Berfing (Buff but also nerf) The chemspray

[BlackenedPies]

Again, chem provides immunity at the cost of repairs- that is balanced. If chem needs more balance then change the variables. Devs won't change mechanics and the community will never agree. Forgive me but I don't know if the thread is meant to be serious.

[Crafeksterty]

That is not balance if it completely makes Fire and Extinguishers to be disregarded.
How the chemspray works, sure its balanced, but what it does for other items is not.

I dont know why my suggestion would nerf the chemspray because it does not. Theres more time to repair and less time to worry for your chems cycles.
One chem would cover the ship, while another engineer can have an extinguisher as a spare. Currently, we recommend chemspray even to newbies because in the long run getting used to that will benefitt more than the extinguisher. The chemspray isnt imbalanced, its what it does to other things is breaking other items behaviour.

Again, why would you bring extinguisher
Why would you bring Fire weapons / Incendiary

It will be balanced to a point where only very few fire stacks will be applied to the chem sprayed component to the point where it can be extinguished with Chem Spray alone.

The idea was youl have to add more effort if youde want to add more fires. Ofcourse chemspray should still be able to combat fire, but fire will always find a way. Because fire will always find a way in lower precentages, chemspray repairers will be slowed down. While the extinguish repairer wont be. Adding to the argument of having one chem and one extinguisher to be good.

Let me try to explain then once again: A good engie is not only that engie, who know how to run in circles and chemspray. You can teach every noob to do that. If you guys are trying to tell that current chemspray in right hands is imba, then HELL IT IS NOT! You completely don't consider fact that components need to be repaired and rebuilded. When for example main engineer on Goldfish is tanking the hull, because opponents are very fierce on gatling, then he'll have to stay on it and engines will lose chemspray buff. You get it already, or still need more examples?

But then theres no fire weapons hitting you. He lost chem but wheres the threat of fire? Why would you bring extinguisher? If the enemy knows that the ship has chemsprayers, it would be a disadvantage to bring fire weapons or incendiary. The only fire weapon that used in good timing is the flamer, while every other weapon requier chance and luck or recievers fault for fires to come in. Most ships are gattling or pierce heavy because of fire being unreliable. I mean fire doesnt directly kill but rather it is to cause some chaos for the crew on the ship so that it is easier to kill. But it is harder to add that fire. So why not directly kill?

[BlackenedPies]

Again, why would you bring extinguisher
Why would you bring Fire weapons / Incendiary

I bring ext on left side mobula and buff engi on squid for reasons. I think it would be pretty balanced with 5 second immunity.

If the enemy has no fire weapons then you don't have to chem which gives you a minimum of +22% repair boost compared to if they do. Plus if you screw up then repairs are further significantly reduced.
Incendiary isn't balanced but that's another story.

[Dementio]

You mean you couldn't have a component buffed and chem sprayed at the same time? No. It won't go past Muse and the community will fuss (many will vehemently oppose). There's tons of ways to increase balance but the only ones that matter are those with the possibility of being adopted. Unless the thread is meant for imagining balance.

The current Chem Spray would become the new Fire Extinguisher, just not as good or something while keeping the "Extinguish all fires immediately". Buffing too much is also an issue I feel like, there is no way of stopping somebody from buffing something other than completely destroying the buffed component and in competitive literally everybody brings it. My main issue however isn't buffing, it is that these tools are too similar to balance out correctly, so I suggest making the tools relatively different from one another without adding a completely new mechanic.

Whatever Muse decides is worth doing or not is Muse's decision, in Dev App they tried a lot of stuff which was more than just a waste of time, since many things weren't implemented or were changed at all. And the community will always make a fuss, like, seriously, try to do a 4v4 where your entire clan stacks on one side and flys only Spires with only Flaks as guns.

[BlackenedPies]

Discussion is valuable but the only chance for change is affecting variables not mechanics.

Chem has 3 effects: immunity, cooldown, and extinguish.
It's purpose is to provide immunity at the cost of repairs.

Increasing both immunity and cooldown would berf chem and make it more chemy.

[Richard LeMoon]

Here is another thought. If we treat chem like the buff hammer, we could get some interesting effects.

Here is a quick image. The blue bar on the left is fire resistance. Each bar section is +20% fire resistance, all the way up to 100% (5 bars). If the bar drained completely over the course of 100 seconds, you would lose 1% fire resistance per second. Or, if the gradations were hard (only updated every section), -20% every 20 seconds.



Chem (and other fire tools) could then operate in one of two ways. It could work like now, with a single click and a one second cooldown, giving 20% resistance per click. Or, it could have no cooldown and work independently from the repair tools. Aiming at a component and holding the button would gradually increase the bar, as well as slowly put out fires. More than one fire suppression tool could be used at the same time (which makes sense), but no other tools could be used, including buff. This would be like an active cooldown, since you are literally cooling down the component while using it.

I think fire suppression should work this way anyways, even with the extinguisher. Fire suppression would have two stats just like the repair tools. Suppression, meaning how many fires it will put out per second of use, and resistance, which would fill the resistance bar. Other tools could be created as well. Stats for tools would then look something like this.

Tool	Suppression	Resistance  (stats are per second)
Extinguisher	-10 fire	+5%
Chem Spray	-1 fire	+20%
Water bucket	-3 fire	+10%
Wet blanket	-20 fire	+1%
Moonshine (joke)	-0 fire	-50%

The good thing about this mechanic would be that any fire tool (depending on the stats) could be used to increase the fire resistance or put out fires. Some would just be better at one or the other. An 80-100% 'chem cycle' would still be relatively easy to maintain with chem spray, and perhaps possible with crazy extinguisher skills in smaller areas.