Spire Hit Box

[Spud Nick]

The more I play with the spire and look at the spire in matches I notice that this thing is one gigantic hull hit box. Even parts of the balloon count as the hull. Do you guys think the Hull hit box should be changed at all on the spire?

[Mod Josie]

I wouldn't mind seeing a small tweak on this. Granted, the entire front face of the ship is guns and a metal plate, but it makes it a very easy target. This isn't necessarily wrong given its shape, but it makes spire builds less viable compared to similar set-ups on other ships.
The Spire is my favourite ship but I only ever feel truly comfortable flying it knowing that I have an excellent ally who will save me when the going gets tough. Again, that isn't wrong either given the Spire's niche.
If one is hitting the Spires's balloon though, hull damage should be low if there at all. A Hades Pyra is probably a long-range Spire's worst nightmare at the moment. Every hit on the front face can do devastating damage regardless of where it hits and escaping up or down is impossible since the ship is so tall and the Hades is so good at range.

I shall continue to harbour an undying love for the Spire though. She makes the perfect field command post for a plucky and determined Commodore such as myself.

[Crafeksterty]

All i ever wanted for the spire is increased speed + acceleration to better use its hitbox.

But yeah, the spire is super voulnerable even on its baloon. Merc hits hit my baloon and it took my hull out. Really weird and needs explaning. But even with that we still manage to use the spire pretty well these days. Its just that when he has his hull in protection, is actualy false because his baloon sort of counts as hull also :/

[Caprontos]

I assume the metal parts on the balloon count as hull.. much like there is hull on pyra's or mobula balloon that can be hit.

Having bits of hull on the balloon can save you when an enemy is aiming for your balloon and hits the hull bits..

Perhaps it would be nice if on the ship menu we could press a button and it would highlight the ships hitboxes so we could see what is hull and what is balloon and such.. Then we could see if there is bad hitbox placement in regards to stuff like this.

I agree it should be changed if hitting the balloon counts as a hull hit.. when there is no hull to be hit.. but if there is hull to be hit then hitting it should count as a hull hit (IMO).

[Captain Smollett]

I assume the metal parts on the balloon count as hull.. much like there is hull on pyra's or mobula balloon that can be hit.

Having bits of hull on the balloon can save you when an enemy is aiming for your balloon and hits the hull bits..

Perhaps it would be nice if on the ship menu we could press a button and it would highlight the ships hitboxes so we could see what is hull and what is balloon and such.. Then we could see if there is bad hitbox placement in regards to stuff like this.

I agree it should be changed if hitting the balloon counts as a hull hit.. when there is no hull to be hit.. but if there is hull to be hit then hitting it should count as a hull hit (IMO).

This is more or less correct.  Any bit of the ship that doesn't look like a flloaty balloon, pew pew gun or spinny engine is hull hitbox.  The entire vertical ribbing in the center of the spire counts as hull as well as the little nose (for lack of better word) that juts out from the balloon. 

There was discussion way back about taking away the bottom point of the spire as a hitbox but it would feel silly as a player to visibly shoot a part of the ship and not have it count. 

More turning wouldn't be bad but I think eventually they'll have to add back some armor.  It was lowered to give the spire a faster rebuild (which it does by 1 or 2 spanner hits) but I don't think its done the ship any favors personally.

[Crafeksterty]

To me, personaly, it has.

But going back to topic, try shooting a lumberjack on a spires balon on that hull part of the baloon. You will still hit his baloon. Not to mention, his hull also.
None of the hull parts save the spire or anything. It just makes things worse.

[Spud Nick]

I always thought that one of the strengths of the spire should be it's slim profile.

[Captain Smollett]

You could hit any ship anywhere with a lumberjack and it will still  damage the balloon (with the exception of the lower fins on goldfish and galleons). 

The LJ has a 12M aoe, which could reach from the bottom to the top of a 4 story building.  Granted you start losing damage about 6 M from impact but the lumberjack will do its thing almost anywhere you hit (including in rare instances another enemy right next to the one you shot at.

But yes, generally speaking, the large hull hitboxes around the spire do not do it any favors.

[Squidslinger Gilder]

Slim profile but if you shoot at the very tip of it with any weapon...you instantly do armor or hull dmg. So really, slim profile does not help it in this case because it is a vertical slim and most weapons have drop. It isn't like the slim profile on the Junker where if your just a little off you miss entirely.

Think the best argument there was for improving ships like the spire was to give them armor buffs to certain sides. Like say if a Spire gets hit in the front it takes 50% less dmg due to the big shield in front. Other ships have clear armor additions added so you could do one for every ship. Pyra would be forward armor, Squid would be sides, Junker is tough cause it doesn't have much, Goldfish front and side conal armor, etc.

[The Sky Wolf]

Spire and Mobula generally make the best long range ships even though they both have fantastic brawling capabilities if used right. The weapons difference is deciding if you want a heavy gun or small gun. I believe the Mobula has trumped the spire in both brawling and sniping after putting their shapes into consideration.

Spires are long and narrow while Mobulas are short and wide. All bullets drop vertically and not horizontally; if you want to hit the spire at long ranges you can aim above him to hit the balloon, aim at the balloon to hit the hull, or aim at the hull to hit his tail end. Where as if you want to hit the Mobula at long range you have to be extremely specific when considering your drop because it's such a flat ship and theres a massive chance youll hit the balloon.

I like to think of the balloon as a hull cushion because balloons can always be fully repaired where as hull damage cannot.. So not only is the Mobula harder to hit but the chances of doing ineffective balloon damage with the wrong gun are also very high.

[The Sky Wolf]

So my point is the hull box ought to be shrunk because the Spire is getting %$#&*@ up more than any other ship due to gravity's vertical nature.

[Vesperion]

I have watched some days ago an Spire in action and must say that it really is strange and difficult to fly such an thing at the same time (i just spectated the match so that i maybe have an wrong side of seeing this).

But i must say even the "slim" design doesn´t helps the Spire much due of the platforms whit the weapons and the mainpart whit the helmet weapons and co. The next what i see problematic is the hight of the Spire. This ship is so high that it is sometimes an bit tricky to steer it above objects which lies so deep under the helmet that you don´t even see them. In the battle i spectated the Spire hited whit the last few inches of his downfin an object and stoped immeadiatly so that i was an even more easy target to hit.

The Ballon itself is the biggest problem for the Spire i think... it just needs few efforts to aim for this "giantic" target + some explosive or scattering ammo to hit ballon and armor at the same time. In the moment the ballon is hit you basicly hit the armor as well so that you "kill two flies whit one stroke" and the Spire goes down in a bunch of seconds.

Like said i just spectated so that my impressions of the Spire could be wrong cause i didn´t had a match where i did fly whit or against an Spire.