorry to say but isn't as important as you make it seem.
--- End quote ---
I actually pointed out some of the weaknesses it had, something you failed to do and see apparently, but its negatives are negligible, seeing how easy it is to use and how much damage it packs even against permahull.
--- Quote from: Serenum on July 30, 2013, 07:55:24 am ---You are also totally convinced that brawling isn't a viable solution unless the enemy captain has the piloting skills of a tomato, something which I find simply false. Even in Dunes there are dust clouds, wreckages and uneven terrain that can be used to move undetected and to provide cover against long range fire, in addition to good old piloting skills that is.
And I know this from experience, having been on both sides of the issue and having found ways around it.
Theorycrafting can deal some serious damage to the game balance.
--- End quote ---
If you are talking about pubs with low level of competitiveness, sure, everything is viable. Against even remotely serious snipers, winning as a brawling team is almost impossible in Dunes, there is too much space and clouds aren't hard cover. Anyone even won against good snipers in Dunes?
I am not saying the map is bad by itself for the game in general, it is a very good beginner map that as usual, can be extremely exploited by advanced players and I did state I didn't want any more map discussion in this thread, so don't bring that up again.
--- Quote from: Serenum on July 30, 2013, 07:55:24 am ---Finally, I don't think that every ship and every weapon loadout should be equally viable in every map and against every opponent. There should be some tactics involved in choosing your loadout and ship, if you take a Galleon in Canyons you are at an objective disasvantage because it will take you a long time to navigate and there are many narrow passages. Same thing for the weapons, brawling in an open map is doable but risky unless you pick a fast ship that can quickly close the distance. I don't see the problem with that.
--- End quote ---
No you actually just camp your spawn. You are forgetting that people usually do not fly Galleons, it's 80% parking and 20% piloting, seeing as how the Galleon is a positioning ship more than a manuvering ship cause well.. it can't realy manuver that well.
--- Quote from: Serenum on July 30, 2013, 07:55:24 am ---Anyway, I agree that baby steps is the best way to fix any balance concern, radically changing how an entire category of damage works or taking away any kill power the Mercury has will absolutely wreck this game and make it even more frustrating for new players.
I'm happy to see the devs taking the reasonable approach.
--- End quote ---
Wreck the game because one weapon that is not supposed to be dealing sufficient permahull damage in the first place will actually not due to and be properly specialized?..
Plasmarobo:
Echo I hardly think the game is "wrecked".
I haven't really used my Mercs in the last few games I've played.
I think everyone is aware of, and attempting to fix, the balance with this gun.
Now is the time for patience.
You also have to recognize that balance is a careful ecosystem. Fixing one issue may result in creating several more. Not that it will, but it might. Additionally the competitive scene is the minority (as has been pointed out) even if we are the most vocal/passionate about it.
Sniping should be a very valid tactic. I agree: It should not be the only tactic, but you can't simply make it unviable.
I think we should all take a deep breath and realize that there is weight to both sides of this argument. Again, (as I seem to be saying a lot lately) nobody is "right".
Maybe I like playing Guns of Sniperus.
Maybe I like playing Guns of Brawlicus.
I happen to actually like both.
Serenum:
Fine Echoez, you win an Internet argument. Mercury will doom us all. Run for the hills!
I'm done with this thread, you are not even trying to be objective and you are willingly misinterpreting anything that can jeopardize your argument.
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version