Ragequitting pilot captains and what to do about it

[Captain Smollett]

So I'm not sure when it started really becoming an issue, but ragequitting captains has become an epidemic in GOI.  Every time a captain ragequits; he ruins the experience for everyone on his crew left without a captain, his teammate who's left without his partner and the enemy who has lost a worthy opponent.



Here is my proposed solution.  Track the amount of matches that a pilot leaves from without reconnecting and make the number public.  Crew joining a ship will be able to check how many matches the captain has dc'd from and the number of matches they've played,  If the number is a significant % of matches played, crew will know the cap is likely to dc and they won't crew with them.  This sort of public shaming will provide a strong disincentive to abandon crews.

People who disconnect due to internet problems will reconnect before the match ends and won't be unduly punished and offenders will likely stop as well knowing that their actions have consequences that will follow them through the game.

[evodoc]

Yeah, I made a very similar topic a few weeks ago where there've been discussed a few ideas:
https://gunsoficarus.com/community/forum/index.php/topic,1316.0.html

[Andrej Peribosky]

I was in the match where we were talking about it.
I know it's bad when a captain leaves a match while ingame.
But people play to have fun, and it's no fun when you get stomped again and again by a team you KNOW you cannot beat and you KNOW you can't get anything or learn anything by staying there.

In that match there was a full DUCK ship with a level 12 captain and a level 8 captain with level 4-5 crew.
On the other side there were a level 1-3 captains with AI and some low level crew.
One of the captains, while in the match, just wandered around aimlessy without having an idea what to do. He died four times to double gatflak coordinated fire.

Our captain then decided to leave. What could have he done? Stay and get killed? For what? I suspect he wasnt having any fun, and so he left.

Having a captain leave a match while in game is annoying. But it is more rude to start a match with full stacked teams vs new players, and i think the responsibility here would be more on the veterans to even things out.
As veterans, and especially as coordinated teams, it should be OUR responsibility to even the teams and allow for everyone to have a good experience.
You can prevent people leaving by having fair games, rather than having another counter on captains names.

[JaegerDelta]

I was in the match where we were talking about it.
I know it's bad when a captain leaves a match while ingame.
But people play to have fun, and it's no fun when you get stomped again and again by a team you KNOW you cannot beat and you KNOW you can't get anything or learn anything by staying there.

In that match there was a full DUCK ship with a level 12 captain and a level 8 captain with level 4-5 crew.
On the other side there were a level 1-3 captains with AI and some low level crew.
One of the captains, while in the match, just wandered around aimlessy without having an idea what to do. He died four times to double gatflak coordinated fire.

Our captain then decided to leave. What could have he done? Stay and get killed? For what? I suspect he wasnt having any fun, and so he left.

Having a captain leave a match while in game is annoying. But it is more rude to start a match with full stacked teams vs new players, and i think the responsibility here would be more on the veterans to even things out.
As veterans, and especially as coordinated teams, it should be OUR responsibility to even the teams and allow for everyone to have a good experience.
You can prevent people leaving by having fair games, rather than having another counter on captains names.

Preach!

but also a D/C% wouldnt really solve the problem would it?  people who leave the game mid match, enough to warrant such a system, are often not sticking with the game anyway.  I rarely ever run into those people again after they leave a game.

Edit: also this is somthing we could actually measure.  if one were to add people who d/c'd mid game and never rejoined to their friends list and tracked their days since last login.

[Squidslinger Gilder]

I left one cause it was a 3v3 crazy king battle and the crews on my allies junkers couldn't hit anything. We had a huge tactical advantage with their two junkers, but they kept dying over and over and I just got tired of it. My crew was too. The junker captains were talking to me that they couldn't get their crews to fire properly. Guessing all new players. Finally just had it and left.

Underperforming crews I would say are one of the biggest reasons folks quit, at least for experienced players. For new players, I'd say its being thrashed and stomped. Course when you got them taking spires or taking builds that will never work, they just have to learn.

[Moo]

Yeah, I proposed basically the same solution in the other thread. I think that would identify repeat offenders easily enough, without actually affecting their ability to play.

But yes. What the high-level captains can do to lessen the chance of the other team ragequitting is by avoiding stacking. When one captain on one team is higher level than all the captains on the other team added together, it's not likely to be a very enjoyable match for either side. Rather than having both high-levels on one team, why not just have one on each team. That way you both get a challenge, both lower-level captains might learn a thing or two, and much less chance of people ragequitting.

[Captain Smollett]

But people play to have fun, and it's no fun when you get stomped again and again by a team you KNOW you cannot beat and you KNOW you can't get anything or learn anything by staying there.

In that match there was a full DUCK ship with a level 12 captain and a level 8 captain with level 4-5 crew.
On the other side there were a level 1-3 captains with AI and some low level crew.
One of the captains, while in the match, just wandered around aimlessy without having an idea what to do. He died four times to double gatflak coordinated fire.

Our captain then decided to leave. What could have he done? Stay and get killed? For what? I suspect he wasnt having any fun, and so he left.


Having a captain leave a match while in game is annoying. But it is more rude to start a match with full stacked teams vs new players, and i think the responsibility here would be more on the veterans to even things out.
As veterans, and especially as coordinated teams, it should be OUR responsibility to even the teams and allow for everyone to have a good experience.
You can prevent people leaving by having fair games, rather than having another counter on captains names.

Well first of all; if they felt they were mismatched, they could have chosen not to play the game and joined a different match or requested a balancing of the teams rather than completely abandoning their crews and teammate and leaving them in a worse situation than they were to start with.  This however completely misses the point of this post because people aren't just ragequitting because of "stacked teams" (whatever that means).  Captains will often leave as soon as they die and it seems they might not win, rather than trying to fight back and save victory from the jaws of defeat.

The truth of the matter is that as captain you take on a certain responsibility to your team and abandoning that because you're not having fun ruins the experience of everyone else and is about as mature as a child who takes his ball home at the playground since he's not winning.

but also a D/C% wouldnt really solve the problem would it?  people who leave the game mid match, enough to warrant such a system, are often not sticking with the game anyway.  I rarely ever run into those people again after they leave a game.

Edit: also this is somthing we could actually measure.  if one were to add people who d/c'd mid game and never rejoined to their friends list and tracked their days since last login.

It's happening so much now that it's not only players doing it who don't ever play again.  I see it a ton from level 4+ captains.  Knowing that you might not get quality crew because of your propensity to abandon them at the first sign of trouble leads to a good incentive to stick in the fight.  If things really don't seem at all winable you're always left the option to leave with dignity by surrendering with your teammate and going back to the lobby.

[Calico Jack]

Most rage quits could be dealt with by ensuring there are level 1-3 games running as simple as that, ensuring you don't get crews and or captains who are still learning the basics mixing it up with crews and or captains who have some idea of what they're doing. Or a high level shark in a pool of level 1 minnows.

I know I'm not alone in doing this, I mostly captain but I will roles if I think there will be balance issues when I join a match.

That said I personally feel the tutorials have made things slightly worse as new players seem more reticent take advice than they were prior to., though it may be just coincidence and the kind of player we're getting now is the product of hand holding games where they'd win no matter how badly they played.

[Calico Jack]

.

In that match there was a level 12 captain and a level 8 captain with level 4-5 crew.
On the other side there were a level 1-3 captains with AI and some low level crew.

I remember joining a 2v2 match a whiled back  with 2 full crews of the same clan withs one captain a CA. I joined to help out the weaker side which unsurprisingly lost, but after the match one of the CA starting giving advice about what the other team should be doing to get better. I have to say I got slightly irked - and pointed out that the CA perhaps should be crewing with the weaker side  and advising them during the game if they really wanted to help.

There then ensued a series if cat calls from the rest of the crew members to the effect I should have known better than to join low level crews and was a sore loser - which irked me more because losing wasn't the reason I was strongly stating my opinion.

The CA then changed sides but asked me if I objected to him playing with his friends or that his friends wanted to play together. I understand what he was asking and I've been in that situation myself, but sometimes you just have to do stuff to make sure the game is fun for everyone.

[Captain Smollett]

Not that I disagree with your sentiment but that's really off topic.

People don't rage quit because of stacked teams that they chose to play against and then quit in the middle of.

People are rage quitting all over the place, against higher ranked teams, lower ranked teams, same ranked teams.  It's becoming really common, and when one person gets left over and over by their captains and teammates they stop caring about doing it to other people.  It's getting to the point where there is a rage quit in a huge % of my matches and it's been getting more common every day.

It's eroding our community and no amount of finger pointing is going to fix the problem.  You can blame global warming if you want but we really need to put a system in place to discourage this.

[Calico Jack]

@Captain Smollett

With the greatest of respect:

First we clearly have some common ground in the fact we care about the community, but with the greatest respect I'm not finger pointing nor am I clan bashing - I edited the quote in question for a specific reason, because it's not a just a clan issue, just as I didn't name names in the anecdote, neither players nor clan involved.

The anecdote, however,  is relevant as it underlines certain kind of problem where a successful side will continue to be so when clearly it isn't doing anything but stat padding, it also underlines the fact that tunnel vision can affect players and I include myself in that list.

The phrase "choose to join" is use quite often as a justification for situations like the one I described, but unless there is a choice of matches it doesn't really hold up, sometimes shuffling sides is the thing you should be doing. And sometimes making sure there are low level matches running is another.

I don't rage quit even if I have a run of bad matches, yet I crew with a lot of people and a lot of new players are among that number consequently I have often found myself on a rudderless ship or suddenly with AI I didn't start out with.

I try to organise training when I'm online ( and did prior to there being any achievements connected to it for the cynics out there), or crew with low level players in matches, not because I enjoy doing it but because I believe well trained players will make the game more fun and challenging in the long run. I'm not claiming sainthood either I'm sure there are players who don' t remember crewing with me fondly, but what I am saying is perhaps you don't see the game the way I do because we don't play in the same games, but that doesn't make what I have to say invalid or off topic.

[Captain Smollett]

I didn't mean to invalidate what you said.

I agree that there is currently a lot of incentive for teams to continue playing with the people they're achieving great teamwork with and consequently smashing their opponents over and over again.  Teamstacking is an issue, and I think Muse should implement a way to assist teams in swapping ships to balance out matches.

I just don't think teamstacking completely explains the issue with ragequitting I've been observing lately.  There is always going to be a team that's winning and with the game mechanics of GOI frequently a team can start to run away with it.  However I just don't think that the possibility of losing a match because your opponent seems superior is ever acceptable. GOI is a game where you can always make a comeback.  You can repair your armor and components, rally with your teammate and attempt to work your way towards victory.  Attempting to do anything else cheats your teammates and opponents from the experience they are all trying to have and the frustration and capitulation of one person ruining the experience of 15 other people just doesn't seem to be justified.

I'm just advocating a system that discourages this by highlighting frequent offenders.  Fixing this and teamstacking are in no way mutually exclusive.

[Calico Jack]

I just don't think teamstacking completely explains the issue with ragequitting I've been observing lately. 

However I just don't think that the possibility of losing a match because your opponent seems superior is ever acceptable. GOI is a game where you can always make a comeback. 

I agree 100% with the second point and take on board your first.

Muse, I believe,  has had a long hard look at other multiplayer games and at how in-game rewards affect player behaviour, and implemented its conclusions very successfully. So I think though rather than a punitive solution, the answer could be to reward players who don't quit matches.

[Rainer Zu Fall]

Ragequitting pilots are a problem. But many new players think they can take it on with high-level players, maybe because they don't know how to join beginner games. They don't know what to do or how to do it or just lack the experience/experienced crew.

So the real problem isn't people disappearing, it's the problem behind. That new/unexperienced players don't know about beginner matches or just think they're unnecessary/those new/unexperienced players are better than that or that they don't know how to join a match properly using Quick Join instead. (Impatience is a really big problem because they don't know how important it is to wait for your crew to listen to the captain.)
Get rid of those problems and you solve the problem about most of those people quitting.

[Spud Nick]

Players should be able to leave in the middle of a match if they are not having fun. I don't think that shaming them for doing so is a good idea.