Author Topic: Detonate Mines  (Read 8564 times)

Offline Gambrill

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Re: Detonate Mines
« Reply #15 on: September 13, 2013, 07:46:37 am »
You can already set your mines of by firing the gun itself...

No. You set off ONE mine, multiple if they are closer to each other.

while the idea would be nice i also feel like it would make the mine launcher too overpowered, Hamster's Reward/risk theory is perfect for explaining.

It could always be a new weapon, rather than a modification of the old one.
There's more than one kind of rocket launcher, so why not a mini-mine launcher that allows detonation but does less damage?

Cheesycom, nice idea but it would mean Muse would need to create a new design etc. since its a completely new gun. plus a mine launcher is a completely unique weapon compared to the other weapons in the game. the only one with impact etc. and the only one that causes a change in direction for other ships. And its still quite a new weapon. we can let a smaller brother of it over-shadow it already, can we? :)

Offline HamsterIV

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Re: Detonate Mines
« Reply #16 on: September 13, 2013, 10:31:33 am »
When I use mines I tell my gunners to bring burst rounds, that increases the spacing you need for one mine to trigger multiple mines. It is still pretty rare for a ship to stay in one spot long enough for an attacker to get 5 mines from one mine launcher in its area, but any mine that is placed close enough to self detonate usually takes 2 or 3 of its nearby friends with it. Also an enemy ship can be "encouraged" to stay in one spot through the use of manticore or carronades.

I really want to try out Captain Phil's remote detonation merc system, but have yet to find another captain sufficiently dickish enough.

Offline Cheeseycom

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Re: Detonate Mines
« Reply #17 on: September 13, 2013, 02:20:55 pm »
Cheesycom, nice idea but it would mean Muse would need to create a new design etc. since its a completely new gun. plus a mine launcher is a completely unique weapon compared to the other weapons in the game. the only one with impact etc. and the only one that causes a change in direction for other ships. And its still quite a new weapon. we can let a smaller brother of it over-shadow it already, can we? :)

Well assuming it were a good enough addition, there's nothing to stop Muse adding in a new design - they're introducing the Magma cannon, so a new weapon isn't out of the question.
Depends how busy they are, I guess.. ;)

I don't think a mini-mine launcher would necessarily overshadow its bigger brother, as it wouldn't have the same impact that a regular mine detonation would - just because the Carronade is better for popping balloons (albeit at close range), that doesn't mean the Flak cannon has no use.. it just fills a similar but slightly different niche.
While the large 'dumb' mines could be termed as 'ship-busters', the smaller 'smart' mines could, for example, be aimed more at balloon deflation, or act a bit like a chaff cloud to distact the enemy (perhaps the function could even be determined by the ammo type equipped). It would be easier to hit with since it would cover a wider area with a greater quantity of mines, but the smaller warheads wouldn't do quite as much damage by comparison to the original.

I reckon this idea would work whether the mines would be detonable by remote or not.. I think it's just a matter of play-testing to get the balance right - it seems like multi-function mini-mines could be, if not super destructive, at least tactically quite useful. Remote detonation would just add another facet to their tactical potential.

Offline The Sky Wolf

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Re: Detonate Mines
« Reply #18 on: October 28, 2013, 04:21:35 am »
Definite support of this idea, it'll be in a C4 explosives style. I can see absolutely no reason for the zoom on a mine laying gun... The right-click detonate is a fantastic idea.

Offline Serenum

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Re: Detonate Mines
« Reply #19 on: October 28, 2013, 06:38:55 am »
Definite support of this idea, it'll be in a C4 explosives style. I can see absolutely no reason for the zoom on a mine laying gun... The right-click detonate is a fantastic idea.

Same here.

zlater75@hotmail.com

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Re: Detonate Mines
« Reply #20 on: October 28, 2013, 08:05:52 am »
I like this idea too. Also a timer to detonate automatically after some time. Enough time for making a small minefield but not to last forever.

Detonate would be awesome with
- lesmok : longrange normal detonation
- burst : shrapnel detonation
- incendiary : flame detonation
- heavy : effective detonation, smaller aoe
- lochnagar : effective detonation
- heatsink : normal detonation with heatsink attributes.
- charged : short range, effective
- greased : faster loadtime, normal detonation.

Offline Thomas

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Re: Detonate Mines
« Reply #21 on: October 28, 2013, 09:50:12 am »
As already pointed out, you can 'remote detonate' mines by firing 1 more mine that can be sustained. This will trigger the oldest mine, and may cause a chain reaction.

That being said, since you can already remote detonate them, I see no issue with making it easier to do so.

Offline Cl ick to Ca p t ain

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Re: Detonate Mines
« Reply #22 on: October 28, 2013, 10:38:31 am »
Why don't we just raise the cap of mines you can have to ten while you're at it.
</sarcasm>

Offline The Djinn

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Re: Detonate Mines
« Reply #23 on: October 28, 2013, 11:00:22 am »
That being said, since you can already remote detonate them, I see no issue with making it easier to do so.

The issue with making it easier is that there's some skill to a chain reaction of mines: getting that huge a blast on target isn't exactly easy. If you can just detonate mines, that skill is effectively unnecessary, and huge damage bursts are MUCH easier to accomplish.

It's also a bit out-of-theme for the game, as remote detonation requires some form of communication with the detonation device: something GoI doesn't have. I understand there's a bit of a disconnect since the 6th+ mine detonates older ones, but that's a necessary game mechanic to prevent endless mine spam.

Personally, I'm uncomfortable with at-will mine detonation. I feel it doesn't fit the game's feel, and I'm also wary of the easy power it gives the mine launcher.

Offline Thomas

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Re: Detonate Mines
« Reply #24 on: October 28, 2013, 12:27:50 pm »
It's not easy, but you can do it. I remember on one occasion we were having an all mine match and got a lot of practice at both avoiding mines and getting them to 'remote detonate' by placing an extra one. Getting them to blow up doesn't take much skill, but getting them to actually do some damage without someone running into them takes a lot of skill.

The 'remote detonation' is made difficult by the timing of the gun. You have to reload the next round, fire, and then wait for it to deploy. So if you try to fire that 6th mine as they pass by your first, chances are you won't actually do damage, as they'll be past it by the time it actually blows.


Currently it feels that mines aren't all that powerful. They're pretty easy to avoid, and only become a real nuisance when you're chasing a ship down (and even then, if you get close enough the mines lose a lot of their effect. You'll either pass by them or have the mine shots hit you before they deploy). They can get annoying when a ship has nothing but mine launchers on certain maps, but given the three dimensional nature of the game, you can still easily avoid them; and the ship full of mines is less able to actively seek out kills or even defend itself when engaged. It can just run and lay mines.


Adding an actual remote feature doesn't change too much, and really depends on how you do it. Does it just blow up one mine at a time? Or all of them? This can make it difficult to get a hit on the target you want or keep a good defensive field respectively. Should there be a range on the detonator? Does an active detonate cause a smaller aoe explosion? Does hitting the detonate happen automatically, or have a time delay?

There's a lot of ways to go about it to prevent it from becoming overpowering.



As for it not fitting the feel of the world, I can't imagine that they do not have electricity or radio. You can see all the lights on the different maps, and ships are able to communicate with each other. Not to mention the Tesla weapons in GoI and the old heat seeking missile launchers in earlier versions of GoIO.

zlater75@hotmail.com

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Re: Detonate Mines
« Reply #25 on: October 28, 2013, 05:52:38 pm »
getting second thoughts on the remote detonation. but would like to see a shrapnel mine for burst. fine with them as is.

Offline Gambrill

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Re: Detonate Mines
« Reply #26 on: October 30, 2013, 03:12:17 pm »
I actually use the zoom on the mine launcher. Even though its a small zoom its still very helpful :)