Author Topic: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards  (Read 38034 times)

Offline Lueosi

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New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« on: January 12, 2016, 01:32:15 pm »
New Titles!
Hi fellow competitive players and also those of you who are interested in joining the scene.
The Sunday Community Skirmish team is proud to offer you, with the support of Muse, some exclusive SCS titles for participating and winning the event. That's right, simply by taking part, you may earn a participation title!

We want to thank you for your awesome participation with over 20 teams competing in the past 6 months, over 50 teams in its lifetime and closing in on the 100th event and the second anniversary of the SCS originally founded by Velvet & Skrimskraw, and organized later by DJ Logicalia & Ayetach as a continuation of the Sunday Rumble by Urz which began way back in August 2013. From our first winner with the Glowwater Thralls over Ryders, SPQR/HRA, Gents, Clan Clan, Predators, Bards, OVW and now the most recent winner Skyborne, we have seen a lot of different teams out of these clans winning the SCS, and plenty more finishing very close at second place!

We saw a lot of great matches, 0:4 turnarounds, favorites winning but also upsets, sniping matches and brawls, we saw the meta changing and all that with your continuous support by participating in the event. Also thanks a lot to all the streamers and casters who filled the event with charm and bypass some slow engagements: Fourth Oracle, imagine42, Rob and Dan, Puppy Fur, Brick Hardcastle, Thomas, Xemko, Tanya, Swallow, Morty, SapphireSage, Mattilald, Heldigris, Rethburn, Beachbum, Logicalia, Kajros, Dementio, Gorgon, nanoduckling, Gibbs, Inkjet, Rex, Sliced, BlackenedPies, Sammy and last but not least Urz (in no particular order and I'm sure I forgot to list half of them, so my apologies).

That's why we want to return the gratitude with some small rewards:
Skirmisher (participation)
Skirmish Champion (win)

And don't worry, all you have to do is to play, the SCS team will make sure you receive your well deserved titles. In case you are curious, the complexity we need to organize is O(n). Also worth mentioning is that the titles are only handed out to the new participants.

Sign up for the upcoming SCS #85 and be the first one rewarded with these new titles.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2016, 07:26:32 am by Ayetach »

Offline nhbearit

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Re: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2016, 05:45:24 am »
I have two simple questions. 1) who thought this was a good idea?  2) why did they think this was a good idea?

Offline Skrimskraw

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Re: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2016, 06:09:27 am »
SCS originally founded by Velvet and Skrimskraw, and continued by DJ Logicalia

corrected that ;)

Offline Lueosi

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Re: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2016, 06:50:22 am »
God damnit, thanks for founding Skrim :) .

@nhbearit: To answer these constructive questions: The SCS team and Keyvias thought this was a good idea and the answer why is in the OP. I'm looking forward to see the Ducks signing up again, but I own Sammy 80 Nickels first :( .

Offline Skrimskraw

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Re: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2016, 07:41:38 am »
the reason why this is a good idea is to get people to signup, since they will get something even though they dont win.

Its not monetary and not costumes which you can farm vs devs anyway. its something you can only get here. Thats how marketing works bearit :)

also its just a title, they are part of this game, if you want it then participate.

 also np lue, just friendly poking you ;)

Offline KitKatKitty

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Re: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2016, 10:21:00 am »
I'm don't feel this really addresses the over all concern for the players who think SCS has become too serious with the same outcome every week and has gone away from the initial idea of it being a practice event to help teams become better not discourage them from competitive. The rewards will probably have some increase in initial sign ups for people who want to get the title but once they have the title you are left with the same problems of why teams aren't signing up. I feel this is more of a temporary band aid.

I think bearit was trying to express an overall feeling that he doesn't agree with titles in his initial post and even though it wasn't clearly stated that way, I don't feel you should have dismissed him so quickly, instead ask why he thought it wasn't a good idea. 

Offline Dementio

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Re: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2016, 12:26:55 pm »
I get the feeling that people are reading too much into this.

Offline nhbearit

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Re: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2016, 01:44:24 pm »
A couple points to clarify: I have not yet stated an opinion on this matter, only asked for clarification. The answer to my second question is not actually stated in the op unless the answer is "to give back to players that have already participated by giving an award to people who participate in the future" which is logically silly (and that is an opinion.) Last but not least, its rather difficult to look too much into this. It's pretty simple. Now can I please get an honest and clear answer to my second question, so that I can express my opinions later and in an intelligent manner.

Offline Mean Machine

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Re: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2016, 04:18:51 pm »
I'm don't feel this really addresses the over all concern for the players who think SCS has become too serious with the same outcome every week and has gone away from the initial idea of it being a practice event to help teams become better not discourage them from competitive. The rewards will probably have some increase in initial sign ups for people who want to get the title but once they have the title you are left with the same problems of why teams aren't signing up. I feel this is more of a temporary band aid.

I think bearit was trying to express an overall feeling that he doesn't agree with titles in his initial post and even though it wasn't clearly stated that way, I don't feel you should have dismissed him so quickly, instead ask why he thought it wasn't a good idea.

Timmy B was not serious tournament and it had rewards as far as I know, so why SCS shouldn't have them too? Why do you think only serious matches should be rewarded?
SCS is as much serious as you make it for yourself. Why do you think it's too serious, because people take sane builds? Meta builds? That's practice as well. Every match is a practice and if one team takes meta build, doesn't mean they are not practicing. They are practicing meta builds, which makes sense, because it's probably good start for most teams.

Everyone wants to win, so they take whatever they think it would bring them to victory. I took meta builds in SCS and I got beaten by Rydrs, but I got practice out of that and experience.
That's why SCS is exactly the best place for practice, because everyone tends to try hard to win and they usually play to their best ability. I know I learned a lot more from single SCS than from couple of skirmishes.

Offline BlackenedPies

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Re: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2016, 05:26:59 pm »
I'm don't feel this really addresses the over all concern for the players who think SCS has become too serious with the same outcome every week and has gone away from the initial idea of it being a practice event to help teams become better not discourage them from competitive.
Timmy B was not serious tournament and it had rewards as far as I know, so why SCS shouldn't have them too? Why do you think only serious matches should be rewarded?

The concern is that these rewards won't accomplish anything and will only benefit the few teams already at the top: including you and Lueosi. SCS isn't very dynamic with the same teams winning every week and few new joiners. It's great to see recent teams like RAWR and Why So Serious but they don't stand a chance against the established winners

You can only use one title and I doubt any players will flaunt "Skirmisher", but the distinguished elite will proudly display their "Skirmish Champion". Therefore it doesn't help SCS and only benefits the already established winners
« Last Edit: January 13, 2016, 05:56:35 pm by BlackenedPies »

Offline BlackenedPies

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Re: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2016, 06:12:48 pm »
Quote
Therefore it doesn't help SCS and only benefits the already established winners

Which is Ok, but don't pretend "Skirmisher" is an award. Intentions aside it sounds like giving yourself a prestigious title Lue
« Last Edit: January 13, 2016, 06:30:43 pm by BlackenedPies »

Offline nanoduckling

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Re: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2016, 06:24:26 pm »
Lets assume good intentions here, if folks are concerned about consequences lets focus on consequences not motive.

Having lent Logic a hand from time-to-time I had a similar idea a while back, in my case I suggested something simple like a dye for every participant. I'd spoken to a few players and while most were pretty appreciative of the work Logic and the refs and casters did organizing the SCS, I felt as though they didn't realize that they, the participants, were also contributing to the community. Without teams the casters have nothing to cast, the refs have nothing to ref, and the organizers have nothing to organize, this is a symbiotic relationship in which everyone contributes, and everyone benefits. I wanted to find some way to acknowledge this. I'm certain this was put together in that spirit. In the end we didn't go with that idea because it seemed somewhat tawdry and we were concerned about having prizes associated with the SCS.

As to these titles, I appreciate Lue's and the teams efforts here convincing Muse to direct some effort towards supporting the competitive community. If I was going to suggest anything it would be to lose the winners title since the SCS really is about fun, practice and community above winning. I'm not going to be that bothered either way though.

Offline Urz

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Re: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« Reply #12 on: January 13, 2016, 06:50:20 pm »
Considering that SCS is the only competitive 2v2 event currently running, the idea that it's "too serious" and "should be a practice event" betrays a cluelessness which would be funny, if not for the fact that there are people holding that opinion who have been tasked with "building the competitive scene".

KitKatKitty: Given the massive failure of your event (Blood and Brass), you're not really in a place to be criticizing other organizers. In fact, before the winter break, SCS ran four tournaments with equal or greater participation than Blood and Brass. Maybe you should be asking Lueosi for advice?

nhbearit: Your vendetta against Lueosi and continued attempts to break down his efforts is no secret. If you continue to contribute nothing but whining, you will continue to be irrelevant.

They're fucking titles, guys. This is a dumb thing to throw a hissy fit over.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2016, 06:52:14 pm by Urz »

Offline Mean Machine

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Re: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« Reply #13 on: January 13, 2016, 07:00:58 pm »
I'm don't feel this really addresses the over all concern for the players who think SCS has become too serious with the same outcome every week and has gone away from the initial idea of it being a practice event to help teams become better not discourage them from competitive.
Timmy B was not serious tournament and it had rewards as far as I know, so why SCS shouldn't have them too? Why do you think only serious matches should be rewarded?

The concern is that these rewards won't accomplish anything and will only benefit the few teams already at the top: including you and Lueosi. SCS isn't very dynamic with the same teams winning every week and few new joiners. It's great to see recent teams like RAWR and Why So Serious but they don't stand a chance against the established winners

You can only use one title and I doubt any players will flaunt "Skirmisher", but the distinguished elite will proudly display their "Skirmish Champion". Therefore it doesn't help SCS and only benefits the already established winners

How is that different than any competitive game out there? Of course best teams will get rewards. Every single top team or player had to practice and earn their place where they are now. If anyone wants rewards, then work for it. I played tournaments even though I knew Rydrs would take golden badge, but so what? At least I know I tried. Should we just drop rewards just because it wouldn't be fair for weaker teams? If they really care that much for rewards, maybe they can be motivated by them to get better.

I don't know about anyone else, but if I was in their places (new players/team) I would be motivated and would feel great accomplishment once I would finally get that reward.
It's same as MMOs for example. You just gotta deal with it, some stuff is hard to get, if you're not willing to put enough work or you don't have time or whatever, you might never get it, it's that simple. Not everyone can have everything. You won't see me complaining about guild wars 2 and legendary weapons for example "Hey, I'm too lazy to grind for hundreds of hours to get that legendary weapon, that's not fair, I don't have as much time as hardcore players".  It's good that games have some hard to achieve goals, that's what many people keeps playing.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2016, 07:03:36 pm by T Machine »

Offline nhbearit

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Re: New Sunday Community Skirmish Rewards
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2016, 07:03:56 pm »
It has been over twelve hours so I'll ask this again, and if I don't have a response in the next few hours then I'll take my best guess: What is the reasoning behind this? Why make it a thing? For the love of GoIO, stop talking in circles and just answer me honestly.