Guns Of Icarus Online
Main => Gameplay => Topic started by: David Dire on March 19, 2015, 11:20:54 am
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Being an airship nerd, (Ask me any info about the Hindenburg or other airships, I dare you, I'll answer) I've always wondered how do these Airships in-game fly?
They're too big in comparison to their balloon. The Junker looks like it's balloon is giant, and you've probably seen blimps, and think, "Wait, couldn't it fly IRL?". Well, no. Blimps are pretty light on their Canopy, and still have a gigantic balloon.
Helium: Helium is the lifting gas most of you probably know, as it's also not flammable. But, the problem is, I believe only 1 hydrogen atom is as powerful as 3 Helium atoms. Maybe I'm a bit wrong there, but the point remains, Hydrogen is a lot stronger. Anyways, Helium really isn't that strong, and for none of the airships could it actually lift them, or come close to it. These wouldn't even glide, they'd fall at full force.
Hydrogen: Hydrogen is basically the best lifting gas, albeit very flammable (If it weren't for hydrogen, the Hindenburg would have taken hours upon hours to burn, while it only took 31 seconds). I bring these two lifting gasses up as, Hydrogen is a tool in-game that boosts your lifting speed unrealistically high. -yet also somehow hurts the balloon-
Now, realistically, I think the spire would come the closest to actually lifting with Hydrogen. It is the biggest ship in the game, however, It's balloon size is also the biggest by far.
(Also if you were wondering, "What about the Mobula?" then, the Mobula would flip over instantly. Maybe it's balloon is barely big enough, but it still wouldn't work out.)
(Also what type of Airships are these too? It's like, Semi-Rigid but Non-Rigid.)
#MusePleaseHelp
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A big part of the answers you are going to get is this: Hollywood Realism.
Because this is a video game, the game doesn't have to be completely realistic, it just has to be convincing.
That aside, the balloons are semi-ridgid, filled with mysterious substance which can be replenished by whacking a mechanical component with something dull.
And some gravity physics of the post apocalyptic world is whack as well.
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Not to mention, skywhales.
SKYWHALES!!!
They hold the key to everything including the mystery you are trying to solve.
That's my best answer.
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Not to mention, skywhales.
SKYWHALES!!!
They hold the key to everything including the mystery you are trying to solve.
That's my best answer.
Some new, naturally formulated lifting gas, yes yes
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Note that it is steam punk, a sci fi genre of a world where it is based on steam engine and machinery. Preferebly taking their inspiration from the 1900s of inventions.
From here, many equipment, fashion or machinery wouldnt work because of real life physics, but the game LOOKS logicaly correct.
It Looks at first glance alright and dooable. Because clearly it has a baloon that makes it afloat.
The way the ship is made, from junker to Mobula, they work because clearly there are visual examples for them to be working.
But they dont actualy make sense if you think about it.
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You know what all that rigidity is for? These airships aren't filled with gas, they are actually carrying carefully sealed vacuums! See a vacuum has no density, so it will float better than anything. However, the weight of the ship still drags it down. As for why hydrogen makes it more maneuverable vertically, that's not actually filling the balloon, but using hydrogen as a rocket fuel to move up or down.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vacuum_airship
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Alternatively, we're not on earth and gravity is different?
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Alternatively, we're not on earth and gravity is different?
and/or air pressure
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Alternatively, we're not on earth and gravity is different?
This perfectly explains the lack of fall damage
Or two-feet jumps
It also perfectly explains engineer stamina... oh god, youve doomed us all imagine
Doesnt explain teleports and blackouts on fall so well though..try harder
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Well, beyond the wiki post in regards to the vacuum displacement theory (which is awesome), most of these with what tech we can confirm really wouldn't be able to fly and a liberal amount of imagination required (which isn't a bad thing, really).
After crunching some rough numbers though (and I mean rough), the goldfish, squid and junker *could* work with helium. It was used in the late 18th century so with the tech that seems to be floating (haha) about it's attainable. Mind you the balloon would be somewhat larger for these ships...but it's within the realm of possibility.
And then the actual materials used, such as aluminum vs steel. Even down to the wood types (which would take up half a page as far as weight, strength and uses...I have no life -_- ) which would be a huge difference onto weight.
With helium, Spire and Galleon are simply too heavy without a much much bigger balloon. Pyra has too much metal and framework. Mobula would need a good (and I mean insanely good to the point I need to consult an aeronautical engineer on it) ballast to not flip over. (I'd pay cash to see the early flight tests for that)...though if it did it *might* actually be able to take off and not dump everything over.
Mind you, I am not in any way trained in these things beyond a rudimentary idea as that I've been researching it for purposes of a book, so I'd take what I say with a grain of salt. But it is a fantastic discussion and I love theorizing about it.
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Devs confirmed multiple times that we are indeed on Earth.
My hypothesis is still that the ships themselves have devices on board (the balloon and hull repair points) that are actually gravitational dampers, so the ships are actually almost neutrally buoyant. The balloons work like a fish swim bladder, and add that little extra buoyancy needed to float.
My complete hypothesis is written down here (hull device) (https://gunsoficarus.com/community/forum/index.php/topic,3877.msg68633.html#msg68633) and here (balloon device) (https://gunsoficarus.com/community/forum/index.php/topic,3877.msg68671.html#msg68671).
Simple summery: Hull device makes metal almost as light as air, which is why the ships have such massive girders and copious amounts of framework.
Or, it could be "Iustus viam ludum opera".
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Very true. Then again, how far in the future are we talking here? As in, after this event of apocalyptical scale, what tech was laying about? Right now we are working on a type of building material that's as thin a paper but as strong as steel (nanopaper or graphine depending on what you look for). If were were to leave a liberal amount of time it would be understandable to have this kind of thing perfected and mass produced. And how ever long later, could be laying about, picked up and reused.
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It is actually hard to tell when this game takes place, as it in not linear from our timeline. From what I understand, it is an alternative timeline that branched off during one of the world wars.
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Transistors were never invented and then China and the US nuked the entire world in 2077
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Devs confirmed multiple times that we are indeed on Earth.
My hypothesis is still that the ships themselves have devices on board (the balloon and hull repair points) that are actually gravitational dampers, so the ships are actually almost neutrally buoyant. The balloons work like a fish swim bladder, and add that little extra buoyancy needed to float.
My complete hypothesis is written down here (hull device) (https://gunsoficarus.com/community/forum/index.php/topic,3877.msg68633.html#msg68633) and here (balloon device) (https://gunsoficarus.com/community/forum/index.php/topic,3877.msg68671.html#msg68671).
Simple summery: Hull device makes metal almost as light as air, which is why the ships have such massive girders and copious amounts of framework.
Or, it could be "Iustus viam ludum opera".
Good Point,
once the "Baloon component" is broken the ship ain't falling like a rock.
More like a ship with a baloon that is way to small for its size :p
So its probably that pipe-thingy engineers keep cursing/praying at,
that keeps the the baloon's content charged with darkdieselmagic / microwavemagnetitism.
...
...
...
Great, now I want a Techpriest at my Junker. :)
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How is a ship's falling speed with a broken balloon calculated?
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How is a ship's falling speed with a broken balloon calculated?
Oh no, math.
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Mass and drag.
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Mass and drag.
Is that the same calculation for vertical movement? I always assumed falling was a function of vertical speed.
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Probably F= 1/2 P v^2 C A or something utilizing that.
Might be the simplified version of F = k v^2.
All ship's maximum vertical velocity is at around 16m/s. I don't have the data to do the math on the fly, but you could probably run some interesting drag physics.
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The magic of aether.
- Used within the manufacture of a steel alloy it produces fantastical increase in the strength of the material, reducing the required mass of structural components. Likewise, cultured wood from trees grown in an aether enriched atmosphere is both stronger and lighter than normal wood.
- Intermixed with Hydrogen it reduces flammability and increases the lift. It's also easily blended into or extracted from the lift gas by means of an aetheric pump with the correct membrane, allowing full control of rise or descent without ballast and compensating for damage to the gas cells. It also explains the otherwise unexplainable balloon engine mechanic.
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The magic of aether.
- Used within the manufacture of a steel alloy it produces fantastical increase in the strength of the material, reducing the required mass of structural components. Likewise, cultured wood from trees grown in an aether enriched atmosphere is both stronger and lighter than normal wood.
- Intermixed with Hydrogen it reduces flammability and increases the lift. It's also easily blended into or extracted from the lift gas by means of an aetheric pump with the correct membrane, allowing full control of rise or descent without ballast and compensating for damage to the gas cells. It also explains the otherwise unexplainable balloon engine mechanic.
Even magic can't lift these pieces of (s)crap with that small of a balloon.
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Kirbies. Lots of Kirbies.
I'll let your imagination do the rest. :P
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"Captain! We are losing altitude!"
"Blast! Toss more Kirbies in the boiler."
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"Captain! We are losing altitude!"
"Blast! Toss more Kirbies in the boiler."
(http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lp89s4uVFM1qiog0do1_400.gif)
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"Captain! We are losing altitude!"
"Blast! Toss more Kirbies in the boiler."
(http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lp89s4uVFM1qiog0do1_400.gif)
... Ok, as long as it doesn't burn my clothes.
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All of the ships are made out of paper thin, hallowed out aluminum girders (even the wood, its just painted wood color/texture) and the balloons are already filled with hydrogen. Using hydrogen canisters just hyper-inflates the balloon to get an altitude boost. The following balloon damage is caused by small tears in the hyper-extended fabric which leads to you losing altitude shortly after the boost.
The Mobula is able to prevent itself from dramatically flipping upside down by being filled only with the methane of Skywhale farts which has amazing self-stabilizing properties.
It works if you don't think about it.
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*Zooms by on an upside-down Mobula.*
I THOUGHT ABOUT IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIT!!!
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*Zooms by on an upside-down Mobula.*
I THOUGHT ABOUT IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIT!!!
Look at him go!!!! I TOLD YOU NOT TO THINK ABOUT IT!1111!~~11!@