Author Topic: Heavy piercing weapon  (Read 34465 times)

Offline Malarosa Agresti

  • Member
  • Salutes: 9
    • 5
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #30 on: May 15, 2013, 02:16:03 am »
GUNS OF ICARUS 1.3
Change Log
- Added new ship, the Science Vessel
- Added new light weapon, the Tesla Coil
- Added new medium weapon, the Voltaic Cannon

Offline Nidh

  • Member
  • Salutes: 16
    • [GwTh]
    • 21
    • 45 
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #31 on: May 15, 2013, 02:50:41 am »
GUNS OF ICARUS 1.3
Change Log
- Added new ship, the Science Vessel
- Added new light weapon, the Tesla Coil
- Added new medium weapon, the Voltaic Cannon

Don't get me excited like that :(

But a heavy piercing + explosive could make the Goldfish more formidable, I approve!

Offline Sakaron

  • Member
  • Salutes: 2
    • 6
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #32 on: May 15, 2013, 03:17:22 am »
To me a piercing+explosive weapon would be too simple, field two of those and you have a ship killer.

Even as common as the gat flack combo is, it requires timing, teamwork and resisting the urge to shout rude words at the guy who missed his flak shots

while the piercing+ explosive weapon sticks too much simplicity and does not encourage teamwork.
I reckon a piercing+fire gun would be nice, even if it doesn't make sense on how it would work.

BUT, you have to ignore the pretty effects and consider the meta and what the player will think to this.
As one player said, we will have gat flack combos on galleons if you introduce a heavy piercing weapon. I believe that it may reduce the supportive role of the galleon and turn it into a killing machine. Right now the galleon is more or less okay, but if you introduce a way for the galleon to very quickly kill judging by the damage of the current medium weapons, the meta may change to a two galleon combo where one galleon can help out the other.

because of the damage, most other ships will not be able to compete as you can secure each other behind and other blind spots.

Offline Captain Smollett

  • Member
  • Salutes: 122
    • [Duck]
    • 11
    • 14 
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #33 on: May 15, 2013, 01:45:24 pm »
Yeah, god bless awkm and trying to balance the game.

The Pyra has always limited what you can do with light weapons and the Galleon has always limited what you can do with heavy weapons.

Dancing around these ships to leave the rest of the game balanced is an art.

So far the Junker changes have proved incredible, when you bring in a new weapon though, everything needs to be reconsidered within the context of the entire game.

Offline Mattilald Anguisad

  • Community Ambassador
  • Salutes: 12
    • [GwTh]
    • 12 
    • 45
    • 30 
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #34 on: May 15, 2013, 03:25:39 pm »
Talking about new heavy weapons and their ballance: I wonder is the mone-launcher going to have a wide enough arc to launch the mines out goldishe's direct path or is it going to have to fly in reverse to be able to launch mines safely.

Offline Gambrill

  • Member
  • Salutes: 26
    • [Cake]
    • 27 
    • 33
    • 24 
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #35 on: May 21, 2013, 05:37:49 am »
We talk about heavy piercing to be pretty much a double barrelled gattling gun.. why not like a ballista? Fire a massive crossbow bolt into the hull? In pretty sure that would pierce anything? Just a thought :)
« Last Edit: May 21, 2013, 05:39:38 am by Gambrill »

Offline Captain Smollett

  • Member
  • Salutes: 122
    • [Duck]
    • 11
    • 14 
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #36 on: May 21, 2013, 10:20:34 am »
What if the Ballista bolt had a rope behind it.  All Harpoon Galleon!

Offline Shinkurex

  • CA Mod
  • Salutes: 102
    • [MM]
    • 45 
    • 20
    • 43 
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #37 on: May 21, 2013, 10:22:10 am »
What if the Ballista bolt had a rope behind it.  All Harpoon Galleon!

NO! just no... the horror

Offline maitreya

  • Member
  • Salutes: 0
    • 1
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #38 on: May 21, 2013, 10:43:04 am »
What if the Ballista bolt had a rope behind it.  All Harpoon Galleon!

NO! just no... the horror


Offline Gambrill

  • Member
  • Salutes: 26
    • [Cake]
    • 27 
    • 33
    • 24 
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #39 on: May 21, 2013, 11:07:21 am »
Or at about a cannon?... Now wait and listen just a huge cannon ball but it has spikes... Hence piercing damage!!!! :D

Offline Mill Wilkinson

  • Member
  • Salutes: 24
    • [MM]
    • 4
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #40 on: May 21, 2013, 11:16:38 am »
Piercing weapons are most likely simple projectile weapons, and that is just fine. Although, the dieselpunkish rail gun with protrusions and manly sound effects made me drool a little.

Offline Chrinus

  • Community Ambassador
  • Salutes: 10
    • [Gent]
    • 32 
    • 38
    • 27 
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #41 on: May 21, 2013, 11:23:47 am »
Or at about a cannon?... Now wait and listen just a huge cannon ball but it has spikes... Hence piercing damage!!!! :D

Technically you could have it do explosive/piercing with a reversed arming timer to simulate velocity falloff while in the air. So after say 0.8s airtime the piercing falls off the weapon, making it devastating close up and ineffective against armor further away. Hell you could even use the projectile physics on a cannon, add mass and make a weapon that deals impact damage based on collision velocity.

Something I'd like to mention. Given the devastating damage current heavy weapons do, I think it would be very difficult to balance a raycast, rapid fire piercing weapon to fit on a galleon without making it completely ruin anything that doesn't sneak up on its blindsides. A new Howitzer, Rocket, or Cannon-like weapon is probably the way to go here. I understand that the Spire and Goldfish only have 1 heavy slot, but let's be honest here; the ship that will benefit the most from this change is going to be the Galleon, who can now balance their weaker starboard side with easy to use piercing capability making the light gun on port moreso a luxury than anything else.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2013, 11:48:35 am by Chrinus »

Offline NikolaiLev

  • Member
  • Salutes: 4
    • [Fur]
    • 2
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #42 on: May 21, 2013, 05:39:24 pm »
Or at about a cannon?... Now wait and listen just a huge cannon ball but it has spikes... Hence piercing damage!!!! :D

Technically you could have it do explosive/piercing with a reversed arming timer to simulate velocity falloff while in the air. So after say 0.8s airtime the piercing falls off the weapon, making it devastating close up and ineffective against armor further away. Hell you could even use the projectile physics on a cannon, add mass and make a weapon that deals impact damage based on collision velocity.

Something I'd like to mention. Given the devastating damage current heavy weapons do, I think it would be very difficult to balance a raycast, rapid fire piercing weapon to fit on a galleon without making it completely ruin anything that doesn't sneak up on its blindsides. A new Howitzer, Rocket, or Cannon-like weapon is probably the way to go here. I understand that the Spire and Goldfish only have 1 heavy slot, but let's be honest here; the ship that will benefit the most from this change is going to be the Galleon, who can now balance their weaker starboard side with easy to use piercing capability making the light gun on port moreso a luxury than anything else.

Honestly, this is why I suggested a weapon that deals Piercing and Explosive damage.  Because naturally, its damage (and possibly range) would be sub-optimal compared to other options, but it'd be an all-in-one weapon.  It could have an arming time, making it a long range weapon, or it could be a close range weapon.

I've always wanted to see a cannon-like weapon; this is an opportunity for that.  Though I must admit, seeing a Light version would be nice, too.

The thing about a Piercing/Explosive weapon is that unlike the current combos you have, you'll be dealing no Shatter damage.  The Gatling and Merc don't really sacrifice much armor peeling power for their disabling potency, so they'll still be very useful.  But these weapons would be purely for killing.

Offline Spud Nick

  • Member
  • Salutes: 130
    • [✦✦45]
    • 40 
    • 45
    • 45 
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #43 on: May 21, 2013, 07:51:03 pm »
Arming time on a heavy piercing weapon would be a good idea.

Offline maitreya

  • Member
  • Salutes: 0
    • 1
    • View Profile
Re: Heavy piercing weapon
« Reply #44 on: May 21, 2013, 10:31:25 pm »
present concepts:

  • "stupidly conventional":
The weapon is essentially drawn from the concepts of WWI and WWII flackguns and other anti-aircraft weapons such as the Bofors.
  • "conventional":
The weapon fires an elongated projectile that contains some form of napalm or explosive. Preferably some sort of saboted arrow, possibly from a ballista, steam-cannon, or railgun for bonus points.
  • "unconventional":
Magnetically accelerated ferro-fluid that deals shatter damage up close, but once given the time to elongate (i.e. arming time) the fluid projectile deals heavy piercing damage.