Guns Of Icarus Online
Info => Feedback and Suggestions => Topic started by: Schwerbelastung on May 03, 2014, 06:27:36 am
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Hey there, got a small inspiration when playing another game (Space Engineers) where you have spaceships that have "dampeners" that stabilize your ship.
General idea: You have a mechanic - a piloting tool that occupies one slot - that you can use to have the ship automatically stabilize itself using the engine and the insert/release gas to the balloon mechanics. If it was possible, the piloting tool could use hydrogen and kerosene/moonshine (if the pilot had chosen them) to stabilize the ship sooner, and the stabilizer would do damage to the balloon and the engines as long as the ship is still moving. After the ship has stopped moving, the downside of the stabilizer is that you effectively cannot move any more.
Target audience: Sniper ships and other ships that benefit from relocating and then trying to stabilize the ship asap. This would add versatility to ship/pilot builds if it was considered powerful enough.
Pros: There isn't a piloting tool like this in the game currently. This would be a viable and hopefully not too good piloting tool for long range builds.
Cons: I'm not sure if the idea itself is enough to warrant picking it over a combo such as claw/kerosene or moonshine/hydro or tar.
Potential modifications: Maybe there could be an added bonus, such as the balloon and guns taking 25% decreased damage from enemy fire to make this a "sniper" or a "turret" tool? Remember that the stabilizer tries to stabilize the ship and combat any momentum - you couldn't effectively start or keep moving the ship with this buff on. The ship (hull+hull armor) would go down just as fast as before, but you would be a stronger disabler and supporter in long range battles due to added durability to guns and the balloon.
Any comments?
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Sounds interesting, rename it to "anchor" =P I don't think it needs to damage balloon and engines, perhaps it could remain active for a few seconds after use (impact bumpers and drogue chute don't damage anything). I can imagine this being used outside of sniper builds to quickly reduce momentum before making sharp turns.
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Sounds interesting, rename it to "anchor" =P I don't think it needs to damage balloon and engines, perhaps it could remain active for a few seconds after use (impact bumpers and drogue chute don't damage anything).
Good point. They do not damage the ship, but at least the bumpers (and likely the chute) decrease engine output. I guess this function has already been kind of built in to the anchor, huh? I like the name suggestion too.
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Basically iron sights and prone mode in a FPS. Run around, stop, crouch, sight down barrel. Sniping doesn't need a special tool. Think aside from Ducks and Gents, most players/casters, would rather there be less sniping.
A tool like this would be problematic for balancing. Like say the anchor drops and yeah plants the boat. But at the same time it effectively disables the ship. Can't move or turn even after it is released. Say 5-10 seconds. You make it like that and you got something no sniper will take as losing the ability to evade or duck to cover for even a few seconds could cost a match. Without that it is just too powerful a tool even if it did damage components/etc.
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Basically iron sights and prone mode in a FPS. Run around, stop, crouch, sight down barrel. Sniping doesn't need a special tool. Think aside from Ducks and Gents, most players/casters, would rather there be less sniping.
A tool like this would be problematic for balancing. Like say the anchor drops and yeah plants the boat. But at the same time it effectively disables the ship. Can't move or turn even after it is released. Say 5-10 seconds. You make it like that and you got something no sniper will take as losing the ability to evade or duck to cover for even a few seconds could cost a match. Without that it is just too powerful a tool even if it did damage components/etc.
What if it worked like Moonshine, added 1000% horizontal drag? You could still move, but very slowly. You would have to lift the anchor if enemies close in on you or move past your gun arcs too quickly. I'm not confident that this would be unreasonably hard to balance around, and it might not be that devastating even if used by competent snipers - if an enemy ship closes in, the tool would be rendered near worthless unless the enemy stays in your arc on purpose. Unlike tools like kero, moonshine, claw, and hydrogen, which continue to be potentially useful throughout the match.
edit. Spelling mistakes.
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I think the proper name and actual mechanism would be 'gyroscope'. A large gyroscope would do everything you have requested, as well as damage the ship with the torque it generates.
Rather than damage engines, I would make it damage the armor if you try to use any engines or balloon, and increase damage to the armor if impacted. You could still move and adjust your ship slowly, at the risk of losing some armor.
Also, since that is not really the best pro/con ratio to warrant its use ever, add in complete removal of ship 'bobbing' and partial stabilization of all guns, as if heavy clip was loaded. Not complete reduction of recoil, but maybe 50-75% dampening.
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I think the proper name and actual mechanism would be 'gyroscope'. A large gyroscope would do everything you have requested, as well as damage the ship with the torque it generates.
Rather than damage engines, I would make it damage the armor if you try to use any engines or balloon, and increase damage to the armor if impacted. You could still move and adjust your ship slowly, at the risk of losing some armor.
Also, since that is not really the best pro/con ratio to warrant its use ever, add in complete removal of ship 'bobbing' and partial stabilization of all guns, as if heavy clip was loaded. Not complete reduction of recoil, but maybe 50-75% dampening.
That doesn't sound too bad.
So basically, we would have a stabilizer/anchor/gyroscope, which would effectively stabilize the ship and damage it in case you tried to move, would combat any attempts to gain momentum by the player, and perhaps protect the balloon and the guns a little.
You would be a sitting duck in a sense, not being able to move your ship very much at all as long as the buff was on. However, you would be able to slowly turn your ship, your main engineer could use his/her mallet to compensate for the turning/altitude change damage, your gunners would get a good shot but the tool would basically only be really good when there are no enemy ships too close. If the phoenix claw is the "op" (more or less must have) brawling tool.. maybe this would be a good alternative for a long range tool?
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This tool would actually be a must-have for lesmok Gatling+Flak/hwacha Spires, or other builds using max range on high recoil guns.
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This tool would actually be a must-have for lesmok Gatling+Flak/hwacha Spires, or other builds using max range on high recoil guns.
Yes, if it had the added function of stabilizing ships or reducing recoil. That wasn't in my initial idea, but I'm open when it comes to playing around with ideas. The problem I see with reducing recoil is that it could make gunners even less needed, as if you could be a buff engineer with just burst rounds and a sort-of heavy clip (with burst rounds, no less!) through a piloting tool it might be hard to balance.
Can you please elaborate on your idea a bit and consider if it could be balanced considering everything else?
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i am torn.
i love the idea of a ship stabilization tool. but i dont want to make it any easier for snipers :P.
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i am torn.
i love the idea of a ship stabilization tool. but i dont want to make it any easier for snipers :P.
Well, you have to consider that it's a double-edged sword. It's only really useful for snipers if the enemy doesn't get close. If an enemy gets close, they no longer have 3 effective anti-brawl tools (kero/moonshine + claw + hydro/tar for instance), but 2. :)
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Well, you have to consider that it's a double-edged sword. It's only really useful for snipers if the enemy doesn't get close. If an enemy gets close, they no longer have 3 effective anti-brawl tools (kero/moonshine + claw + hydro/tar for instance), but 2. :)
this is true. just not sure if it will be enough of a handicap against a skilled sniper team that no longer has to deal with their own ship's movements, its really close. like i said, i love the idea, and it could potentially make things very interesting. could even see some use on more mid-range oriented builds for situational movement control. It definitely merits testing.
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My main concern with just a stabilizing tool is that it is not needed, and is sort of redundant. Turn off your engines and kick on moonshine, and you stop turning completely. Feather the throttle and balloon a bit, and being motionless is easy. Tiny thrusts of moonshine while turning, or using bumpers makes micro adjustments simple. These tools are also great if they start closing, or get to you.
Really, it is not even needed as a sniping aid. Sniping is pretty easy as it is, and I don't see making your easily stable platform even more stable as something anyone would need or use. Would it actually add much to sniping? Not really. No real benefit warranting replacing tools that are useful for stabilizing and combat/escape. It kinda seems like it would be an 'Easy Button' for pilots of sniper ships, which have a rather boring job as it is.
If you added the gun dampening feature, it would not help the long range guns at all, since they have little to no recoil. The ship stabilization would help some at long range, but not really enough to warrant bringing it. That would put it right in the mid-range, high reward, high risk area of combat. Mid-range because of the heavy-ish gun dampening. High reward because of the improved hit chance of mid-short range guns with higher recoil, and use of higher damage ammo. High risk due to the sacrifice of combat and evasive tools, and that you will actually damage your own ship if you even try to evade during the release cooldown (lasts X seconds after tool is deactivated).
Let's take the example of the dual hwacha, gatling Galleon. Mid range disable, close range kill build. It is also easy to close on with fast ships, easy to snipe out with long range builds, and easy to kill with mid-range builds. These things can be overcome with other pilot tools to some extent. Using the stabilizing/dampening tool would change the behavior of your ship quite a bit. Yes, you could get rid of your gunner, but I would not, for the following reasons.
1. Lesmok would actually have a use in the hwacha, and be far more useful in the gatling. You can get an increased rate of disable at the extent of the hwacha range, almost being able to contend with most sniper builds. You can also get more accurate shots at mid range on rapidly moving ships.
2. You don't want to only have lesmok. That makes a gunner necessary already on any hwacha/dampened ship.
3. Incendiary would be much more useful making it a more viable ammo. Most of the time if it is brought, it is the third "What else should I bring?" "Don't care. Incend if you want", just used if the enemy ship is already crippled ammo. This would make it more viable as an offensive ammo at max close range. You would no longer load hwachas and carros with incend for the lulz. With spit second coordination between pilot and gunner, it would prove greatly effective. At max incend range, the pilot orders the ammo loaded, kicks in the gyros, takes some armor damage as the ship shudders to a halt, and orders the barrage. Of course, a poorly done maneuver like this will end with your ship immobilized and vulnerable.
4. Burst, of course. What is not to like about more burst shots hitting?
5. Heavy clip. Still needed as the go-to first contact ammo choice. Even better with the dampers bringing the ship to a screeching halt right before you fire.
In short, I think this tool would make a gunner far more effective with an increased number of viable ammo types.
The big con, of course, is that any time you do use it, your ship is almost completely immobilized, much worse than using bumpers or chute, and takes damage if you try to adjust. The effect would last for several seconds after you stop using it as your gyros spun down. Perhaps the gun dampening would only last while the tool was in active mode, removing the cooldown time as part of the beneficial 'heavy-like' gunning period.
A lesser con is that it would only help much on guns with recoil. It would help some with long range braking after repositioning, but moonshine is a much more viable tool when it comes to bringing your sniper ship's rotation to an instant halt.
I feel that these things would make the tool a balanced offensive, crippling defensive tool, which I feel are lacking in the pilot's arsenal. There would always be some risk in turning it on, and would entirely depend on your piloting preferences. Using it correctly at just the right time would be devastating to your foes. Misjudging the timing would mean certain defeat.
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You make a fair amount of good points. The thing is that I am a little afraid of the gunner class's viability as it is, and I would think that buffing engineers with one superior round type + normal rounds would be fairly powerful after this change, if the pilot could bring a "50%-75% reduced recoil semi-heavy clip" for "free". Yes, the gunner can bring 2 additional rounds, but in my eyes the added repair/rebuild/firefighting ability - especially with the improved flamers - is a lot to sacrifice for the extra ammo.
However, what if the gunners were the only ones who would benefit from the reduced recoil? There might be coding issues behind this, but it's a fun idea to play around with regardless. This way you could get both the increased efficiency from the tool, making it a fairly strong one, and still keep the gunner class viable. You wouldn't need a gunner for this tool to be effective at stabilizing your ship, but if you wanted to be a true turret/sniper, you would bring a pilot and a gunner - and of course the weaponry - to go along with the build.
Now, about the point that this could be a redundant tool for experienced players, that is a possibility. A helm tool whose only job is to stabilize the ship would not be attractive to people who already know how to stabilize their ship manually. However, if the stabilizator actually interacted with the thorttle and the rudder - a sort of cruise control/autopilot if you will - a new player would see what he would need to do in order to stabilize the ship. This could possibly make the tool a newbie friendly way of learning how to control the ship. Eventually they would get the jist of it and be able to switch the tool to something else and still be effective at stabilizing their ships.
The trick that in my eyes would make this superior to manually stabilizing your ship would be the reduced damage taken to balloon and guns. Your light guns would no longer be one shot with an Artemis (the Mercury could still probably do the trick with a direct hit), and your balloon wouldn't be as vulnerable.
It's true that another tool like the chute vent which is very, very rarely used to great effect is probably not worth the coding hours. However, with tweaks such as the gun dampening effect or reduced damage to guns/balloon, it could be a viable - a different - approach of building a ship that is mainly designed to be a long range support - with its drawbacks, of course.
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The trick that in my eyes would make this superior to manually stabilizing your ship would be the reduced damage taken to balloon and guns. Your light guns would no longer be one shot with an Artemis (the Mercury could still probably do the trick with a direct hit), and your balloon wouldn't be as vulnerable.
That's a bad idea.
First of all, I think there's some kind of logic behind every aspect of other tools, why is it exactly that parts are damaged etc. Having an anchor, or any kind of ship stabilizer shouldn't anyhow affect the durability of ship parts IMO.
But that's only about my sticking to some sort of in-game logic in the mechanics, the real problem is the damage reduction from a pilot's tool would make it ridiculously beneficial not just for sniping ships, but for every single ship in the game, especially for Pyramidion.
Overall I like the idea of the tool itself, it would be a real nice option for the sniping ships to keep your ship stable. But providing you with additional damage reduction from enemy fire is another thing that I don't see working well.
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The trick that in my eyes would make this superior to manually stabilizing your ship would be the reduced damage taken to balloon and guns. Your light guns would no longer be one shot with an Artemis (the Mercury could still probably do the trick with a direct hit), and your balloon wouldn't be as vulnerable.
That's a bad idea.
First of all, I think there's some kind of logic behind every aspect of other tools, why is it exactly that parts are damaged etc. Having an anchor, or any kind of ship stabilizer shouldn't anyhow affect the durability of ship parts IMO.
But that's only about my sticking to some sort of in-game logic in the mechanics, the real problem is the damage reduction from a pilot's tool would make it ridiculously beneficial not just for sniping ships, but for every single ship in the game, especially for Pyramidion.
Overall I like the idea of the tool itself, it would be a real nice option for the sniping ships to keep your ship stable. But providing you with additional damage reduction from enemy fire is another thing that I don't see working well.
I feel that there should be at least some added benefit than just stabilizing the ship to make the tool worth sacrificing a piloting tool slot for. Richard's idea about severely reduced recoil seemed in my eyes very hard to balance properly as well. Do you think there could be an in your eyes both efficient and balanced 3rd option?
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I feel that there should be at least some added benefit than just stabilizing the ship to make the tool worth sacrificing a piloting tool slot for. Richard's idea about severely reduced recoil seemed in my eyes very hard to balance properly as well. Do you think there could be an in your eyes both efficient and balanced 3rd option?
Well, it would be quite funny to use the anchor to kill the ships below you xD
Assuming it would be an anchor, a "knockback" reduction, from all the rams and mines, would be in place, basically so the enemy ship that rammed you would hit you like a wall, bouncing off to the side, while your ship stays more or less in one place. This of course could also help other ships than sniping ones, but not to the extent of it becoming new meta.
I think this tool could go well with the idea behind it being an extreme version of Impact bumpers, like Moonshine for Kerosene, making the ship completely immobile for a few seconds, maybe even damaging engines and armor for trying to use engines during the time, but providing ship stabilization, reduced impact damage and reduced impact knockback. Reduced impact damage doesn't exactly fit the idea behind an anchor, but, as I believe it has been said in Frozen, "it doesn't have to be an anchor".
The thing about balancing the tool is to make it useful for the ships that prefer fighting from a distance with the stabilization, but not make it too useful for close range, charging ships. I think the best way to do it is to provide benefits for the tool of such kind that give no bonuses for a ship that intends to use it for close range encounters, but are useful for the crew of the ship being attacked in close range. It's kinda tricky to be honest, I'm not even 100% sure about my own idea, but I know that as much as my idea may not be the best solution, damage reduction from enemy fire is even further from it.
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Alright, summing up some of the ideas from this thread to see what kind of stuff we've been talking about. Please do tell if I've missed anything. Also feel free to keep adding suggestions, this is just an update.
Name ideas: Stabilizer, gyroscope, anchor
General idea: A piloting tool that you can use to have the ship automatically stabilize itself using the engine and the insert/release gas to the balloon mechanics. After the ship has stopped moving, the downside of the stabilizer is that you effectively cannot move any more.
Target audience: Sniper ships and other ships that benefit from relocating and then trying to stabilize the ship asap. Newbie-friendly too, in the sense that it could be an "auto-pilot" that executes ship stabilization perfectly using the throttle and the balloon controls.
Benefits of using the tool: Stabilizes the ship quickly. Gives long range ships an option to try to get the enemy in their arcs as quickly as possible and then stabilize the ship for their gunners.
Various possible side benefits that have been suggested: Reduces the recoil of the guns, similar to a Heavy Clip but not as effectively. A proposed reduction of 50-75% in recoil. Reduction of damage taken to balloon and weapons, but not the hull or the engines. Perhaps only a reduction from taken shatter and flechette damage to make this feature slightly less devastating? A reduction in impact damage was also suggested. This should not be too great, however, so that the impact bumpers are not rendered obsolete.
More or less logical drawbacks of using the tool: Cannot maneuver the ship properly. Due to actively combating increase in momentum, there would be a for example +1000% vertical drag and 500% upwards horizontal drag. Upwards drag so this wouldn't render the drogue chute useless. Cannot be used effectively at close range as you are unable to keep the enemy in your arc or maneuver properly.
Possible additional drawbacks: Damage taken by the hull when the tool is active and the ship is moving / being moved. Damage to balloon and engines was also proposed, if the ship was in motion while the stabilizator was online. To prevent abuse, you could have an internal cooldown to toggling off the mechanic, much like with hydrogen or impact bumpers. Flip the switch on and off, and the ship will spend 5 or so seconds in "stabilization mode", with all the benefits and drawbacks.
Things to consider: This would replace one of the piloting tools for a long range ship with a tool that loses most if not all its benefits at close range. Currently the sniper ships can choose from piloting tools that may benefit them both at long and close ranges. This could be used similarly to moonshine to avoid being knocked off arc when being rammed, but due to the internal cooldown you couldn't "abuse" it as you would be unable to turn to face the enemy that just rammed you in case he wasn't already in your arc.
The tool could possibly stabilize the ship even more quickly if the pilot had kero/moonshine and drogue chute/hydrogen as his other piloting tools. If you didn't need them, and the tool had only the increased horizontal and upwards vertical drags, it could be a viable replacement for kerosene/moonshine on sniper ships and a counter-ramming tool, however the pilot would lose an escape tool if he opted to replace kero/moonshine with this. If you have ever tried to manually stabilize a long-range Mobula without alternate fuel tools after turning it for a few seconds with Phoenix Claw, you know what I'm talking about when I say that long-range captains can greatly benefit from some kind of reduced horizontal drag.
In conclusion: This tool would have the potential of becoming the "go-to" tool for long range ships, much like Kerosene/Moonshine and Phoenix Claw already are for brawling builds. It needs to be efficient enough to warrant a piloting tool slot, but also not too powerful for it to be very useful outside select sniper scenarios.
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Schwer, the suggestion on hull damage was for when the ship is turning with the tool being active.
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I already use Moonshine to stop a swing, or stabilize the speed by looking at the flags.
An option like this would be great.
I also think combining this with maybe kyrosine could proove for a better "Stop and go backwards as fast as possible immidiatly" situation.
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Schwer, the suggestion on hull damage was for when the ship is turning with the tool being active.
Thanks, I'll try to get that fixed by a mod at some point. I hate leaving small inaccuracies (that I know of) behind :P
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Have you considered harpoons?
If I had a Spire that has a harpoon on it it would instantly turn the spire out of arcs. Also it moves my ship towards the enemy which I actually don't want to happen.
This tool could allow me to use a harpoon on any ship and on any gun slot without having my ship turn against my will and without my ship getting pulled towards the enemy. I could actually reer the enemy in or even have them get stuck on the piece of cover that they were trying to get behind.
I see much more use for this tool when combined with a harpoon, when fighting mines or even combined with impact bumbers and less long range use.
Also, what would happen if everything on your ship is disabled? Does it still damage your engines/balloon/armor if you don't have these things anymore? Would it do perma hull damage? Or would the tool just not work if the thing that is to be damages is already destroyed? I think it would be rather useful to have a tool that can stop you from moving while your engines are down, like drouge chute slows your drop while your balloon is down.
Does it really have to damage anything? Why not leave it at bringing your ship to a deadstop no matter what you do while the tool is activated?
If you want to stop the tool from being abused why not leave it active for X seconds after deactivation or even ave the accelaration of everything be incredibly decreased and increase it by X% over a period of Y seconds until it's back to normal? Making it possible to move your ship again, but with the decreased accelartion your enemy can still gain the upper hand.
However, I do not see why the abuse of this tool would be severe enough to punish it in general. It should not reduce the damage you take or reduce recoil, which has nothing to do with the ship at all, making this tool less realistic than the entire game. It should just stabilize the ship and stop it from moving entirely.
The punishment already is when you have to give up a pilot tool. If you combine it with impact bumbers to counter rams entirely you have to give up 2 slots already leaving you only 1 more slot for more engine power or vertical evasion.
And Schwer: Having the tool interact with the throttle and stuff might confuse the player at times if they didn't read the description correctly. Causing more confusion than it was supposed to fix. Another possibility might be that the player is looking away while activating this tool, making it's interaction kinda pointless.
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Have you considered harpoons?
If I had a Spire that has a harpoon on it it would instantly turn the spire out of arcs. Also it moves my ship towards the enemy which I actually don't want to happen.
This tool could allow me to use a harpoon on any ship and on any gun slot without having my ship turn against my will and without my ship getting pulled towards the enemy. I could actually reer the enemy in or even have them get stuck on the piece of cover that they were trying to get behind.
I see much more use for this tool when combined with a harpoon, when fighting mines or even combined with impact bumbers and less long range use.
Also, what would happen if everything on your ship is disabled? Does it still damage your engines/balloon/armor if you don't have these things anymore? Would it do perma hull damage? Or would the tool just not work if the thing that is to be damages is already destroyed? I think it would be rather useful to have a tool that can stop you from moving while your engines are down, like drouge chute slows your drop while your balloon is down.
Does it really have to damage anything? Why not leave it at bringing your ship to a deadstop no matter what you do while the tool is activated?
If you want to stop the tool from being abused why not leave it active for X seconds after deactivation or even ave the accelaration of everything be incredibly decreased and increase it by X% over a period of Y seconds until it's back to normal? Making it possible to move your ship again, but with the decreased accelartion your enemy can still gain the upper hand.
However, I do not see why the abuse of this tool would be severe enough to punish it in general. It should not reduce the damage you take or reduce recoil, which has nothing to do with the ship at all, making this tool less realistic than the entire game. It should just stabilize the ship and stop it from moving entirely.
The punishment already is when you have to give up a pilot tool. If you combine it with impact bumbers to counter rams entirely you have to give up 2 slots already leaving you only 1 more slot for more engine power or vertical evasion.
And Schwer: Having the tool interact with the throttle and stuff might confuse the player at times if they didn't read the description correctly. Causing more confusion than it was supposed to fix. Another possibility might be that the player is looking away while activating this tool, making it's interaction kinda pointless.
Thanks for the input. I agree that it could be very useful with harpoons, and to a certain extent also that it could be confusing if a new player didn't read the description.
However, it would be cool to let new people know somehow that the functionality that this tool offers can be achieved through other means. It's not crucial, but it would be kind of a "hidden tutorial" as ship stabilization is not something all new players consider or are very good at.
I also think that I suggested the tool to stay on a few seconds after deactivation so you could not just click it and forget it, much like you can when stabilizing the ship using moonshine. There would be a drawback which would limit your ability to move the ship immediately after trying to stabilize it.
My initial idea suggested that this tool would "combat" any increase in momentum. This would effectively mean that it would be theoretically possible to move the ship, but the movements would be very slow and potentially also damage your ship. You also bring up a good point about whether this tool would work when the engines are destroyed - I think it wouldn't be overpowered to have it work like that. It would also give more reasons on why to pick it over some other tools without (in my eyes) making it too powerful.
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OK, so here are my final thoughts on the idea. All numbers are guestimates subject to testing.
Mechanics:
Ship engages on board gyroscopes to stop turning motions.
Ship also fires a harpoon-like anchor straight down, stopping horizontal and vertical motion.
Dampers activate on all guns.
Benefits:
Ship stops all motion almost instantly, even if engines are broken. Only tool that can stop sideways drift.
Guns get reduced recoil**. 50% reduction.
Possible buff to projectile velocity. 10% or so?
Ship will not move when hitting or being hit by a harpoon. Sort of an 'anti-harpoon'/buff tool.
Ship will not move when impacted, either by mines or other ships.
Downsides:
Tool lasts for a time after deactivated as anchor is raised and gyro is spun down.
Reduces turning engine power by 90%. Using engines will damage armor with impact damage due to gyroscopic torsion.
Ship can no longer rise, due to the anchor. Can descend?
Anchor leaves a visible rope connecting your ship to the ground. Enemy ships can easily see when you have this tool activated.
Guns get reduced recoil, but also suffer from the dampening by having severely reduced rotation speed. Similar to lochnagar. At least 50% reduction. Also slows rate of fire by 10%.
10% increased projectile velocity increases arming range, making it more risky at close range.
**Guns get 10% increased recoil (from base) if you touch any helm controls (steering and balloon, not tools). If you have ever tried to move a spinning gyroscope, you will understand why.
All impact damage to your ship is increased by 10%.
Activating the tool while touching any solid object would basically be suicide.
Summery:
I feel that with testing and balancing, these mechanics would make a well-rounded, useful-yet-risky tool that would have multiple uses at all but short range. Clever pilots will likely find uses even at short range. The risks are that if the enemy knows you are using it, they can quickly adjust tactics. In exchange for premium accuracy, you give up all mobility and slightly lower DPS. This leaves your ship completely open to surprise flanks and high speed frontal charges.
Heavy clip would be very useful still when using this, as you would get pinpoint accuracy at a 10% further range. Or it could be used with lesmok for a greatly increased range and large increase in accuracy.
As far as Spires being overpowered with this, the lack of turning on the ship as well as guns makes the ship extremely vulnerable to strafing attacks.
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Are you guys forgetting that moonshine pretty much allready does all of what you guys are stating?
I mean the stats where the guns get a buff because of a tool is... maybe too much but would be cool to see a tool that actualy helps out guns.
For the harpoon... the only thing moonshine does not prevent is sidewise drifting but it does help not loosing control.
I would still like this tool however. Its just that right now it needs to simply be a Stabiliser that does not hurt the engines. That way, moonshine is something with heavy drawbacks.
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Are you guys forgetting that moonshine pretty much allready does all of what you guys are stating?
I mean the stats where the guns get a buff because of a tool is... maybe too much but would be cool to see a tool that actualy helps out guns.
For the harpoon... the only thing moonshine does not prevent is sidewise drifting but it does help not loosing control.
I would still like this tool however. Its just that right now it needs to simply be a Stabiliser that does not hurt the engines. That way, moonshine is something with heavy drawbacks.
I do believe that it has been mentioned several times that the ship stabilization effect can be gotten through the use of kerosene/moonshine, chute vent, and hydrogen. However, with some of the suggestions in this thread, this tool could prove to be a viable option, especially to long range ships.
Because all the tools have some kind of drawbacks, I think it would only be logical to have some drawbacks for the ship stabilizer too. Also, as the stabilization effect could be reached with other tools, it wouldn't necessarily be a bad idea to give the tool some other benefits as well in addition to just dramatically reducing momentum. What we are trying to do in this thread is get an idea on how to balance the benefits with the drawbacks, so the tool will neither be under- or overpowered. :)
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I understand, it just feels like its going overboard D:
If you look at the other tools, they have simple stats that enhance exactly what they want. And takes away what they dont need.
Stuff like the impact bumpers and the Drogue chute seem underpowered but does very good against those specific conditions.
A spire with Impact Bumpers survives 50% of pyra rams. Not to mention Drogue and Bumpers togheter proove for a hard to kill baloon popped ship.
So having a simple something of a tool that enhances the ship in a prefered way (In this case for snipers to be able to fire instantly after movement or near instant and stable as possible) that is making the ship stand at a stand still is very nice. Simple and quick.
Here is my "Gameplay design" for the stats and how it works for ships.
When the tool is active is slowly stabilizes the ship from full speed. Max time is 3 seconds until full stop from full speed.
While the tool is active the ship is at a standstill. Unaffected by drifting, bopping or pushing. (Very little effect but enough to almost supress small to medium effects, while larger effects like a harpoon or a ram moves the ship little enough)
But as a downgrade. Add in impact damage Taken 25%+ just to make up for a ship not being able to get thrown off arcs.
Ships like the galleon can afford this in close range, and maybe junkers. But for other ships, this drawback is going to kill them if used uncorrectly.
While the tool is active, the engines going forward, or turning wont affect the ship at all (Or very little as i mentioned).
However, here is the second drawback.
The tool can be activated and deactivated by the pilot at will but he has to keep it ACTIVE at all times if you want to keep that stabilization.
This makes sniper ships 3 man gunned if the pilot is hugging the wheel with the tool active.
With it you then can also use it more for close range purposes and in reaction to not get hit when you turn it off.
With it, the pilot can get impact bumpers along with this tool to not get thrown out of arc and be rammed as if he got rammed without impact bumpers.
Like i said, affordable on galleons, and maybe junkers. Combine it with drogue chute also, and you have an enhanced drogue chute but the pilot is forced to hug the wheel.
(I mean, would be nice if the ship would fall a bit slower from using the tool but not as powerfull as drogue chute. So a combination would be great)
Another drawback to all of this is the slot for it.
So... We have a ship stabilizing tool that can be used to save one self and quickly correct the ship from turning for the guns sake.
We also gave it a good combo with either drogue chute or Impact bumpers.
Have keroseen and Stabiliser, you then have a selective moonshine. Where you sacrifice a slot, but can choose both not as damaging speed, with an easy to control without damage stabilization.
But it must be actively used. In most cases, im seeing this being used very bursty just to stablize the ship for the first few seconds and then proceed.
For proactive uses, its versus baloon popping and ramming with a combination (If you choose) with impact bumpers or Drogue chute.
etc etc.
TL;DR
Stabiliser:
Stabilizes the ship, making it almost unnaffected by wind and ram or other impairments that forcfully move your ship.
Slows the ship down almost into a full stop in all directions. When the baloon is down, descent is also slower.
Active on selection. 25%+ to impact damage.
Very good versus harpoons, and good for quick stabilisation of snipers and a mini moonshine if combined with kyrosine, hyper drogue chute if combined with drogue chute, drawback neglected if combined with Impact bumpers. But as a choice, takes up a slot, and needs to be actively selected if you want to keep the effect running.