Guns Of Icarus Online
Main => The Classroom => Q&A => Topic started by: CheeseAlmighty on August 24, 2014, 07:33:54 am
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Hello there, I've been flying for a quite a while(not a veteran per se, but seen my share of battles), but due to something I read over here somewhere, I may be confused a bit. :3
When turning ship, my commandant senses tell me it's faster to reverse engines and then turn, rather than shutting down engines(0 throttle) and then turning. It feels like it, and makes sense in my mind as well. Regardless, did anybody measure the time needed, or does anybody have any exact numbers? Or any reliable information(I'm looking at you, seasoned captains)?
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Well there was a diagram that explained it pretty well (which I've lost), but basically:
If the enemy ship is going to go PAST you, then going into 1 or 2 reverse is going to put you on target faster because you are simultaneously increasing perpendicular distance while turning.
(something like that anyway xD)
EDIT: I FOUND IT
https://gunsoficarus.com/community/forum/index.php/topic,2328.msg39677.html#msg39677
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Yea I think the amount of turning you do is relatively constant - what changes is your forwards/backwards location relative to them.
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The turning itself is faster when your not moving. But when you move backwards your more likely to get arcs earlier.
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You turn fastest with neutral throttle. One of the devs explained how it works. I may not be remembering this exactly, so don't quote me. When at neutral throttle, one engine has full thrust forward, the other backwards. When throttle is not neutral, the turning engines hold the same ratio to each other (up to max output), thus making your turn slower. The reason this is is because one turning will max out at full forward (since it can't go double thrust forward), while the other goes to neutral.
Neutral:
----->
0
<-----
Max forward (turning right):
---------->
----->
0
As you can see, the RED indicates the thrust that would be given by the left engine IF the thrust ratio was preserved. Since it can't go beyond max thrust, this is not possible and you basically get 50% turning power, while also losing a good deal of forward acceleration.
Going in reverse does allow you to turn faster than forward, since your main throttle is not maxed out. This allows less loss of the turning ratio. However, it is still a slower turn than neutral.
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It should be noted that reverse throttle speeds are 50% slower than forward throttle speeds. And the reversing engine during a neutral turn is also producing half the thrust of the forward output engine.
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Alright, got it, thanks everyone! :3
And may your gruyere be hot, and roquefort blue. <3
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Aw, roquefort looks wonderful <3
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You're not taking in forward momentum forward....
Have you even seen that 3 hour movie the titanic. It's a basic principle but cycling the engines from forward to back actually does make you turn faster....
However from a neutral position yes It's easier to get your archs in while the engines are neutral
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I don't have numbers but by going by missisipi one, missisipi two...missisipi twenty menthod of counting time, same 360° turn tuned to take to 20 on a stock junker (within measurement error) no mater if it was full foward, full reverse or neutral throttle position. No I did not have a stop watch to accurately measure time.
The reason why you put ship in full reverse when enemy is passing you, is to more easily keep arc or get back into arc faster (you don't have to do a 180° turn when reversing). going full foward you are ruaranteed to lose arc of enemy passing by you. Putting throttle in full reverse is also to make tighter turns (especialy if you were going full foward previously) If you were stacionary you generaly don't need to put in reverse when turning).
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It's a basic principle but cycling the engines from forward to back actually does make you turn faster....
Not faster but tighter turn, witch in many maps is more important.
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Isn't that what we're arguing the tighter turn?
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(Oh look another cheese person :P )
But yeah, pretty much what the others said.
It's faster to turn while staying still but if the enemy is coming towards you reversing and turning will get your arcs on them faster and keep you closer.
In my opinion you can look at the maths and calculations but when there are hwachas exploding everywhere and people screaming on the mic you'll probably just follow your instincts :P
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(Oh look another cheese person :P)
(Cheese is love, cheese is life, hai! :P)
Well then,it's settled:You reverse the engines to keep enemy in the arc, dependent on the situation of course (since a maneuver can get you on their tail).
Hmm, should we keep discussing the raw turning rate then? I feel like we don't need to, but who doesn't love some trivia. :3 Otherwise, let's wrap the thread and lock it :3
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Only if you are trying to keep an approaching ship in arc. If you want to take a quick corner in the city, you go full throttle forward, cut the engines as you are about to hit the corner, and crank the helm while continuing to drift. Once clear and facing the direction you want to go, full throttle again.
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Well duh turning by crashing is faster than any other turning.
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Well duh turning by crashing is faster than any other turning.
Instant 180 degree turns FTW. Which happens for reason, because you know, physics.
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Coming at this from a different angle; I believe that you turn slower while in motion not from momentum (or at least not just from momentum), but from drag. The faster your ship is moving, the more drag is applied to your ship. I'm not sure if this is universal (ie: the faster you move forward, the higher angular and vertical drag as well as longitudinal drag), or specific to direction only (longitudinal speed only effecting longitudinal drag, angular speed affecting angular drag, etc).
Experiences leads me to believe there is some kind of universal effect. It feels that the faster your ship is moving, the more difficult it is to go up and down; as well as turning. So slowing down/stopping by throwing the ship into full reverse appears to make the ship turn faster, or rather that moving your ship longitudinally reduces your ability to turn effectively. I could be wrong of course, as I haven't actually tested any of this; it's just how the game 'feels' to function.
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Just tested. Turning speeds are identical whether you are moving (drifting for the turn after coming off full throttle) or standing still. 360 turning time on a Goldfish is a little over 26 seconds either way.
Turning while under full power takes almost 28 seconds. Going full reverse at the start of a turn is almost 28 seconds. So, almost the same. Slower turn than neutral throttle by almost 2 seconds.
Using balloon does not effect turning times at all.
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Mostly @Thomas:
Drag calculations along each axis (longitudinal, lateral, vertical, angular) are independent and are proportional only to your speed along that axis.
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bunch of nerds up in here 8)