Dev App 1.4.0 (475)

[DrTentacles]

*sigh* I am not liking heavy weapon nerfs. They're in a weak enough place as it is. Carrofish are good, but  the only "OP" bit, in my opinion is the ability to "slow blend"-sit out of arcs, and slowly kill someone via constant balloon lock. I've won matches that I shouldn't have been able to that way, especially against ships like the junker, and the better fix is to simply change balloon rebuild times. Carronade effectiveness is needed to enable Goldfish and Galleons have a good role outside of frankly, niche options (Lumberfish).

What a Carrofish should be good at is a fast death-or-glory attack-pop balloon, shatter armor, and ram, with support of side weapons. That's where I'd like to see it end up.

Nerfing heavy clip is going to hurt the galleon, which already struggles without support ship. (Though I did see some impressive Ryder galleons a few months back.) Still. I don't think we want the ability of Hwatchas to long-range disable removed, especially since that takes impressive gunning unless you're stationary completely stationary, be it on Goldfish or Galleon. (I can't speak for Spire, as I rarely pilot it outside of long-range builds.)

This honestly feels like an attempt to nerf anything that's fun and effective, rather than buff things that are less effective to that level.

(Edited with more context.)

[Richard LeMoon]

So, my original thought on the heavy clip nerf was actually a branch of the Stamina issues. My thought was to not give the extra arcs to gunners (which really makes no sense), and instead give them 30% or something recoil reduction while using stamina. This would benefit all ammos except heavy, which is an engineer's mainstay on a lot of guns. This would still make engineers more valuable. So, my idea was to nerf heavy clip so that the gunner's stamina buff + heavy clip = 100% recoil reduction. Engineers would have to settle for 60% recoil reduction.

It makes sense to me to reduce recoil while using stamina due to the extra effort and concentration being used to steady the gun and predict and compensate for its bucking.

[DrTentacles]

Hmm. Paired with that, I could dig a heavy recoil Nerf. It doesn't seem to help guns like Mercuries, or Artimii, however-any ideas for that?

Heavy is only a mainstay on Hwatcha, Gat, Banshee, and Carronade, as far as I know, so that's...four guns?

[Richard LeMoon]

Artemis already benefits from the faster turning. Gunners are already used on Mercs quite a bit, and they are quite powerful... not sure what added effect would be good for them without being overpowered on other guns (like the arc increase).

I would also remove the ammo reduction on heavy, making it much more useful on other guns like mortar, flame, and flak where it is quite good at max range, but for the lack or rounds.

[Sammy B. T.]

May be worthwhile remembering that dev ap is equal parts balancing before patches and testing concepts. I imagine today's changes are more part of the latter. I doubt this would all go into production. I wouldn't start freaking out just yet.

[Richard LeMoon]

Applies.

[Koali]

Explosions are now happening where they should.

Which is to say, everywhere

[Squidslinger Gilder]

I've hated the disable meta for awhile now. Just another one of the reasons I don't want to do competitive or really play as much. It's point n click gameplay and everyone does it. Take blender, lock ship down, easy win. Rinse, repeat. There is no skill involved at all. Almost falls asleep when I crew on blenders.

But I don't think we need to nerf Carros to oblivion to solve it. In fact, just adding Stamina is going to bring in a factor for countering that shouldn't be discounted. Heavy guns have been nerfed to hell way too much.

Muse if you do this, you'll only make any heavy gun ship outside of the Spire even less played. The Spire can at least put light guns to offset it's suckiness, but Fish and Galleon will be dead. Then traditionally your solution to solving that has been...nerf all the other ships or guns...STOP IT! It didn't work the first time, and it hasn't worked the last x number of times!!

[Sammy B. T.]

Try looking at it in game. I'd hardly call where it is nerfed to oblivion.

[Byron Cavendish]

I think it's pretty mild compared to their past history of balance changes.

[Richard LeMoon]

I think the up/down nerf could be compensated by a small horizontal buff.

[SirNotlag]

well I am happy with the extinguisher buff, a 2 second cooldown and 4 second immunity, it may be small but on tight components like the engines on the pyra I can spray and repair them all very fast now.

[RoastinGhost]

I prefer the old hud, in part because it wasn't as sleek/modern looking. The round stamina bar seemed obtrusive, but maybe that's just because I'm not used to it. My class icon displayed larger than the hull health isn't the way I would have prioritized the information.

I'm also not sold on the stamina system. It doesn't seem to add much tactical depth, and doesn't mesh too nicely with the nice and simple equipment system.

That being said, seeing dev support this long after release is great! I mean only to be constructive.