Art meta is boring

[GeoRmr]

I strongly feel that the downwards arc on the Artemis is fine, however the logical tactic to countering them is to be above your opponent. As it currently is the Artemis upwards arc is too high and at a only a slight distance Artemis are too easily able to hit targets above them. Nerf the upwards arc please.

[Mattilald Anguisad]

LoL wut? Vertical arcs are 10° up and 35° down. Upwards is definitively not an issue.

[Feast on Thrones]

I strongly feel that the downwards arc on the Artemis is fine, however the logical tactic to countering them is to be above your opponent. As it currently is the Artemis upwards arc is too high and at a only a slight distance Artemis are too easily able to hit targets above them. Nerf the upwards arc please.

Um No. Mattilald clearly points out your error here. You want to remove more of the 10 degree up arc on the artemis. That is completely silly. Doing that will only hurt merc/arti because you will have to be in exactly the right spot to get the no upwards, but no downwards arcs of each gun respectively.

Honestly upwards arcs on the artemis are so heavily nerfed as they are they don't need to be done any further.

[Captain Smollett]

I think the comment was due to the fact that an increase in artemis upwards arc is essentially an overall buff to the gun even if turning arcs and downward arcs are reduced.

[GeoRmr]

I think the comment was due to the fact that an increase in artemis upwards arc is essentially an overall buff to the gun even if turning arcs and downward arcs are reduced.

Yes Smollett, I still stand by my point however about reducing the 10' arc even more. Recently in a game on dunes a mobula bouncing along the floor was still able to wreck a lumberjack spire I was crewing while we were at the top of the sky limit at only c.1100m distance. 10' is alot, escape from it's upwards arc (the apparently obvious counter) is far harder than you'd expect at longer ranges I encourage you to test this in sandbox. Your point about increased difficulty when using the gun in synergy with the mercury I feel would not be too trouble some if it were reduced to around 6'. I'd predict an increase in incendiary round usage to increase the projectile drop of the mercury.

Another possible nerf would be to make the rockets exempt from the projectile expansion mechanic.

[Byron Cavendish]

If they were truly at the ground level and another ship was at the sky limit there is no way an artemis can hit that. Something isn't adding up. Maybe it was a merc or two. I think you need to go shoot an artemis and truly see how limited it's upward arc is.

[redria]

At 1100m, an artemis with 10' upwards arc should have about a 200m upwards range. Add to this the fact that if you start going up even slightly, your ship will tilt backwards, adding another 5-10 degrees to your arc. An artemis can currently easily hit a max height ship from the bottom of the map, especially on dunes where the ceiling is so low.

[Byron Cavendish]

Okay, show me a screenshot or video then. I don't care for mathhammer.

[Goldenglade]

At 1100m, an artemis with 10' upwards arc should have about a 200m upwards range. Add to this the fact that if you start going up even slightly, your ship will tilt backwards, adding another 5-10 degrees to your arc. An artemis can currently easily hit a max height ship from the bottom of the map, especially on dunes where the ceiling is so low.

this scares me.... a lot o.o

[redria]

Okay, show me a screenshot or video then. I don't care for mathhammer.

I'm not somewhere I can actually get a screenshot or anything, but later tonight I'm sure Geo would be happy to jump in practice with me and set up a screenshot. It's basic trig. 1100*tan(10). Draw a triangle. The farther away your target, the higher they can be in relation to you. At small angles like this, there is a fairly linear relationship between angle and max height achievable. So if we were to halve the max angle of the artemis, it would only be able to hit about 100 meters above itself in our example situation. If a ship could achieve an upwards angle of 10' and an artemis works the same way it currently does, the max height would be around 400m.

Keep in mind that putting lesmok in an artemis makes its range absurdly long. So the 1100 meter distant example Geo gave would be on the close end, where using burst is probably still a viable option (i think... I don't know specific ranges).

-edit- I was going to complain about Dunes, but it doesn't belong here, so I removed it.

[Queso]

Basic trig basically dictates a hell of a lot of balance in this game. On a long range weapon with little drop, the farther away you are, the less vertical arcs matter.

[GeoRmr]

If they were truly at the ground level and another ship was at the sky limit there is no way an artemis can hit that. Something isn't adding up. Maybe it was a merc or two. I think you need to go shoot an artemis and truly see how limited it's upward arc is.

They had a 3 artemis mobula, one was above the helm. after they hit the ground they were able to shoot out the lj on the (slight) bounce up, buying them enough time to stay in the air long enough with the balloon repaired to get all 3 artemis on us. Props to whoever they were, gave us a real tough game which I wasn't expecting from people with only C.30 games under their belt.

[GeoRmr]

-edit- I was going to complain about Dunes, but it doesn't belong here, so I removed it.

Haha, that map's sky limit is - questionable.

[GeoRmr]

To hit the the top from the absolute bottom is indeed lesmok range.  Situationally it is not too difficult to gain a small amount of altitude at closer range to be effective with burst rounds, when you bounce off the floor for example, or indeed taking into account redria's point about the pitch of the ship tilting backwards when ascending.

Spires altimeter

Mobulas altimeter

Map Distances

Hit marker

[Sammy B. T.]

That really doesn't strike me as outrageously high especially since you were using Lesmok, an ammo type that will functionally never be used on an artemis.