Greased v Charged

[Indreams]

This might end up being a "good in different situations" discussion.

But I think that these two ammunitions serve a similar purpose: raising dps.

Which ones do you guys prefer? And if you have another ammunition that raised dps, do suggest it as well.

[Sammy B. T.]

Greased is best for low damage high clip weapons

Charged is best with high damage low clip weapons.

One must take into account the loss of clip with charged. For example the light carronade loses too many shots for charged to be worthwhile, despite small clip.

Also the loss of range with greased is worthwhile to look at as well as a detriment.

[Alistair MacBain]

Sammy already said it.
Greased performs best in things like a gat.
Charged performs best in things like mercury or heavy flak or heavy carronade.
And tbh I count things like banshee or light flak or light carro as high clip weapons.
Sound sweird with just 8 shots but as Sammy said ...
The reduced clipsize of Charged isnt worth the bigger damage per shot for those guns. In all of those you will most likely stick to greased for maximized dps.

[Wundsalz]

Ammo influence on dps in % compared to normal rounds exlucluding reload time (1st table) and including reload time (2nd table).

Depending on what weapon you use against what maximizing one of these DPS types is often desireable. Mostly depending on the weapons clip size either greased or charged rounds excel at this job.

[Alistair MacBain]

Just a reminder ...
Such a table is nice and all but not the ultimate conclusion.
You will barely see anyone using greased on a heavy flak or mercury but most people will use charged.
Reasoning behind this is that often the damage per clip compared to the rebuild/repair timings are more important than damage per second.
It doesnt matter if the two shots from greased come in faster on a Galleon if the enemy just has 1 or 2 people rebuilding the hull. The increased damage per shot (or clip) from charged are much more important.

DPS isn't the best indicator for damage in goio. It works yes but only to a certain extent.

Or the numbers are wrong if its supposed to be damage per clip in the first table ...

[HamsterIV]

@Wundsalz
Did your chart take into account heatsink increase 2 bullet clip guns to 3 bullet clip guns? Thus making DPS /w reload greater on things like the merc because you get 3 shots before reload.

Greased is slightly better on the gat than charged, but charged does not decrease muzzle velocity. So a charged gat can reach further than a greased gat. That said, I prefer my gat gunner to start with lesmok and swap to greased. Perhaps one day I will try and kite on a metamidion v meditation duel with charged gat rounds and see if I can get hull strip before the greased gunner can get range. I imagine that scenario would be very difficult to pull off.

[Alistair MacBain]

450m range with charged compared to 360m range compared with greased ...
I doubt you will get the upper hand. Especially taking into account that forward flying faster backwards flying.

[Wundsalz]

Such a table is nice and all but not the ultimate conclusion.

The tables are a useful tool to quantify certain aspects of ammo types. If you've ever wondered whether you could use burst or charged rounds to increase your continuous damage output of the gatling gun or not, you can take a look at the DPS(reload) table and will see that charged rounds barely have got an influence on this aspect while burst rounds actually decrease the continuous damage output.
Of course such tables alone are not sufficient to tell whether a ammo type is useful or not. They only cover a certain aspect of the ammo types and some of the date needs to be looked at twice to interpret it correctly. E.g. the entries for the artemis states heavy clips are among the best ammo choices to increase the DPS(clip). However the DPS(clip) is only increased by heavy because the number of shots (and hence the number of delays between shots is reduced). As a result the ratio of shots/time(inbetween shots) and ultimately damage/time is increased. So you don't want to bring heavy clips for the artemis to optimize the DPS because the only thing it effectively does compared to normal rounds is to decrease the damage per clip without granting any benefit. note that the same effect makes charged rounds look a bit better in the DPS(clip) table than it actually is as well (in those cases where the amount of ammunition is reduced by it).

DPS isn't the best indicator for damage in goio. It works yes but only to a certain extent.

Or the numbers are wrong if its supposed to be damage per clip in the first table ...

The first table illustrates the damage per second without reload times taken into consideration NOT damage per clip. Its interesting in particular for weapons which can reach interesting damage threshold without reloading the weapon (e.g. a buffed gatling gun can quite reliably strip a pyramideons armor)

The second sheet is more interesting for weapons where prolonged fire and reloads are necessary to do interesting stuff (e.g. hull strips with mercuries or carronades)

Damage per Clip is another very interesting aspect which is worth to be maximized (especially if interesting thresholds can be reached and the weapon can be emptied rather quickly - e.g. for light flak and heavy flak). While this aspect is not illustrated in a seperate table it is somewhat included in the DPS(reload) table. A Higher Damage per Clip tends to increase the DPS(reload) as well.

@Wundsalz
Did your chart take into account heatsink increase 2 bullet clip guns to 3 bullet clip guns? Thus making DPS /w reload greater on things like the merc because you get 3 shots before reload.

The numbers in the tables are derived from this spreadsheet. Clipsize alterations are included in the calculations which have been made there. heatsink doesn't improve the mercuries DPS with reload compared to normal rounds though. Unless it's buffed in which case it even outperforms charged mercuries (As I've been told - I didn't do the math on this myself).

Greased is slightly better on the gat than charged, but charged does not decrease muzzle velocity. So a charged gat can reach further than a greased gat. That said, I prefer my gat gunner to start with lesmok and swap to greased. Perhaps one day I will try and kite on a metamidion v meditation duel with charged gat rounds and see if I can get hull strip before the greased gunner can get range. I imagine that scenario would be very difficult to pull off.

charged rounds are not a good pick for gatling guns. That's something these tables illustrate fairly well. Compared to normal rounds charged rounds haven't got a significant impact on the continous damage output and even slightly reduce the dps in a single clip. The only benefit they provide is a damage per clip boost of less than 5%.

[Alistair MacBain]

Thats what I meant Wund. Didnt want to step on your work I just wanted to make sure that this spreadsheet doesnt answer all questions. And for alot of guns the damage per clip is the better indicator for effective ammo types.
Take a lumberjack. The DPS doesnt matter to much aslong as you get 2-3 shots in the enemy balloon most of your work with the lumberjack is already done.

[Schwalbe]

I have a little different "chart" when deciding ammos.

Greased:
- Only in cases when I'm supposed to unleash close range hell, so I'm sure no bullet shall miss.
- High clip / weaponry effective against parts which is not Mercury nor carronade.
- Most noticable examples: Gatling for hull raping, Flamer for stacking as much fire as it is possible (wow, noobs so panicked, ship much on fire, wow, much ragequits wow), rendering guns useless, Banshee because of higher chance of setting balloon on fire, or for disabling, or for finishing ones hull, OR something I call, pardon me, gangbang salvos on Leon's full banshee mobula. Seriously, Muse, banshee OP.

Charged:
- Two pieces of ammo per clip, as charged won't alter them.
- Mid-long range
- I'm sure I won't miss both shots, as gun shot slower and enemy may have chance to rebuilt parts I destroyed.
- Mercury or heavy carro. I'm not experienced enough with lumberjack and heavy flak, by far I think lochnagars make more havok loaded on heavy flak.

However I'm no expert. For example I recently learned, that incendiaries on light carro might be a good idea...

[Indreams]

Can greased mortar one-clip a ship with stripped armor?

I've seen this done frequently by metamidions. Does anybody have math on this?

[DJ Logicalia]

Can greased mortar one-clip a ship with stripped armor?

I've seen this done frequently by metamidions. Does anybody have math on this?

Yep. Galleon has 1400 permahull, and a full greased mortar can do that, no sweat

[Kamoba]

Yes but the timing has to be right, but it can be done

[Sprayer]

Some Pilots like charged on the mortar over greased bc they don't fly the metamidion as a rammidion.

[RedRoach]

I have this strange fondness over Charged Ammo, mostly because of the high damage increase. That was all I'd bring when I was a powder monkey. However, my exposure to actually experienced captains and their light-gun rapid-fire ships keeps forcing me to bring greased, which over time I am getting accustomed  to.