Reading through this thread I think a large majority all have similar thoughts over all with different ways to a more desired end result. Stamina needs much more work/ minotaur underwhelming but with potential .
**I'm not going to talk about the ship changes or piloting stamina because I do not pilot, EVER**
Minotaur:I was really excited when I heard another gun was being worked on!!! Woot, new content!
Round 1: Loaded lesmok and was at long range. SURPRISE!: it had little to no effect at long range and that it was really easy to shoot. (with the exception that i had no noise or ammo trails when shooting this gun so I wasn't able to judge it's arc until it actually hit the ship and I saw a marker). Ok, mid range with burst and charge are about the same. Slightly more satisfying but still little effect to what I thought would happen. Match ended, back in lobby everyone seemed to have the same thing to say. Very underwhelming and no effect at long distance.
Round 2: Greased, Incendiary and Heavy. (greased and heavy both brought beccause of the basis that is shoots like a Carronade.) Incendiary because Richard suggested it, we were both hoping it would make the gun more like his Flame Vortex Cannon idea (
https://gunsoficarus.com/community/forum/index.php/topic,4709.0.html).
Heavy: Still un underwhelming effect.
GREASED!!! Finally!!!! mid to close range finally gave me some effect that I was looking for. I could flip a goldfish/mobula in circles or at least off their mark. BUT good pilots were easily able to counter it's effects, especially with stamina. On a pyra, galleon, spire it had little effect.
Incendiary:
Did not make it like the Flame Vortex I was so hoping for.
Round 3: Heat sink, Locknagar, standard ammo: No added benefit with the first two and not even close to the effect greased gave it.
OVERALL for the Minotaur:
UNDER WHELMING! I like the idea of a gun that is used for tactics more than damage. I think that could add interesting game play, however, this gun needs to have "more" in order for me to see anyone really taking this gun for tactics apposed to just sticking to the guns we have now. I really like this idea for the gun:
My thoughts are to double the clip size and make it shoot faster. Change one of the damage types to Impact.
It reminded me of the movement effects mines have but without the damage. In a 2v2 your other ship has to be something like a Meta Pyra in order to have enough killing power to actually win a match, frankly. But even that would be easy to counter.
Added enjoyment to the game: A new gun: YES. This gun: maybe. This gun at it's current condition: NO. Stamina:Oh Stamina, you disappoint me in so many ways.
First: It's UI is BIG and in your face and distracting and crowds out the more important ones like parts that are damaged.
Second: This is not at all like the new content players have asked for.
Third: I find stamina in it's current form GAME BREAKING!
Don't get me wrong I like the effort that you put out to try to make something new and to make something that would make each class more of it's own. With people complaining that gunners aren't useful, this seemed like a probable answer. However, AS IT IS, IT IS GAME BREAKING.
Engi Stamina: Welp. Like most other things when it comes to engineers. It's the most balances but also the least exciting. Is it fun to run super fast: YES! But it is only most useful for main engi on a goldfish running from back engines to hull or for main engi on a galleon running from main deck up the stairs to balloon. For most gungi positions it seemed useless. On a pyra I found that running from hull to the engines back to hull it was too fast. The game couldn't keep up with how fast I ran and how slow I hit. Trying to hit engines while using stamina just made me have to stop hit, stop hit or go back and re-hit. Also, whatever changed with the last update (in the real game too) has made railings grab you like a sticky octopus. The railings leave you flailing around, jumping and squirming in utter desperation to get free while you watch the hull decrease in health and turn red. SO the stamina ONLY MAKES THIS WORSE. (this goes for pretty much any of the ships with railings close to components.) The cool down cycle of a mallet makes it pointless to run faster because you are going to have to wait anyways.
Jumping: Useless at best. The jumping pretty much just let me get stuck in new places I never knew the sticky octopus lived, like literally on top of the Hull on a Galleon. Jumped from the top deck to the hull to repair it, thought it'd be fun to use stamina to make the jump. INSTEAD: I jumped right from the top deck to some invisible box above the hull. Leaving me jumping and flailing to get off of it but not actually able to hit the hull. SO CLOSE BUT SO FAR. The balloon/railing of the pyra. I've been stuck in this area before but yep you really get stuck if you jump using stamina. Quick frankly there were no place the jump really helped me out. I could hit squid engines and the main engine of the galleon from below easier but nothing that i couldn't do with some trained parkour moves before, which I think is one of the things that makes the difference between a ok engi and a great engi.
OVERALL ENGINEER STAMINA: Eh. Did it make the game more fun: Only when fooling around. When it came down to actual serious game play it was slightly useful with a LARGE serving of frustration with the hitting being too slow and the railings too sticky. I'd only slightly use it and ONLY to run faster in "Oh, Shit" moments to catch a hull before breaking.
Gunner Stamina: NO! In no way at it's current form should this be implemented! And this is where it becomes game breaking. WHY does stamina allow a gunner to push a gun so far out of it's normal arc that I could shoot so far up THROUGH MY OWN SHIPS BALLOON, so far down THERE COULD NOT POSSIBLY BE A DECK under neither my gun and so far to either side THAT THE RAILINGS WOULD HAVE BEEN BLOWN TO PIECES.
The gunner stamina literally breaks the game. It makes every gun OP. This gun has crappy arc, no problem just stamina this and break a part on the enemy ship to re-gen faster. My pilot sucks at getting me into arc, no problem, I got stamina for that. That enemy just pushed me out of arc as a tactical move, no problem, I have stamina for that. (Which the gunner stamina makes the Minotaur pretty useless)
If they want to use it to increase the gun arcs or movement speed then it should be based on a percentage so that each gun still could only go so far or move so quick and maybe even do small damage to the gun, like lochnagar.
Overall Gunner Stamina: NO! JUST NO! At it's current state it does not make the game more fun. It breaks the game.
I like a game that makes me become a better player to win more. Guns of Icarus does that. This is why Vetrans do so well because they have put the time and effort into learning the game, learning the guns, learning the ammos, learning tools and learning gun arcs. With this new stamina you ruin that. A pilot wouldn't have to be good anymore for a gunner to hit their target. A gunner doesn't have to be good at timing their shots. You take a game that actually requires work and instead dumb it down. This will kill the community if you implement something that renders all the hard work of your players useless. Why should veterans even try to teach new players the "tricks" of the game if they can just use stamina instead. Veteran players will either leave the game or just use the system to make an even larger gap in game play. The newer players will either not learn or learn the tricks of the game slower because they'll use stamina instead. Things like gun arcs, toggling moonshine for "x" seconds then waiting "x" seconds and repeat in order to get your effect but not break your engines, and other captain tools just seem less important now when they can just stamina it all. A few of the players on this forum have some interesting ideas for the stamina like keeping the gunner in their seat or not using stamina at all and using the previously worked upon ammos and slightly increasing the speed of everything would make the game faster. Stamina in this form is just not it.
