Author Topic: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)  (Read 8078 times)

Offline SirNotlag

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Re: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)
« Reply #15 on: March 07, 2014, 07:02:09 pm »
2 other ideas for tools for the new class could be An acoustic listening device and a hand held flare gun.

Acoustic listening device: the user points the device and it has a cone of like 5 degrees or something, if an enemy ship is within the cone whether its visible or not it shows up on the map and the user can hear its engines to indicate hes found something. It does not work if the enemy ship turns their engines off.

hand held flare gun: works like the beacon flare gun but only one shot before having to reload, less range and it does not damage an enemy ship if you shoot it with the flares.

Offline The Sky Wolf

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Re: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)
« Reply #16 on: March 15, 2014, 10:33:17 pm »
The new class Muse is developing is Deckhand, it will be able to have 2 of every slot instead of 3 slots for 1 skill and 1 slot for the other 2 skills.

Offline Milevan Faent

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Re: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)
« Reply #17 on: March 15, 2014, 10:34:16 pm »
The new class Muse is developing is Deckhand, it will be able to have 2 of every slot instead of 3 slots for 1 skill and 1 slot for the other 2 skills.

Can you show proof of this?

Offline The Sky Wolf

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Re: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)
« Reply #18 on: March 15, 2014, 10:36:58 pm »
Yes.


Offline Milevan Faent

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Offline Milevan Faent

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Re: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)
« Reply #20 on: March 16, 2014, 02:44:00 am »
The new class Muse is developing is Deckhand, it will be able to have 2 of every slot instead of 3 slots for 1 skill and 1 slot for the other 2 skills.

Ya wanna know the funniest thing about this? Muse would never make it, because this concept is inherently broken. If they released anything even close to this, suddenly games are made up of 4 Deckhands, and that's it. Every other class completely disappears.

Offline Tanya Phenole

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Re: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)
« Reply #21 on: March 16, 2014, 03:14:29 am »
Third class completely destroys other game's balance.

One engineer left can't handle all repairs. That is why there will be no gunners at all. 1 new class, 2 engineers

With such powerful strategic skills, Communications officer requres captains slot, because such abilities based on strategy and teamwork. Pilots will be degraded to crews, what definitely turn off a lot of them from piloting.

I am pretty sure that Gunner class fixing can be simply  a better damage or increased profit  from ammo. something like 5-7% of extra damage or projectile speed, or some targeting information like angles, + increase engineers on-ship running speed for 5%.

Offline macmacnick

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Re: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)
« Reply #22 on: March 16, 2014, 03:18:33 am »
Gunner tools. End of argument. (Buffs to damage are highly unlikely to happen for only one class)

Offline Milevan Faent

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Re: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)
« Reply #23 on: March 16, 2014, 03:21:31 am »
Third class completely destroys other game's balance.

One engineer left can't handle all repairs. That is why there will be no gunners at all. 1 new class, 2 engineers

With such powerful strategic skills, Communications officer requres captains slot, because such abilities based on strategy and teamwork. Pilots will be degraded to crews, what definitely turn off a lot of them from piloting.

I am pretty sure that Gunner class fixing can be simply  a better damage or increased profit  from ammo. something like 5-7% of extra damage or projectile speed, or some targeting information like angles, + increase engineers on-ship running speed for 5%.

Except Muse has said they won't do Passive abilities for classes like that, so that kind of fix will never happen. Also, this class suggestion doesn't kill Gunners or Engineers at all, as it's designed to act as an effective alternative. This class would be capable of playing like an Engie, just without the super-repair power they have. It can play like a Gunner, but without the control a Gunner has. A Pilot can't be "degraded" as their job is the most important one. They are even more important than Engineers. While the Communications Officer concept can act as an alternative to a Captain as well, it has its own downsides when used in that way, same as with all the other classes. It can fill the roles already in the game, but in its own way.

Ideally, the goal of a fourth class is to make it so there's 1 of every class on every ship. That's my end goal here. "Fixing" gunners won't do that, in fact fixing gunners is near impossible right now. It would take a really good idea to make them as valuable as an Engie to the team.

Offline Milevan Faent

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Re: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)
« Reply #24 on: March 16, 2014, 03:22:19 am »
Gunner tools. End of argument. (Buffs to damage are highly unlikely to happen for only one class)

.... What argument? And can you please use complete sentences? I'm not even sure who you're responding to.

Offline Omniraptor

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Re: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)
« Reply #25 on: March 16, 2014, 04:48:07 am »
Except Muse has said they won't do Passive abilities for classes like that, so that kind of fix will never happen.

Where exactly have they said this? Can you provide a link?

Offline Milevan Faent

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Re: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)
« Reply #26 on: March 16, 2014, 04:54:42 am »
Except Muse has said they won't do Passive abilities for classes like that, so that kind of fix will never happen.

Where exactly have they said this? Can you provide a link?

Can't recall where I heard it, but I think it was mentioned on one of the Dev Fireside livestreams. I may be remembering wrong, but I'm still pretty sure of it. Sure as hell can't remember which one though regardless.

Offline The Churrosaur

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Re: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)
« Reply #27 on: March 16, 2014, 05:37:56 pm »
Or they could just bring back reload springs.

Offline Tanya Phenole

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Re: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)
« Reply #28 on: March 17, 2014, 03:05:43 am »
 
Quote
Also, this class suggestion doesn't kill Gunners or Engineers at all, as it's designed to act as an effective alternative.

Now tell me how one engineer will handle all repairs... on pyramidion, for example.  On  galleon. On spire. ALONE . With pilot gunner and communications officer, all three with wrench

Quote
This class would be capable of playing like an Engie, just without the super-repair power they have. It can play like a Gunner, but without the control a Gunner has.

Engineer HAS NO_SUPER_REPAIR power. That is why Pilots take two or three engineers to  have a slight chance of surviving in encounter. With the possibility of crew consisting of two engineers , CO an pilot, no one will take gunner on board unless Muse restricts "1 slot for 1 crew"

Quote
A Pilot can't be "degraded" as their job is the most important one. They are even more important than Engineers. While the Communications Officer concept can act as an alternative to a Captain as well, it has its own downsides when used in that way, same as with all the other classes. It can fill the roles already in the game, but in its own way.

I feel like I need to explain my point. Many pilots are strong leaders. They need power to handle, it is the essence of piloting, and even more important than simply driving a ship. Comm. Officer concept rips pulls power away from pilots hands, degrading pilot from Captain slot to crew slot.  Take this power away and a lot of active pilots  will lose interest to game.


I suppose Gunner class have not deserved it's misrespect from newer players. And current class system is almost perfect, and needs no massive intrusions like bringing up new class




Offline Milevan Faent

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Re: New Class: Communications Officer (not another Gungineer thread)
« Reply #29 on: March 17, 2014, 03:25:51 am »
Quote
Also, this class suggestion doesn't kill Gunners or Engineers at all, as it's designed to act as an effective alternative.

Now tell me how one engineer will handle all repairs... on pyramidion, for example.  On  galleon. On spire. ALONE . With pilot gunner and communications officer, all three with wrench

Quote
This class would be capable of playing like an Engie, just without the super-repair power they have. It can play like a Gunner, but without the control a Gunner has.

Engineer HAS NO_SUPER_REPAIR power. That is why Pilots take two or three engineers to  have a slight chance of surviving in encounter. With the possibility of crew consisting of two engineers , CO an pilot, no one will take gunner on board unless Muse restricts "1 slot for 1 crew"

Quote
A Pilot can't be "degraded" as their job is the most important one. They are even more important than Engineers. While the Communications Officer concept can act as an alternative to a Captain as well, it has its own downsides when used in that way, same as with all the other classes. It can fill the roles already in the game, but in its own way.

I feel like I need to explain my point. Many pilots are strong leaders. They need power to handle, it is the essence of piloting, and even more important than simply driving a ship. Comm. Officer concept rips pulls power away from pilots hands, degrading pilot from Captain slot to crew slot.  Take this power away and a lot of active pilots  will lose interest to game.


I suppose Gunner class have not deserved it's misrespect from newer players. And current class system is almost perfect, and needs no massive intrusions like bringing up new class

Except most of the time, on the average ship, a single Engie COULD manage the important stuff, as long as someone was dedicated to serving as a secondary repair person. Lets use your "problem ships" as an example.

Pyramidian: It only ever needs one Engie anyway, as the Engie's entire job is sitting on the lower deck keeping the hull and engines working. The second engie is always stationed at the balloon anyway. This job can EASILY be managed by a Comm Officer, or even a Gunner. The ability to super-repair is NOT a necessity for this. Hell, the Comm Officer takes Mallet, the Gunner takes Spanner, and together they can maintain the balloon and guns, leaving the engines and hull to the actual Engineer.

Galleon: Really, the Galleon is a tricky ship even with 2 Engies, so it's a ship that may not want a Comm Officer. However, if one is used, it could be assigned to the lower deck as a Gunner Comm Officer, maintaining the weapons lower-deck engines. Meanwhile, the Pilot actually sets up to help repair the balloon in a pinch, and the actual Engie goes where needed, with the Hull being their primary focus. While two engies could maintain the ship as a whole easier, it's not absolutely necessary. This ship does require more coordination between all the members regardless though.

Spire: A single Engie can actually maintain the entire Spire pretty easily if they know what they're doing, as long as they can keep the armor up. It's possible to hit the Hull with Mallet, drop down and hit the Balloon with Mallet, and get back to the Hull just as the cooldown from Mallet ends, and hit it again to start the loop over. That said, I'd put the Comm Officer on repair duty primarily on this ship, with their role being to repair destroyed parts rather than to keep things alive. Once the armor can be restored, the main Engie can easily use the parkour loop to restore the armor while maintaining the armor on the other part. Fixing broken engines and guns can be shared, with shooting happening whenever. Again, they don't need super-repair power, they just need to not spend 90% of their time on the guns. Even a Gunner could fulfill this role in the current game, if they didn't sit on the guns all the time. While they will obviously not be able to pull the trick the Engie can with Quick Repair then full Armor in a very short time, they can do basic repairs.

Basically, let the Engie deal with the Emergency Repairs, while the Comm Officer deals with routine maintainance, buffs, and information warfare. All of which it can do while doing said routine maintainance.

Now, as to what you've said about Pilots. You seem to have this belief that a Pilot, the only person on the entire ship who can effectively fly the damn thing, would lose their role as Captain if the Comm Officer was made. While Comm Officer has a LOT of tactical ability, and can act as a replacement Captain, they still can't fly the ship any better than any other non-Pilot. Is it possible they could replace a Pilot-Captain? Of course. I even designed them with that as an option. Will they automatically become a complete replacement? Hell no! Even as much as I like this class, I would still always play as a Pilot, and ask someone else to serve as my Comm Officer. I would guide their tactics, and listen to them if they have any ideas, but I'd still play as a Pilot. A ship can't really fly without a Pilot. A Comm Officer could manage to play as a workable alternative, but they will ALWAYS be out-flown by a Pilot-Captain due to the maneuverability that they have. They'll just have more annoying tricks, and could play deceptively and with decent stealth. In a 4v4, I may even suggest one ship have a Comm Officer-Captain just so we have that wild-card, but I still expect anyone not on a Pyra, Galleon, or Spire would prefer a Pilot just for sheer maneuverability. And even on them, it would be a good idea in general. Certainly I'd never fly my Squid with anything but a Pilot.