Stop punishing high levels

[Letus]

There's a reason I've stopped achievement grinding.

The complaints of stacked levels...
The fact that many of the achievements then were just...bogus
The fact that skill comes from playing the game, and not buffing 150 balloons in a DM...
and that the only motivator is fancy outfits....

the remade achievements...really killed the only real motivator.

Now I have two accounts for the sake of not grinding up the levels just to throw off newbies...
fun to have level 8, 6, 5, and 7 crews not believe that a level 2 gunner could fire a lumberjack effectively...
...also fun to see that same crew fly and manage a ship like they've only played the game for three hours...



I have a dream where players aren't treated based on the number or title next to them...but by their expertise....
Where people talk about names....were people make stories of those names...where people judge base off those names, and not the number next to them.  Where engineers are known for when to swing a mallet or a spanner, where gunners are known where and when to fire, and where pilots know that...it's not wise to ram ships with a lumberjack fish...........

[Squidslinger Gilder]

I just learn to ignore level stacking complaints. Most of the time I get them from new players who think its stacked and impossible when my entire crew is pugs, my allied ships are pugs, and more often than not they are not players I usually fly with. I can't help it if they other captains talk and listen. Or that my crew understands their tasks and executes well. Heck lot of the times the complaints come in my crew is mostly players who have only played a week at the most.

Yeah skill does come from playing, but some of the achievements do force you to fight with ships you don't know or like as much. Then you pick up new tricks. Ways to excel with one and ways to beat them. Don't think I would have flown a squid had I not had to do it for an achievement. Before that I hated it. After I took time to master it for the achievement, I loved it. Course that doesn't always work. The spire achievement...hated it before, hated it after. Bout the only fun I had was 3v3 with 3 spires against pyras/etc and we ripped them up with two long range engage spires and 1 cqc spire.

[Mattilald Anguisad]

Level 4+ are not newbies. They might not be very good, but they are not newbies.
Hight end achievments WEREN'T SUPPOSED TO BE FARMABLE. Perfect victories happen, but they need a lot of work. I've got a lot of perfect victories without stacking teams against 4+. Unless 2 8+ players on a single ship count. Heck I've had perfect victories even on training days as a pilot (trainers tend to be pilot on training days).

I'd love to get 100 Victories with 100% hull health and no deaths against 13+ captains, but I just won't happen for a long time since the achievments on the way there require me to be a gungeeneer instead of main hull engineer, witch is very rarely - most people who know me, prefer me there, for a good reason, to  be on full, or it's just some newbies I don't know, and trust with hull There is a good reason why it took me about 120 hours to get from level 9 to 10 as engineer. Becouse I don't care about geting Achievemnts right now.
A lot of have very hard achievments (at least when they are announced).

[Commodore Phoenix]

Exactly you don't care about achievements if you don't care about achievements why are you arguing about it. Also we DON'T WANT TO BE SPENDING OUR TIME DOING THESE NEW ACHIEVEMENTS. If we don't want to do them, the only guys so far that have bothered to get this far, WHO will? It's just a waste to even have these achievements if no one wants to do them why not just make the level cap 13 and be done with it.

[Mattilald Anguisad]

I thinh that is they wanted to realy wanted to punish you, they'd force you to get all those perfect victories with 100% hull health by requiering entire enemy teams to be level 13+ your team be made of newbies (1-3) AND done on Mobula in a public match

Edit: someone might actualy be tempted to implemented something this sadistic - I'll go on a kajak, and row across the atlantic oacaen and punch someone if this is done. Or alternatively bribe one of the US based players to go to NY and do that instead of me :p .

[Commodore Phoenix]

So know you aren't even taking this seriously, well great, I'm glad this time was spent well.

[Mattilald Anguisad]

Do you thin I was happy when they added "Not A Scratch" Eginering achiement when there requirement was no deaths, 100% hull health and 13+ enemy captains.
they decreased the requirement to captains 7+ and dropped amount of victories to 10. I had no idea how was I going to pull this off. But they decreased the requirements for that one, as many many others. Extinguishing 200 hull fires with chem spray will still be a pain to accomplish.

[Commodore Phoenix]

You said you didn't care about achievement's now you do which is it Mattilald?

[Mattilald Anguisad]

I didn't even check the new achievments until this topic showed up. I went to check the new achievments. Some of them were annoying, but not considerably more than before (buff a million more things), I meant perfect victories with increasingly harder requirements did worry me (i think those are the only enginering achievments with enemy captain limits), but rest of is just thousands and thousands more of the same I've been allready doing. I give a **** about achievments, but I don't think I have to do them now. What I took issue with, was that the notion that MUSE is forcing us to do them.
(only level I have to farm is from 7 to 8 becouse 7 is the lame title ("junior" something). I don't want to be a Junior Navigator (i belive thats captain 7 title, but that's an exception, something even more easily fixed).

[Commodore Phoenix]

You aren't seeing our point Mattilald. Also when did Muse force us to do anything?

[Squidslinger Gilder]

Here is the thing, 100% hull against 13 captains is basically an arranged premade loss. It is not going to happen ever. Even against semi competent captains it just isn't going to work unless you are totally stacked and the other team isn't. You sit alone in a sniper boat on the far side of the map while your other two captains in 3v3 do all the fighting. Unless you are gifting level ones instant rank ups to 13...this still will never get done outside of private match achievement farming.

Really, if you are running against even one 13...you will not come out unscathed unless your team rallies to keep the 13 subdued. This is why these achievements should be redone so it only takes 1 player on the opposing team being of high level. With 2-3 players all 7+ it is impossible without arranged farming. With just 1 player, it is tough but doable.

[Clara Skyborn]

I have been considering changing the requirement to one high-level enemy captain instead of all -- because you're right, while farming by pubstomping is the worst outcome, farming by arranged loss isn't much better. This last change should address any lingering concerns and I hope put your mind at ease about the high-level achievements. Any other concerns, please let me know (but please remember to keep the discussion civil among yourselves and try to limit the all-caps shouting, because we ARE listening).

Thanks for the continuing feedback.

[Moo]

So you want to get this achievement... You manage to find a game with a high enough level captain on the other side, and the other captain(s) are low-levels. As low-level captains are less likely to stick together or be effective in general, you manage to kill them without needing to engage the high-level ship. I don't really see that this is much different to pubstomping all low-levels. Maybe something like "all 5+, one 8+"?
Another way to "farm" it without needing cooperation from the other team would be to just hide and/or snipe while your team-mate takes the damage/gets the kills. If the enemy high-level captain had a poor loadout or crew, this wouldn't be too unlikely.

[Squidslinger Gilder]

That would be awesome if it just required one captain of high level. Thanks!

Sorry about the caps. Part of the frustration is from the fact I have personally tried to get many into this game and they haven't panned out. Also I've had a few players show promise early on, never be seen again after their first day. BFS has brought quite a few members in who were first time players and they've stayed I think partly because we got to them before they found a reason to leave the game. It would be nice if we had a healthy high level community with plenty of players to fuel these major achievements.

[Commodore Phoenix]

So you want to get this achievement... You manage to find a game with a high enough level captain on the other side, and the other captain(s) are low-levels. As low-level captains are less likely to stick together or be effective in general, you manage to kill them without needing to engage the high-level ship. I don't really see that this is much different to pubstomping all low-levels. Maybe something like "all 5+, one 8+"?
Another way to "farm" it without needing cooperation from the other team would be to just hide and/or snipe while your team-mate takes the damage/gets the kills. If the enemy high-level captain had a poor loadout or crew, this wouldn't be too unlikely.

Then that's the wrong view on thing's to think that it's alright to farm for achievements. We don't want that we want the ability to get the achievement's without farming just playing in a pub match with some good players having a good time but also feeling like we did something worthwhile.