Guns Of Icarus Online
Info => Feedback and Suggestions => Topic started by: Squidslinger Gilder on January 19, 2015, 05:58:29 am
-
I've mentioned this before but now it deserves more attention. Ya know, in all the matches I've done since MM got added, there has been one very clear constant that has come forward.
Team A vs Team B
Ship on Team A or B blows up in opening engagement.
Ship quits immediately
Match continues for awhile in a 1v2 or 2v3/etc
Remaining ship either surrenders or gets extremely pissed they got ditched
Replacements never come but of course who would want to? Most of the time the ship's loadout is horrific
Granted it has been kinda fun at times because MM is so great it keeps putting me with lowbies. So they get cocky and think they've got the match in the bag, then get taken to school. But how about the rest of the time? This can't be good for players to get into matches and then have rage quitters ruin it.
Fix to this problem is simple. Take a page right out of MMOs and put a cooldown in. Players must stay a minimum amount of time in a match or the leaving will result in a 5-15 min cooldown where the play button is greyed out/etc. Just outright force them to at least give the match a chance before quitting.
Simple, but it works. If they whine about it, oh well. It is better than these people abusing the system to get new matches every time they go splat.
-
What about the scenario where I wanted to quit but the game was too slow to process the command.
Recently been leaving lobbies just short of match start when I'm not satisfied with crew. I'm not screwing them over, as the match cannot start with a cap on all ship slots.
And I've literally no patience for waiting for a noob crew to listen to at least 5% of what I say I want. When I did b4 it just all built up to a warning from the devs.
-
I once had a fight where my ally took a squid, he died once and left in the first minute, after a further five minute Lueosi and Geo boarded the squid and the round finished 5-1 to us.
Had a match timer been in there I'd have not met my new Ryder friends!
Also if someone wants to rage quit, its better to let them quit than give them the ability to abuse their crew over voice chat or troll the ship by burning hydro or kero or crashing into terrain until they're able to leave...
Or they'd just alt+F4 out the game, show up as internet disconnect and their slot becomes unable to be filled for the duration of the timer...
Though I do like the thoughts behind your idea and the reasoning I personally imagine it'll hurt more than help. :(
-
I agree that punishing people who leave mid game would probably hurt the GOI community more than it would help, but I dearly wish to punish these people. Especially the captains. I can sympathies with crew wanting to leave a poorly run ship, but a captain leaving a game and forcing a crew to wing it is just despicable. They should have to wear a scarlet letter "A" for Abandoner for next few match lobbies so that every one will know of their shame. For now I just block them and avoid crewing on their ships in the future.
-
I agree that punishing people who leave mid game would probably hurt the GOI community more than it would help, but I dearly wish to punish these people. Especially the captains. I can sympathies with crew wanting to leave a poorly run ship, but a captain leaving a game and forcing a crew to wing it is just despicable. They should have to wear a scarlet letter "A" for Abandoner for next few match lobbies so that every one will know of their shame. For now I just block them and avoid crewing on their ships in the future.
Although I really don't like Nathaniel Hawthorne's works, I am all for a "Scarlett Letter" for Abandoners. Especially the captains.
But at the current player base, I'm kinda scared that it'll drive people away. :(
-
I agree that punishing people who leave mid game would probably hurt the GOI community more than it would help, but I dearly wish to punish these people. Especially the captains. I can sympathies with crew wanting to leave a poorly run ship, but a captain leaving a game and forcing a crew to wing it is just despicable. They should have to wear a scarlet letter "A" for Abandoner for next few match lobbies so that every one will know of their shame. For now I just block them and avoid crewing on their ships in the future.
Iunno. When a noob captain quits I take over and either make a dignified last stand or an outright comeback. Because the crew tends to listen to the guy who clearly demonstrates skill.
tho, I doubt that'll happen as often as I imply because... noobs are dumb.
and besides I always preach that every player should know how to be all 3 classes.
My main issue with bitchquitting captains is that they leave me with their terribad ship builds, palming off responsibility for their ridiculous stupidity.
And what's worst? I encounter them again and they clearly havent learned.
-
I agree that punishing people who leave mid game would probably hurt the GOI community more than it would help, but I dearly wish to punish these people. Especially the captains. I can sympathies with crew wanting to leave a poorly run ship, but a captain leaving a game and forcing a crew to wing it is just despicable. They should have to wear a scarlet letter "A" for Abandoner for next few match lobbies so that every one will know of their shame. For now I just block them and avoid crewing on their ships in the future.
Iunno. When a noob captain quits I take over and either make a dignified last stand or an outright comeback. Because the crew tends to listen to the guy who clearly demonstrates skill.
tho, I doubt that'll happen as often as I imply because... noobs are dumb.
and besides I always preach that every player should know how to be all 3 classes.
My main issue with bitchquitting captains is that they leave me with their terribad ship builds, palming off responsibility for their ridiculous stupidity.
And what's worst? I encounter them again and they clearly havent learned.
Speaking of which,we really need to do something about ship loadouts. Right now half the lobbies generally have some captain or other who runs something like, I dunno. 4 flak junker? Lumberfish fighting brawler range? Art flak pyra? The list goes on. An official novice gun guide or simply a way to get them to pay attention to stats would be nice.
-
I'd like to know what happened to Novice matches... It seems most the novices are being pitted against higher levels, is this match maker or them choosing non novice themselves?
-
I'd like to know what happened to Novice matches... It seems most the novices are being pitted against higher levels, is this match maker or them choosing non novice themselves?
I've joined after halloween sales but I know for a fact that everytime you go to match options as novice you have the nov match option checked. So next time you see a level 4 captain they either think theyre too badass for novice or just havent bothered with the class until they got level 20 engi and gunner
-
I'd like to know what happened to Novice matches... It seems most the novices are being pitted against higher levels, is this match maker or them choosing non novice themselves?
I've joined after halloween sales but I know for a fact that everytime you go to match options as novice you have the nov match option checked. So next time you see a level 4 captain they either think theyre too badass for novice or just havent bothered with the class until they got level 20 engi and gunner
There's a lot of bad badasses in the world! Shame they cant walk the walk
-
I agree that punishing people who leave mid game would probably hurt the GOI community more than it would help, but I dearly wish to punish these people. Especially the captains. I can sympathies with crew wanting to leave a poorly run ship, but a captain leaving a game and forcing a crew to wing it is just despicable. They should have to wear a scarlet letter "A" for Abandoner for next few match lobbies so that every one will know of their shame. For now I just block them and avoid crewing on their ships in the future.
Iunno. When a noob captain quits I take over and either make a dignified last stand or an outright comeback. Because the crew tends to listen to the guy who clearly demonstrates skill.
tho, I doubt that'll happen as often as I imply because... noobs are dumb.
and besides I always preach that every player should know how to be all 3 classes.
My main issue with bitchquitting captains is that they leave me with their terribad ship builds, palming off responsibility for their ridiculous stupidity.
And what's worst? I encounter them again and they clearly havent learned.
Speaking of which,we really need to do something about ship loadouts. Right now half the lobbies generally have some captain or other who runs something like, I dunno. 4 flak junker? Lumberfish fighting brawler range? Art flak pyra? The list goes on. An official novice gun guide or simply a way to get them to pay attention to stats would be nice.
Theres plenty of info available for noobs to listen and read. they just don't bother.
Only improvement in noob gameplay is when you force their hand. If noobs can bring the correct tools then at least I can begin teaching fundamentals.
You can't teach anything to a extinguisher, chem, buff with bumpers and inci ammo engie
-
Theres plenty of info available for noobs to listen and read. they just don't bother.
Only improvement in noob gameplay is when you force their hand. If noobs can bring the correct tools then at least I can begin teaching fundamentals.
You can't teach anything to a extinguisher, chem, buff with bumpers and inci ammo engie
Well, the info aren't so obvious. They'd either have to go through a pretty shabby tutorial, dig through the forums, or check our poorly updated wiki... The popular youtubers were good at advertising the game, but not so much at giving the basics.
And you can teach to an extinguisher, chem, buff engi. You can teach him the trick with abandoning match and rejoining with a different load out. That's something fresh players (I say fresh instead of noob) could definitely learn. You can teach him stuff like, no need for two fire tools, no need for helm tools when you won't be on helm, consider heatsink your first few matches, and stuff like that.
-
Just had the pleasure of a reletively new guy lionuisse on my ship for some time, was more than happy to watch him progress from not knowing where the metamidion gatling was to reaching "Close range weapons" weapon change on mobula. And changing guns very quickly. Not all newbies need forcing or being treated like scum, granted many new players are, but if we treat and teach them all like they're not worthy then we'll push away the good ones..
Maybe try adapting to the buff chem ext guys, let them try to do their jobs, make them buff engines, hull then guns make them ext the fires too big for.chem and tell them to keep chem cycles, make them work and explain why when things go wrong they are going wrong...
Besides a whole new batch of CAs accepted I hope to see them working hard on teaching new players :)
-
I'd like to know what happened to Novice matches... It seems most the novices are being pitted against higher levels, is this match maker or them choosing non novice themselves?
I'd like to know where all the players above like level 1-16 went because you see like 1 ever 20 games if you don't play with friends.. (exaggeration) ..
--
As for people rage quitting... Note sometimes that helps the lobby... I like when I win after my whole crew abandons me because we died once. Sometimes a two ai gunner one ai engi junker.. is op.
I don't think locking people into a lobby will help.. Because they can alt-f4 and can just flat out troll because they wanna quit but can't.. So better if they leave..
I am pretty sure there is already an increased time to get in the next lobby if you abandon one? or didn't they actually put that in? I know they talked about it.. but I never abandon a lobby so I don't know.. I don't think that will stop people rage quitting though.. Hard to make losing an incentive..
-
I'd like to know what happened to Novice matches... It seems most the novices are being pitted against higher levels, is this match maker or them choosing non novice themselves?
I'd like to know where all the players above like level 1-16 went because you see like 1 ever 20 games if you don't play with friends.. (exaggeration) ..
I'd like to play a match with some one who played more matches than I have. Seriously, I though 250 was small.
-
The thing is, there already is incentive to loose...
Match completion, mine is at 97%. 3% being me afking to goto my twin toddlers or internet disconnections, this is incentive to some people.
Also experience on match completion, if you die once and quit you'll get such a pitiful amount of exp the time spent waiting for the next match not being worth the exp gain but getting more exp for the whole match, again incentive to stay..
There is not that much MUSE can do about the rage quitters, they see a shooter game on sale and buy it without looking to see if they will like the game... So I think this is less, what can muse do to help and more what can we do to help...
Utilize the tools we have in game and steam to faster separate the good the bad and the ugly.
-
It is an age old problem but one that becomes more prominent with MM systems. MMOs solve it by cooldowns as a punishment. Sure sometimes disconnects/etc get caught by it but the greater damage is done by the quitters, not the innocent who happens to rarely get caught.
I warned about this too. If you add MM, this will be a problem. These players are often newbs and have no concept of XP or even desire to level up at all. They just want to win and if they see a challenge to hard, they'll quit and find an easier match.
So, given Muse's track record with rocking the boat and actually punishing bad players which hurt the good players, there is another way this can be done.
Instead of direct time lock on an account for quitting early, do a 100% XP reduction. For every quit the reduction increases up till an hour. I'd even say make the reduction visible on the character. Maybe a color code or icon on their name. Then you know when you are playing with these players and can prepare for it. Course you could hide this and just put it on their profile cause likely someone will cry discrimination from this. Which players would do. I don't doubt that. Heck if I saw a bunch of debuffed players join in I'd go requeue and hope for a new lobby. But. the simple fact is, it would work. Would be a soft punishment that would allow the community to punish these players by just not playing with them.
When they finally learn they can't come and go and enrage allies/foes, they'll either go back to CoD or shape up. "Why am I still level 1? I've played a dozen matches!" "Well that is because you've quit every single match early and gained no XP. Finish matches and level up!"
Hmm, thinking about that, adding a simple bonus XP boost for match completion would also help this problem. The XP increase is already extremely small outside of achievements.
-
Theres plenty of info available for noobs to listen and read. they just don't bother.
Only improvement in noob gameplay is when you force their hand. If noobs can bring the correct tools then at least I can begin teaching fundamentals.
You can't teach anything to a extinguisher, chem, buff with bumpers and inci ammo engie
Well, the info aren't so obvious. They'd either have to go through a pretty shabby tutorial, dig through the forums, or check our poorly updated wiki... The popular youtubers were good at advertising the game, but not so much at giving the basics.
And you can teach to an extinguisher, chem, buff engi. You can teach him the trick with abandoning match and rejoining with a different load out. That's something fresh players (I say fresh instead of noob) could definitely learn. You can teach him stuff like, no need for two fire tools, no need for helm tools when you won't be on helm, consider heatsink your first few matches, and stuff like that.
Manual. Its right there. I keep saying it on global. read the manual.
and lol most noobs don't even know what tools are and barely even know how to move. You think I'm going to be assuming they know how to navigate menus correctly if they can't even move forward?
I've met so many noobs that can't even find the function keys....
-
Yes and that's why they need help to learn, they're used to different games, many joining this one in the hopes for fun and games, and to blow stuff up.
Not everyone is born MLG-Pro and not everyone reads the instructions, hell I only did the tutorials when I started and I'm pretty sure pissed off a lot of higher levels too in my newbieness but then I met Captain Vann (Vannlander) who actually put up with my newb skills and helped teach the basics eventually leading to me joining the pretty baby grandmas clan which led to me not leaving the game and I continued playing until I met my now TT friends.
Another problem.with newbies, they're ignoring the calmer vets after they meet the automatically hostile and angry vets.. Again it falls on the community.
-
And the manual isn't much help either.
It tells you the basics, real, real basics. Whack broken stuff, get on helm to pilot, and tool descriptions.
Ship layouts, gun arcs, arming time, projectile drops, proper application of chem, and other things are not in manual. Some of these need to be unlocked, some of these just need to be taught or experienced.
As a big game nerd, I've read through all the manuals. I won most novice matches, but it took digging through the forum to learn how to effectively use piloting tools and etc.
-
Would this also affect rejoining the same game or only ragequitting to find a new match? Because we are all familiar with the circumstance in which you're dropped into a lobby with two seconds left on the clock and can't change your loadout so you have to abandon match to adjust it, and I would be pretty annoyed if there were a cooldown preventing that.
-
Would this also affect rejoining the same game or only ragequitting to find a new match? Because we are all familiar with the circumstance in which you're dropped into a lobby with two seconds left on the clock and can't change your loadout so you have to abandon match to adjust it, and I would be pretty annoyed if there were a cooldown preventing that.
Good point well made.
-
Me personally have long since advocated for a system of this type in any and all games where teamwork is needed. I dream of a system where the leave percentage could be used to determine your lock out time, maybe something like:
100-95% completion - It was most likely you can not join another game until the reconnect timer goes down to 0 (3 min of time)
95-70% - Maybe not all of those are dcs but not to bad (5 or 10 min lockout (can ofc rejoin the ruining game as normal))
<70% - You clearly don't care about your teammates so a longer time is valid (30 min)
Non of these are horribly long but I do think that even small punishments can make people think twice as even 10 min can be enough to kill your buss. This system also caters to players who have played more (I do believe them to be less likely to quit without a good reason). It also allows people who dc to get back in their game without penalty, and well if you have a dc in more than 30% of your games I doubt that the game is playable for you any way.
Either way I think something have to be done as right now entire ships can leave after one death and just ruin a game completely. And this game focuses so much on teamwork that just one person leaving might ruin the game for everyone... :(
PS I doubt xp loss will be enough for any one to care seeing how fast you can level and that most of these guys will stay as long as they are wining
-
Good notes Hillerton. Salute!
-
I think a simple mechanic would be a lockout, if someone ragequits the game after first engagement they can't join any other lobbies for 5 minutes, and the timer would increase as their leave ratio gets worse. Like hillerton says.
If you try to join a different lobby or crewform or solo queue (practice mode still allowed) you get an annoying popup "FINISH YOUR OLD GAME FIRST BEFORE STARTING ANOTHER ONE", and a button to rejoin the old one.
-
Oh hey, could just use the stock rejoin thing as a lockout. So they can't join or start anything new for 2 minutes. That would help.
-
I quite like the "reduce xp gain for an hour per DC" idea, but as Hillerton mentioned, these type of people are probably more about winning. What of a system where if you DC and don't reconnect, you're forced to play in Novice matches for 2 hours if you're below level 8? I haven't been in a novice match in almost two years, so I have no idea what goes on in there, but I'm assuming 80% of rage DC's are in normal matches from Novice players, seeing as Novice matches are, well, novice, and a bit more easy on the new players.
-
work around.
click exit game. restart.