Author Topic: Killing the community, one game at a time.  (Read 53780 times)

Offline Narayan

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Killing the community, one game at a time.
« on: February 07, 2015, 12:17:43 am »
Ive been a long time player of guns of icarus, and like everyone else whose owned the game since 2013 Ive taken a few breaks here and there. When i came back the last time I noticed that the community as become a little less friendly, and a little harsher for new players. I was one of the people who didnt like playing with new guys, I in fact hated it. For me there was nothing worse than watching all of your engines go out at once while trying to make a phoenix claw turn on an enemy after burning kyro to get there. So I started using the community mechanism of friends list to ensure that I stayed with better players, however that led me to another mechanism, the crew form. Crew form in and of itself is a great thing, it allows people to form groups with competent captains  beside them, and good crew under them. The problem comes when they get to be too large. You see when you get some friends and a couple of clans into a crew form, no one wants to tell people to leave, so they open up the third ship, then the forth ship. With the population of GoI being what it is especially late night EST the only way matchmaker can find 4 other crews to put against you is usually by sending newbs in. A 4 vet ship vs 4 noob ship stomp comes after this usually 12-0 or 12-2 and its a massacre. The good thing is its pretty quick, maybe a little slower when its crazy king, the bad thing is its really frustrating for the new guys, or anyone unfortunate enough to be on the new team. This has caused the noobs in general to be more hostile, and to a large extent so frustrated with the game they wont come back. Now ill grand that some of the trolling and such is from the game being so cheap now, and the type of players that brings, and I know the CA's were overwhelmed after the steam sale, however we need a new mechanic for matchmaker. At the very least we need to limit crew for to 3 ships so then at least 1 or 2 veteran ships will find there way into a 4v4. Second I know matchmaker doesnt work on rank  but it needs to, no matter what you say a lvl 1-10 is never going to beat a lvl 30-43 its just not gonna happen, they dont know how to size up ships in the lobby, and they dont know the loadouts well enough for their ships, or tools. Please as a community we need to go to the devs, and limit the crew form size to 3 ships I think that will help curtail this problem, at least in the 4 v 4s, I appreciate any support I get in this.

Offline Squidslinger Gilder

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Re: Killing the community, one game at a time.
« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2015, 02:40:37 am »
Well part of the problem is MM is based on win rate/etc. If Vets haven't been playing often enough, they get thrown in with noobs. Also if you are playing at a time when most vets aren't on, you'll constantly get noob groups because there isn't enough vets on to balance. Its a no win situation.

I've had it happen quite a few times to me. Honestly MM is easier to roflstomp than pre MM. Often times they leave mid match. In fact, this problem has gotten pretty bad. Even when I'm not flying I've seen noobs just rage quit within the first engagement.

Unfortunately this is the result of everyone crying for a fair system which is impossible with GOIO. MM was needed for sure for the coming PS4 version. But its a common agreement that no one wanted it in the form it is. There was a lot of good ideas which weren't used that could have alleviated the MM problems. Maybe in time.

But, I'm rather disinterested in GOIO till the next patch. The testing for it is happening tomorrow and I'm ecstatic about playing it. So much so that even if Unbirthday wasn't optional, I'd find a way to skip out and fly in the dev app. Since you are a 2013 vet, maybe you were here for 1.1 GOIO. If so, look forward to next patch. If not, look forward to next patch.

Offline Kamoba

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Re: Killing the community, one game at a time.
« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2015, 03:37:15 am »
Being a person who plays during off peak times (Euro Central day time 10am till 5pm is always off peak) I have to say the problem of 4v4 -never- happens because filling a 2v2 by itself is a problem.

If you are finding yourself with 4 full ships and only stomping pubs, consider a custom lobby 2v2 with your friends, you'll know the game is balanced and get the bonus of map/game type choice!

The whole thing cannot be blamed on match maker. Pure and simple.
The problem also exists in the people who are quitting, regardless of if they are killed by vets or newbies, they'd throw their mouse, swear.at the screen and cry on their mothers shoulder if killed.by a crew of 30-40's or 1-5's, this can't be blamed on match maker.
What happens when the pilot leaves? Most of the time the rest of the crew leave because it becomes unfair on them.

What can be done to counter this?

A more action packed and exciting tutorial which people pay attention to and don't just skip through as quick as possible.
Program an ai pilot just for tutorials, put people in the situation of being shot at and having to learn as if in a real environment, but if they're reading text no damage to anything maybe even pause.

Otherwise the kids will keep crying and 'vets' blamed for pub stomping and MM labelled as horrible.

Offline Mean Machine

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Re: Killing the community, one game at a time.
« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2015, 04:54:21 am »
MM hasn't brought any more quality matches than we had before, yes. Only thing that's different is quicker lobby fill-ups and therefore quicker match starts. Quality wise you still get tons of unbalanced matches and this won't change unless population would grow substantialy.

For now, all you can do is make 2v2 crew forms. I'm not sure atm, but I think after match when you're thrown back to crew form it opens up for 4 ships, which is what you described and is indeed annoying.

@Kamoba

I don't think more detailed tutorials would help much. Of course it's nice thing to have, but if player is unwilling to learn from other players, then why would he want to learn from tutorial? Besides if tutorial would be too long and detailed, a lot of them would probably just get annoyed and shut the game down before even finishing it.There is no need for better tutorials, we have tons of CAs and other folks that are eager to help, but too few will accept that help.

I remember when I first started. Even after finishing tutorial I had no idea what the actual fuck. Ok, so this is for repair, this for rebuild, press that button to mount guns, good, but what now? How to be effective and kill enemy? No tutorial will tell you that. You have to look for players help or guides. So, that's what I did. I went to look for guides. And even after reading carefully that guide I forgot a lot of stuff. I thought "Man, there are so many ammo types, I already forgot which is good for what weapon and what weapon is good for what. And that's what you learn only from gameplay.

Offline Kamoba

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Re: Killing the community, one game at a time.
« Reply #4 on: February 07, 2015, 05:15:21 am »
That's very true if the player does not want to learn or if they have an attitude where they think they know it all and push others away because of that they'll not get far in the game or community.
Perhaps the problem is not in the tutorials and game but in the target audience.

Perhaps the advertising team could target less to FPS gamers and look at the micromanagement RPS tactical players who're more likely to take the time out to learn how to play the game and pay attention to loadouts in lobbies rather than screaming in their microphones: "Ready up ready up ready up!"

Offline Extirminator

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Re: Killing the community, one game at a time.
« Reply #5 on: February 07, 2015, 07:02:33 am »

Offline Kamoba

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Re: Killing the community, one game at a time.
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2015, 07:05:46 am »
Salute for a GoI meme!
That should really be a contest, funniest GoI memes....

Offline GeoRmr

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Re: Killing the community, one game at a time.
« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2015, 11:54:25 am »
Salute for a GoI meme!
That should really be a contest, funniest GoI memes....




Offline Richard LeMoon

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Re: Killing the community, one game at a time.
« Reply #8 on: February 07, 2015, 01:09:22 pm »
Those images are not accurate. 0% health looks a lot different. Should be >0%-33%. (still got a chuckle, though).

0%=


Offline Dementio

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Re: Killing the community, one game at a time.
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2015, 01:34:19 pm »
Those images are not accurate. 0% health looks a lot different. Should be >0%-33%. (still got a chuckle, though).

It wasn't Geo that made the images with the 0% - 33% part, but somebody else form our clan and I told him the exact same thing, I did!

Offline ramjamslam

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Re: Killing the community, one game at a time.
« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2015, 05:20:55 pm »
Those images are not accurate. 0% health looks a lot different. Should be >0%-33%. (still got a chuckle, though).

It wasn't Geo that made the images with the 0% - 33% part, but somebody else form our clan and I told him the exact same thing, I did!

Also the fish in the picture is a siamese fighting fish, not a goldfish :P

Offline Patched Wizard

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Re: Killing the community, one game at a time.
« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2015, 06:27:05 pm »
Junker 100% - 66%





Junker 65% - 33%





Junker 32% - 01%





Junker 0%




Offline Richard LeMoon

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Re: Killing the community, one game at a time.
« Reply #12 on: February 07, 2015, 08:29:21 pm »

Offline Tropo

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Re: Killing the community, one game at a time.
« Reply #13 on: February 08, 2015, 01:33:14 am »
at this pace we'll be able to kill the community with bad memes in no time at all which will solve the other problem of match making killing it

Offline Hilary Briss

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Re: Killing the community, one game at a time.
« Reply #14 on: February 08, 2015, 06:36:33 am »
From my point of view what does more damage to the player base is public lobby stomping.

Veterans see the opposition is really and mean really out-classed but do they offer to help or balance it? No they just stomp for the XP and leave.

Ok a few matches here and there but relentlessly pub stomping.... Well chaps where is your honour when a lvl 40+ pilot has a pyra and the match is so unbalanced then why does the pilot proceed with caution?

Pity the poor low players and a spanner in your engines to all who just pub stomp.