Guns Of Icarus Online
Community => The Cantina => Topic started by: Lord Dick Tim on May 24, 2013, 06:44:01 am
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So this is the opening to attempt at creating a d10 based gaming system for individual character use in the GOI lore space.
The proposed system utilizes a three step combination for determining dice rolls in most situations that are considered a challenge for a character to overcome, or as an opposed dice roll between a character and an npc.
The three steps are Ability, Skill, Tool.
Each step would be accompanied by a dice pool which are generated by a score in the corresponding step.
For example. Strength(ability)+athletics(skill)+climbing gear(tool) might look like 3+3+3, equaling out to 9 d10 dice which would form a players dice pool. This dice pool is rolled, with the numbers 8,9,0 resulting in a pass, 1 resulting in a negative pass and all other numbers being failure. 0 would also count as a success, and be re-rolled for the chance of an additional success.
If three dice are cast and come up a 2, 4, 8, the roll is a success. A 1,8,5 however is a failure as the 1 negates the success of the 8. A 0,1,2 is also a failure, but with the chance that the 0 can be re-rolled into a success. ( some people may recognize this system from world of darkness, with a few small changes to make dice staking more difficult)
We can go into more depth later, or tear this system down and try a different one such as a d6 or d12. My desire however is to use a success/failure system rather than a dice challenge system like the d20.
My next post will have a proposal of the primary attributes, the charesterics of a character, and the proposed skills that would refine their use. It will need to be expanded on and refined some, but also keep in mind it suppose to represent a generalization of skill assets, we can come up with some kind of profession system or feats that represent talents that take considerable time and effort to learn or be proficient in.
Update 24 June 2013
Links to the google docs with some of the Work In Progress systems
Ammo, Armor, Weapons and Tools
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1c-vf60az0xr8F3IvrWZeQH05KUUMS0Ux2Ogy1Rs4NwA/edit?usp=sharing
Character Sheet
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1_zrU7oS9KvDI2S6WlgwtxZCsEEmZd70K-xzjtDMn-No/edit?usp=sharing
Rules and Systems (Perks are not implemented as of yet)
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1rTQ31O6UnFlgVfIa8L6R1ESVDrHOH4xnySGmCkBPMVc/edit?usp=sharing
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Guns of Icarus: A diesel punk tale
Attributes:
Physical;
Strength- a representation of your characters physicality, how much weight they can lift, how powerful they are in their limbs and body.
Dexterity- the nimbleness and flexibility of the body and hands.
Constitution- soundness and health of the body, a measure of robust health and good stamina.
Mental;
Intelligence- A raw measure of a persons problem solving ability and analytical
thinking capacity. Hard facts and empirical process.
Wisdom- the depth of a persons knowledge, the breadth of their experiences that inform decisions.
Awareness- Spatial identity, to know your location and the placement of things around you, to identify objects you cannot readily sense.
Social;
Physical appeal- your raw sex appeal, facial construction and bodily proportions.
Poise- physical presence and presentation. Good grooming, calmness and outwards projection.
Eloquence- communicative skills and tact, the ability to express emotion and intent effectively.
Skills:
Physical;
Athletics- acts that require a test of your body, swimming, running, jumping and climbing.
Acrobatics- physical acts that require extreme balance and coordination.
Weapon fighting- your ability with a melee weapon.
Thrown weapon- your accuracy and lethality with thrown weapons
Firearms- accuracy with firearms
Driving- your reflexes at the wheel in extreme circumstances.
Survival- your physical ability to survive harsh terrain and conditions and torture.
Stealth- how quiet you can move without being noticed.
Mental;
Mechanical Engineering- knowledge of how complex machines function, how to fabricate and repair them.
Flight operation- basic knowledge of how to steer an airship.
Research- How good you are at discovering information through study.
Ancient technology- how familiar you are with old technology since before the age of dust.
Chemistry- knowledge of the physical properties of natural elements, and how to make them perform useful tasks like lighting, dissolving, or exploding.
Bushmen- your knowledge of surviving in the rough.
Emergency care- how skilled you are at first responder care to injury.
Social;
Carousing- drinking and partying in a loud joyful way, your ability to be the light of a party.
Empathic- how able you are to identify the emotions of others, so you can exploit them.
Animal ken- the natural disposition of animals towards you that are domesticated.
Subterfuge- how good you are at concealing the truth, or out right lying.
Socializing- how well you blend into a group or conversation, how easily you make people open up or like you.
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I'm also going to be the first critic, I'm not entirely comfortable with firearms placement in the physical space, I believe that proper firearms use is, yes, a physical act, but requires more mental discipline and might want to move it down to a mental skill to bring its base attribute closer to awareness.
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I like the Idea :D but how are you gonna do the whole thing over the Forum ? With dice rolling and everything.
And hows the Character creation gonna work ? Like , do you have a limited amount of "character points " or something ?
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You should totally set this up on roll20. I would be AALLL over this
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sounds entertaining I might be up for this if it ever got rolling. get it, rolling.
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I like the Idea :D but how are you gonna do the whole thing over the Forum ? With dice rolling and everything.
And hows the Character creation gonna work ? Like , do you have a limited amount of "character points " or something ?
Character points and allocations will come later down the road, and will impact the core skill spread and attributes depending on how the balance of powers plays out to make the game entertaining without overpowering one specific set of skills over another.
Mental skills will likely make up the bulk of the skills section, as this is more about professional development and learned ability rather than natural talent.
I'm also proposing a system of "specializations" that can be added to a skill as a situational bonus.
IE- Skill Firearms-3, Specialization Rifles-1, this would have the effect of increasing a skills dice pool total in a specific area rather than making a person good at all Firearms based rolls.
The concept would have to allow that a Specialization, when customising the point spread of the game, would be cheaper to upgrade than a base skill.
I'm getting ahead of myself a bit here, I was hoping people would have more problems with the initial proposal but guess I'll push on.
Professions
Profession systems will be a template a player can add to their character sheet after the point spread has been laid out. The profession would be an optional addition that would allow the player to find a role for themselves in a character sheet format that allows a great amount of freedom.
Professions would come with added developement space that increases rolls in close association to that profession. For example...
Profession Doctor: +3 to Emergency Care, +1 Dexterity, +1 Intelligence, +1 Poise (these aren't hard numbers, just an example)
Profession Scrapper: +1 Firearms, +1 Survival, +1 Bushman, +1 Strength, +1 Constitution, +1 Awareness
Traits
These would be a characters unique perks, something that can be taken at character creation or rarely upgraded during play. It further diversifies the characters with abilities and powers that others would not likely have.
An example of what a trait could look like.
Gearhead: You have a knack for understanding machines, any machine, and when trying to puzzle out what is wrong with one or how it works you can take 1 automatic success rather than rolling.
Horse Whisperer: Over the years you've developed the special kind of bond with most animal life, wild or domestic. You can make an animal ken roll with wild animals to calm them or hostile domestic animals like guard dogs, or take an automatic success when dealing with friendly domestic animals.
Silver Tongue: When discovered lying you can make another roll to smooth talk your way out of trouble or danger, you also can make a second roll on failed social rolls or encounters that require diplomacy.
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I like the Idea :D but how are you gonna do the whole thing over the Forum ? With dice rolling and everything.
And hows the Character creation gonna work ? Like , do you have a limited amount of "character points " or something ?
Character points and allocations will come later down the road, and will impact the core skill spread and attributes depending on how the balance of powers plays out to make the game entertaining without overpowering one specific set of skills over another.
Mental skills will likely make up the bulk of the skills section, as this is more about professional development and learned ability rather than natural talent.
I'm also proposing a system of "specializations" that can be added to a skill as a situational bonus.
IE- Skill Firearms-3, Specialization Rifles-1, this would have the effect of increasing a skills dice pool total in a specific area rather than making a person good at all Firearms based rolls.
The concept would have to allow that a Specialization, when customising the point spread of the game, would be cheaper to upgrade than a base skill.
I'm getting ahead of myself a bit here, I was hoping people would have more problems with the initial proposal but guess I'll push on.
Professions
Profession systems will be a template a player can add to their character sheet after the point spread has been laid out. The profession would be an optional addition that would allow the player to find a role for themselves in a character sheet format that allows a great amount of freedom.
Professions would come with added developement space that increases rolls in close association to that profession. For example...
Profession Doctor: +3 to Emergency Care, +1 Dexterity, +1 Intelligence, +1 Poise (these aren't hard numbers, just an example)
Profession Scrapper: +1 Firearms, +1 Survival, +1 Bushman, +1 Strength, +1 Constitution, +1 Awareness
Traits
These would be a characters unique perks, something that can be taken at character creation or rarely upgraded during play. It further diversifies the characters with abilities and powers that others would not likely have.
An example of what a trait could look like.
Gearhead: You have a knack for understanding machines, any machine, and when trying to puzzle out what is wrong with one or how it works you can take 1 automatic success rather than rolling.
Horse Whisperer: Over the years you've developed the special kind of bond with most animal life, wild or domestic. You can make an animal ken roll with wild animals to calm them or hostile domestic animals like guard dogs, or take an automatic success when dealing with friendly domestic animals.
Silver Tongue: When discovered lying you can make another roll to smooth talk your way out of trouble or danger, you also can make a second roll on failed social rolls or encounters that require diplomacy.
You should really do this on http://roll20.net/
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Say I wanted to roll a gunner, would artillery be a firearms specialization, or should it have its own skill, like the Driving for pilot and Mechanical Engineering for the engineer?
And I agree on the opinion that firing a weapon is a mental discipline, but the way I see the skill it refers mostly to the situation where you really have to fling those rounds as fast as possible, which leads to having more emphasis on your agility than your brain. Quick shooting should and would be trained to come from the spine. It is an entirely another matter when you actually have to have the round hit something further away, which is not often a situation common PC encounters.
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It looks like artillery would be a specialty inside of firearms
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It looks like artillery would be a specialty inside of firearms
Shot both, isn't exactly one-to-one. :D
I think Intelligence would be an important factor for a gunner-type of character, since he has to consider the trajectories, sights and shells independently and fast, if we are applying GoIO logics to air combat. Hence, artillery should probably be a mental skill. I am, of course, just an opinionated man.
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Airship Heavy Weapons:
This might be a good description of an airships heavy weapon as a Skill. As this takes specialized training to operate and hit accurately with it might fit in better with a professional skill, something that has to be bought separately like a specialization.
Additionally we can have perks that alter the Base step of a dice pool. For example...
Perk- Hip Shot: Use dex instead of Awareness as the base shot for a 1 handed firearm.
The idea of most actions that can be taken is a player needs to justify the 3 steps of their dice pool.
If a player can find a reason to use Dexterity instead of Awareness for shooting a weapon it might be in a quick draw situation, relying more on their reflexes to get the shot off and their general familiarization of firearms than their perception of area.
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http://roll20.net/
do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it
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http://roll20.net/
do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it do it
That site looks awesome I may have to do something with it.
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Omgurd badger stop badgering me. Use honey, I like honey.
Cranberry honey specifically. Besides a lot more work still needs to be put into this to get it up and running with some semblance of balance.
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Omgurd badger stop badgering me. Use honey, I like honey.
Cranberry honey specifically. Besides a lot more work still needs to be put into this to get it up and running with some semblance of balance.
Of course. But I have to admit that d20 site looks pretty cool.
When you figured out the what and how, maybe you could take a peek at this site :D.
But it is your idea, and you decide how to do it
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I've actually used map tools to great success in the past, some amazing dnd games with all the options available in that system.
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Okay, sounds good, too :D
so im not very experienced with thatind of game,
how my can plax at once, and i guess its not forum based, right?
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It could be forum based if the person running the campiegn did all the dice rolls that require a check.
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Omgurd badger stop badgering me. Use honey, I like honey.
Cranberry honey specifically. Besides a lot more work still needs to be put into this to get it up and running with some semblance of balance.
I'm going to honey the fuck out of you man.
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It could be forum based if the person running the campiegn did all the dice rolls that require a check.
Or we could just invite people to the roll20 and find a time that suits us.
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Yeah I think that can be decided later. ( I like the d20 too!) *cough* But there are a lot things that need to be clear , in order to start or even play a game
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I think I could fit a game in my schedule, too. :)
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I'd be willing to lend a hand in the help of creating a system, and of course I'd play in it. I have a lot of experience making tabletop game systems, I've made several and officially gamed for TSR in the past.
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Awesome Jessica I could use the help. I'm making a google doc so information can be shared and edited between multiple people.
I'm also a DM for wizards right now at a local shop, it's getting a little out of control as my 6 people game ballooned into 20 on 4 tables with additional night added with another 15 or so. I've got plenty of storytelling experience, and I know I'm good at it, but the rule systems take more than one set of eyes to figure out the exploits.
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This is starting to sound good
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Firearms is Definately making its way down to mental skills, while primitive projectiles like bows is being added.
Right now i need people to think up different traits that off the character unique powers, I could come up with a ton but I don't want it to be all my ideas.
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Right now i need people to think up different traits that off the character unique powers, I could come up with a ton but I don't want it to be all my ideas.
You could have perks, such as: Gunslinger, Archer, Captain, Grease Monkey, Silver Tongue (CHA), Conditioned (DEX), Pack Mule (STR), Rifleman, etc.
And racial traits that come from the different factions: Yeshan (Increased Barter/Trade), Baron (Increased STR/DEX), Arashi (Engineering/Thieving), Guild (CHA), And I don't really know the other factions, and again I'm spit balling.
And alignment like Lawful Good or whatever.
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traits hmmm... you mean something like
Swashbuckler: After having landed a melee attack you can take a Carousing check to convince your opponent to surrender (or perhaps some form of debuff)
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Definately just like that johny. I do like that trait lol, would be amusing if situational.
I like the idea of racial/faction bonus but want to save that till the end as is could mesh poorly with a profession template and create a mega min max character with ease.
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alright sweet then. I would love to help with that. I've always been a fan of traits that provide not necessarily better but different tactics.
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Interesting, been a while since I played PnP.. am I right in thinking you're proposing something fairly similar to the Cyberpunk/CP2020 ruleset? If my memory is correct, you're so close to it in intent you might as well just adopt the existing rules. I'll need to rummage in the lost to find the books, but it was always a very adaptable set of rules.
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Right now i need people to think up different traits that off the character unique powers, I could come up with a ton but I don't want it to be all my ideas.
Maybe...some basic things like Skinny , or small , that give melee malus but dex or speed bonus , or the otherway around , muscular gives Str but less agility something like that.
Or maybe : Polite/Gentlemen
Socializing +2 Subterfuge -1
Scientist/Nerd
Mechanical Engineering , Research, Intelligence, Wisdom and Ancient technology +2
but frightend when in comes to battle and weak ,
so like constitution strength , weapn fighting and athletics -2
and Physical appeal ,Poise and Eloquence -1
I dont know , maybe not that many bonuses and minus points , but something in that direction
Or Specialized
Like +5 one one skill , but -1 at the rest , i dont know ^^
Funny would be Drug addicted *cough honeybadger cough* what was that clear liquid in the saloon anyways ?
Ah Bonus on Physical and Social skills when under influence of the drug the player is addicted to ,
but if the drug isnt available , he gets minus points eeverywhere , and they get worse , the longer he has to suffer.
What drug and how to aquire it , can be decided later i guess :P
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I got a couple more
Steam Musician: Through years of experience you have learn how to make the pipes sing. Your sweet music raises crew moral so any time you preform a successful mechanical check anyone on ship with you gets plus 1 on the next skill check they make.
Right 'O A true gentlemen is a god among men, and as such they should spread the knowledge of how to be a proper gent to the less fortunate. Once per day you can tell a party member to keep a stiff upper lip, and show them how to do a cracker-jack job by adding your poise modifier to there roll.
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Link to the current google Doc, just so we have a clean page to look out without having to plumb through the thread.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1rTQ31O6UnFlgVfIa8L6R1ESVDrHOH4xnySGmCkBPMVc/edit?usp=sharing
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I was thinking about racial/national selections and the thought of "Free Peoples" came up, social groups that don't identify with any faction like Anvala or Wastelanders.
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Instead of "Free Peoples", why not name those folks "Unaligned"?
Perk ideas, free to dissection for the benefit of the system.
Grounded: For the majority of your life you have been living among the common people on the ground, learning to survive in the harsher conditions of groundside. You add +1 to any Survival or Bushman rolls you make.
Airborn: Due to curious circumstances, you were born while travelling in the air. This is often the explanation to your natural nimbleness while flying. +1 to any Flight Operation or Acrobatics rolls.
Medic: You are a trained physician or medicine man. +1 to Emergency Care and Chemistry rolls.
Lumberjack: Your physique is a sight to behold, but being large has its downs. +1 to Constitution, -1 to Intelligence
Flak Cannon: Your sharp tongue gets you into trouble as much as it gets you out of it. Carousing and Socializing +2, but a fail is met with harsher consequences.
Sweetly Suave:The opposite sex has a harsh time resisting your compliments and you instinctively understand them better than your run-of-the-mill comrade. +2 to Socializing and Empathy against opposite sex. Failure in these rolls against the same sex, however, may end worse than usual.
Synonym for Merry: You are more interested in the same gender as you are, but thus you pay attention to them more. +2 to Socializing and Empathy against same sex. Failure in these rolls against the opposite sex, however, may end worse than usual.
Lucky:Your stars were aligned well on the night of your birth. Once a day, you may reroll one dice-throw. The ending result has to be accepted, even if worse than the previous one.
Natural Command: Ever since being a child you have been the leader of the group, and this adeptness has continued to adulthood. Once a day you may add your Eloquence to any throw your crewmember is throwing.
If you like, I can invent more of these. :)
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I like fee peoples It seems to fit theme well. also more traits YAY!
Ruffian: I say aren't you the tough customer. You can add on all your negative social modifiers on as damage when using appropriate gear (Poor quality)
It's mostly Ornamental.: Tell me who is your designer. You could never pass up on a weapon with a well know makers mark. You can use a personal weapon's damage die as a bonus for any social skill checks when using appropriate gear. (Ornate)
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These are all so perfect, I'll start adding to the doc soon.
Also looking at profession templates, the idea goes two ways. Either as a template that is put on a character with different skills or bonus attributes or as an example of particular skills and point arrangements that best fits the character within a specific role.
I prefer the later, it acts like a quick reference for building a character without limiting a weird or crazy build that may not be optimal.
The former however structures the game more for tacticle style play with clearly defined roles which makes it easier for wider consumption, not something we really need to concern ourselves with.
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The Obliviant Day Dreamer
While keeping your head in the clouds has it's obvious consequences, you tend to be more open minded and creative compared to your fellow compatriots, however you tend to be awkward in social sessions.
+3 Scientific/Improvisation
-3 Social/Command
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Keep them coming gents.
The min/max trade off and values has me thinking up ideas about the general size of the dice pools and extent of a characters possible skill.
Since points equal a persons relative skill, and that skill number is a direct correlation to dice amount I've been giving it some thought that a skill number can go as high as say a 4 normally, a 5 with achievements and perks that boost it up.
Soft cap 4, hard cap 5.
So a skilled gunner may have a 3 in awareness, 3 in firearms, 1 in a specialization for rifles and a Rifle with a dice score of 4=11 dice. With a roughly 30% chance to score a success they may come up with a dice roll of 3 success. Those success dice could then be further balanced by an enemies armor, which could reduce the amount of damage done.
Another example
Social engineering for somebody who is so so in social events
Impressing a person- poise 2, socializing 2, specialty high class parties 1, trait bonus "it's mostly for show" add 3 for pistol=8
With lower scores but good traits a character still has a reasonable chance at gettin a success in social situations that didn't put to many points into being social.
With the hard cap at 5 this could make it so characters couldn't do, say this...
Awareness 5, firearms 5, specialty rifle 5, rifle 4, trait Military trained +2 awareness +2 firearms, -2 int, -2 socializing. = 23
With a hard cap the player would only get a score of 19, the military training perk couldn't add to stats already capped at 5, this also makes it so players couldn't stack traits with similar bonuses. A 19 is still pretty much, point your gun at it and it dies, but it does make it so special dice challenge rules can come into effect and actually be affective.
For example, lets say that previous dice score was a called shot, aiming for the head. This comes at a -5 for difficulty, score is now 15, still likely going to be a kill shot if a success goes into the dome. But the enemy is wearing a helmet, so make the damage non-lethal. So the player Aims, +1, new roll is 16, but they want to make sure it's a kill shot, so they specify they are aiming for the face, uncovered area, another -5, dice score is now an 11 and still stands a good chance of braining the enemy, which is what we would expect from a maxed out score Gunner.
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I think combat should be kept simple, as this is currently a system that mostly gets played via interwebs and thus the DM's dice load is huge already.
Also, i think the nationality of a character should affect the reputation and reactions instead of stats, as the statting would mean penalties to people who would like to play, say, a Mercantile Mercenary.
More perks for your enjoyment. Remember, the perks should be balanced, I just throw these in.
All I Need Is Some Tin Cans: While some may need spare parts, you are an absolute genius in jury-rigging the mechanical. +1 Mechanical Engineering, +1 Ancient Technology
It Is Big, Thus Easy To Hit: You have a natural talent for determining range and conditions for deadly shots in the air. +2 to called shot dice pool against enemy airships.
I Guess It Works For Engines, Too: You are adept at boosting engine-effectiveness with less-than-orthodox methods. Bonuses to travel- and combat-speed, but at the risk of over-exerting the engines.
Lil' Freud: You are a trained psychologist, a skill you most certainly use to your own benefit. +1 Eloquence and Empathy.
Renown: You've done something remarkable in the past, or are from a remarkable parent. Wherever you go, you are possibly recognized, but be it in good or bad is in the hands of gods.
Ran With The Circus: Once during your life you spent your days as a member of a traveling circus. This has left you with some neat tricks. +1 Throwing, +1 Acrobatics.
Rode With The Jaegers: Due to your companion you kept in your earlier days, you have an exceptional fighting skill at your disposal. Weapon Fighting +1, Firearms +1.
Getaway: You've had the dubious pleasure of being a getaway-driver for some small-time criminal. +1 driving, +1 Flight Operation.
Underground Contacts: You are knowledgeable in the workings of the criminal world. If in a town and in need of information, roll your Eloquence minus difficulty to gain accurate information not available otherwise.
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Verulian Admiral
Known for being a complete and total eccentric you have a tendency to use less then practical measures. You also happen to be pretty bad at parties, so avoid them best you can.
+5 Swords/Command
+3 Improvisation
+2 Revolver Handguns
-6 social
-2 Chosen Skill
Courier Pilot
You are able to navigate quite well on instinct alone, and while you are not built for combat you fire a gun decently enough to save your life.
+3 Navigation
+2 Firearms
-2 Durability
Desert Gatekeeper
More time then naught you spend defending the gate against people who think they are late for dessert.
-2 firearms
+3 Melee
+2 Durability
Shock Therapist
There really isn't that much to say about you other then profession
+2 Intimidation
-3 Social
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the skill cap really seem like a good idea, and it really allows for traits that provide alternate tactics as opposed to pure skill pumps.
Local Drunk: I am the god of beer care to make a sacrifice to me. Being know as a drunk has few perks, but one of which is that by downing a bottle of alcohol you can negate any consequences from a failed social check. After all it's not your fault you were drunk.
Desperado: A mean chap like you would just take any offense. So when you catch someone in a lie you are give the choose to engage in a quick draw. Both side roll the same die then add their dexterity modifier. Highest number wins lowest number dies. If you win the kill will have no legal consequence, but if you lose you die.
(I like this one because its really hi-risk and almost completely unnecessary to do.
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This looks cool. Can't wait for 1.0 to be complete
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The high noon killing concept is a good one johny, also I love the other traits I keep seeing.
I didn't get near a computer day to do the proper editing, but I'll be on it tomorrow.
We've got enough traits to shuffle around considerable, but what about base skills? The current base I have works for most situations in a game space, but I think it could use a little more fleshing out.
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We've got enough traits to shuffle around considerable, but what about base skills? The current base I have works for most situations in a game space, but I think it could use a little more fleshing out.
I think the skillbase needs a test-run to determine whether new additions should be made, and several test-plays to decide whether some skills are needless.
Also, I'd like to see to which attributes the skills are tied to, now we just know that Carousing is Social and Firearms a Mental skill.
Kung-fu Skwhale-style: You are a trained martial artist, a sight to behold during a brawl. This determination has led to a gruff exterior, however. You can use your bare fists as well as a normal man uses melee weapons, but you get -1 to Carousing and -1 to Eloquence.
Jump-Kick: Being honed your skills as a martial artist, you've become to eralizee the benefits of your surroundings in combat. Still, you are more and more concentrated on developing yourself that others tend to be forgotten. +1 to Athletics and to-hit rolls while unarmed, -1 to Socializing and Carousing.
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Right now i need people to think up different traits that off the character unique powers, I could come up with a ton but I don't want it to be all my ideas.
Funny would be Drug addicted *cough honeybadger cough* what was that clear liquid in the saloon anyways ?
Hey man, I gotta be on the sauce or else shit goes down.
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Kung-fu Skwhale-style: You are a trained martial artist, a sight to behold during a brawl. This determination has led to a gruff exterior, however. You can use your bare fists as well as a normal man uses melee weapons, but you get -1 to Carousing and -1 to Eloquence.
Jump-Kick: Being honed your skills as a martial artist, you've become to eralizee the benefits of your surroundings in combat. Still, you are more and more concentrated on developing yourself that others tend to be forgotten. +1 to Athletics and to-hit rolls while unarmed, -1 to Socializing and Carousing.
Haha that a nice idea :D Skywhale-style... hehe...wonder what it would look like.
Hey another aspect would be , how many can "participate" ? Like , were quite a few now , I counted 7. Is there a player limit ?
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Like most RPG games I think the ideal table count is about 4-6 players.
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Skywhale Style brings up a good point, having multiple points in the same trait increasing the depth of your knowledge in that trait.
It might overpower a character to separate these from the rest of the traits.
The real customization aspect in this game might solely be in the perk/trait system, we will have to balance it accordingly, along with making a way for people to craft their own.
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It is always a GM's decision whether to approve or disapprove. Perhaps these perks could be more example-like in nature rather than "only" options for players. This would also let the system be shifted towards deeper or lighter roleplay.
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The real customization aspect in this game might solely be in the perk/trait system, we will have to balance it accordingly, along with making a way for people to craft their own.
It is always a GM's decision whether to approve or disapprove. Perhaps these perks could be more example-like in nature rather than "only" options for players. This would also let the system be shifted towards deeper or lighter roleplay.
If I understand this correctly what your saying is that players would more or less make up the traits they want to use and it would be at the dm's discretion to approve or deny them.
Also I imagine that if you wanted to have the traits be the main focus of the customization then you should probably do it one of two ways to keep things balanced either have every trait come with positive and negative effects. or also have pure negative traits and require a player to balance them out. Just my thoughts.
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I agree with you John, it might even be a good idea to having something similar to the system DnD uses in the point buy for raising stats at beginning level, but that would be part of the larger character creation system anyways.
It really comes down to play testing and abusing the crap out of the system. Give me one more week and we can get a play by post together with character sheets with a DM rolling stats, we can run it for a week, check fire and try some other scenarios out then go back to chopping up the rules.
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I thinks traits would have to be two-leveled. First come the perks which are entirely beneficial, but give you less boosts. Other level are the perks which give you a heftier boost, but with a penalty to something else. The way the perks go now, there are perks which are absolutely minmax-quality, some which give you a major bonus to something or some which seem a tad useless due to the penalties.
I am NOT saying I didn't do most of those kind of errors, but please, if you start planning a test-play, go through the current perks and decide which style of perkdom you want to enforce.
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Any updates?
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Been wondering that myself.
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Yup, doing a play test late night Wednesday with PapaParadox using Roll20. It's going to be very bare bones, grab me on steam Lord Dick Tim if you also want in for the play test.
Like I said, going to be very, very bare bones. Looking are core stat, how abilities are used and interactions along with combat, health, damage and movement on the board.
I've also managed to figure out some of the ship combat, it doesn't look strong yet, but the core concept is there.
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Yup, doing a play test late night Wednesday with PapaParadox using Roll20. It's going to be very bare bones, grab me on steam Lord Dick Tim if you also want in for the play test.
Like I said, going to be very, very bare bones. Looking are core stat, how abilities are used and interactions along with combat, health, damage and movement on the board.
I've also managed to figure out some of the ship combat, it doesn't look strong yet, but the core concept is there.
What GMT would your late-night be?
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Eastern, shooting for 10PM (I hope). Here is a link to the character sheet so far https://docs.google.com/document/d/1_zrU7oS9KvDI2S6WlgwtxZCsEEmZd70K-xzjtDMn-No/edit?usp=sharing
It also has a few explanations about how some of the point allocations work. Nothing is set in stone, this is still all very primitive at the moment. Again this isn't including the proposed trait system.
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So, it is -8 GMT, which would mean something like 6AM here. Hmmmmmh, I think I might manage to do it, if my calculations are right.
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hmmm actually i think it's GMT -4 for EDT.... could be wrong though
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Pffflrt, I can no math.
I am GMT +2 timezone, which means -4 would be six hours behind my time. Why can't Earth be flat?
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Because gravity :P
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Why can't Earth be flat?
Damn you science! >:(
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Damn you Shink! >:(
Fixed. :F
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Lol
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Ok here is the Campaign post in Roll20 https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/147457/guns-of-icarus
My steam info is Lord Dick Tim (surprise!)
Contact me if you want in, it'll be wednesday night 10ish (hopefully 10) EDT. The game does not work fully yet, it's about testing play systems and just trying to break it right now.
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Heh heh heh, 5 AM for me. Glorious. :D
If you want, I'll come, it'd be too fun to miss. :D
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First play test was last night.
It was... Amusing. People discovered the drawing tool and took creative liberties with it.
Some of the systems have been adjusted, and now there is a list of possible actions and what bonus or negatives apply to that action.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1rTQ31O6UnFlgVfIa8L6R1ESVDrHOH4xnySGmCkBPMVc/edit?usp=sharing
None of the changes have been highlighted, just some typo stuff along with Actions and Death and Dying.
I've been building up a list of weapons with various stats as we play as well. Weapons that we used in the previous game were a Breach Loaded Double barrel shotgun with different kinds of ammos for different effects.
Six shooter pistol
"Dwarven" war hammer. (We were playing around with melee weapons and stats.)
We also used armor, worked on healing, and adjusted the player health regeneration system using player skills to make sure players don't die instantly.
I will say the game is shaping up to be particularly hard, with monsters being on about the same level as players in some respects. So picking a fight with 9 people will likely go just as well in real life as it will in game. Using cover and concealment is key, and ambushing your opponent so they don't have time to shoot back before people start dying.
We will try to have a few more play tests soon.
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I hope that I'll be able to join you guys in the next play test I was to busy to join in on that one
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I hope so too!
We need to work more on social systems and NPC defense against social systems. Right now I've been using a stat value of 2 to determine everything an NPC does, along with most of the positive or negative bonus actions.
In the Attribute system a 2 is considered Average, a 1 below average and a 6 (max value) herculean.
The largest player obstacle might be in using multiple skills to interact with an NPC and swing their favor more in your direction. The Game Master sets the Difficulty of any encounter, so a stranger talking to a stranger with no preconceived notions rewards no positive or negative.
But an armed man talking to a lone woman on a dark street in the middle of the night would be considerably harder to interact with do to her automatic defensiveness. This would be represented in the player losing dice in their total "Dice Pool" that allows for successful actions.
An example of improving the situation would be to wait for the woman to walk into a lit café, now the challenge of talking to her is slightly lower. So you start with something not very direct. You use your characters attribute "Poise" along with the skill "Socialize" to make small talk, you discover she's a smoker, and offer her a smoke, which improves the relative difficulty of continuing to talk to her.
Suppose your goal here is to get some kind of information from her, the Game Master informs the player she seems attracted to you, so you use the Attribute "Physical Appearance" with the skill "Coercion" with the promise to buy her coffee as your tool. This combination choice results in again a slightly less difficult dice challenge. You succeed, she agrees to sit with you and talk for a bit over coffee.
Your primary goal is to discover information from her, perhaps its the time of day her boss goes for lunch. You already know a bit about her, so you use "Poise" and "Coercion" to get her talking about things she wouldn't normally talk about. OR you use "Poise" and "Subterfuge" to lie about details that may convince her to tell you the information you need.
This is in essence how social interactions could work in the GOI: Dieselpunk game space.
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Can another player pitch in in the socializing efforts? I mean, two characters can bring an enemy down, no problem, but can a friend be a wingman for someone trying to use coercion?
There could be a wingman-situation, good cop bad cop -kind of mix of intimidation and persuasion, carousing in a merry company, acting like you don't know the other person but "Oh boy does this man's idea sound reasonable. I'd take it if I were you!"
You know, give the other guy a chance to either actively participate in the social element or at least let him add to the main guy's dice pool due to joint effort.
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Players can definitely come together to try and swing a social situation. Double the pressure will turn over a social interaction more into your favor in some instances, but it could also work against you if one of the players fails in their attempts.
So it wouldn't be wise to have the weird socially awkward wacko in your group thats great with guns be your help during a negotiation. It might work in a more social atmosphere where you can play the hero card and "rescue" the target from the weirdo, but that might take subterfuge on your part so be prepared to be heavy in the social skill sets.
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Or that someone starts bruising up a guy, then be "rescued" by a handsome gentleman. a ruse to get the guy spill the beans on something as thanks. :D
Opportunities are endless.
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That's correct!
The more we play with the system of rules and abuse them at this point the more we can cut down or add different skills to allow for a balanced play experience.
I definitely want social skills to work with as many actions as a battle does, the use of multiple skills and tools will be imperative to an outstanding success.
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Hey Tim,
If you want someone to help test the social systems of your rpg, I love running social and intregue campaigns in all systems I can get my grubby hands on. I could help you out if you want it.
Cheers,
Qwerty
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That would be great Qwerty!
Send a PM to me when you have time to spare so I can have you pick some systems apart. I'm also modding my first post to include links to all the current google docs for viewing pleasure.
It's very primitive at this stage, so bear that in mind.
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Made updates to the google docs and cleaned up some of the information. Set to start using Perks for the next play test, also have made a "clean" character sheet I'll be giving to the play testers.
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This is starting to look good.
Consider me interested for future play tests.
I'll do what I can to make it.
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This is starting to look good.
Consider me interested for future play tests.
I'll do what I can to make it.
Likewise. The perks still probably need some filing, especially the ones that were minmax. :)
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Wednesday test game went very, very well. We added perks, some new weapons and worked out social systems, after that the game is pretty much censored for 18 and under lol.
But really, we worked hard on trying to break the core of the game, and so far it doesn't look like it can be broken with ease, it would take a gross overbalance of stat stacking that would make a character only useful in a very few, limited situations.
Some of the additions...
Skill
Social- Streetwise- Knowledge of the streets, the lower class, and how to move in that world along with small criminal acts.
This skill was added to fill the Larceny position we didnt have.
Actions
Insight- Free action Intelligence + Wisdom (Understand something you can observe or know)
This was added to give the Game Master the ability to weave symbolism into the game space, or provide a hint to the character that might not be communicated well enough to the players for them to understand it without plain speech.
More tools, stat altering consumable items, more guns, Ancient Tech weapons such as the Heavy Karkovian Pistol (a one shot monster of a gun that adds 8L to a shot. 1/2 action to shoot, 1/2 action to reload) and Ancient Submachine gun. (4L Single shot, +5L full auto expends all 15 rounds in gun 1/2 action)
The social interactions also took the form of a progressive story with branching situations and plot twists that might have involved a Baroness of the Fjordlands, a Drug Lord called "The Whale", and the Baronesses powerful Merchant Guild Banker husband Han Tzu.
Players had to use the full gamut of social skills in order to maximize their profits, survive the intrigue of powerful members of society and make a name for themselves in an increasingly dark world that cares little if they survive to become legends, or forgotten as corpses in the gutter.
Favorite scene of the night
Players are sitting down to dinner with Han Tzu at a poche, expensive restaurant, they are served small avian meals covered in a light, orange sauce and garnished. The make insight roles that I ask for, each of them, on the symbolism of the meal they are eating, not a single character passes the check. After receiving troubling news that Han Tzu's wife means to assassinate him, he asks to retire to the lavatory so that he may compose himself, feeling rather sick to the stomach from the sudden news.
This entire night, evidence leads to Han Tzu as being a shrewd businessmen but not a violent or aggressive person, even going to lengths to provide his wife with considerable estates and wealth for a divorce he is planning. (his wife is a Baronies Baroness, this is important).
Suddenly men arrive, in full military grade body armor and weaponry and shoot up the restaurant. Han Tzu had planned the entire thing it seems. The party survives the encounter, and kills Han Tzu. They might have been forewarned to his treachery had they noticed they had been served ravens for dinner.
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Players are sitting down to dinner with Han Tzu at a poche, expensive restaurant, they are served small avian meals covered in a light, orange sauce and garnished. The make insight roles that I ask for, each of them, on the symbolism of the meal they are eating, not a single character passes the check. After receiving troubling news that Han Tzu's wife means to assassinate him, he asks to retire to the lavatory so that he may compose himself, feeling rather sick to the stomach from the sudden news.
This entire night, evidence leads to Han Tzu as being a shrewd businessmen but not a violent or aggressive person, even going to lengths to provide his wife with considerable estates and wealth for a divorce he is planning. (his wife is a Baronies Baroness, this is important).
Suddenly men arrive, in full military grade body armor and weaponry and shoot up the restaurant. Han Tzu had planned the entire thing it seems. The party survives the encounter, and kills Han Tzu. They might have been forewarned to his treachery had they noticed they had been served ravens for dinner.
He called me low born, so I gatted him in a toilet stall, so it's fine.
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After blasting a womans stomach out her back
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I really need to get in on one of these
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Wednesdays at 10est, add Tim or me on steam (Steam tags are the same as our IGNs) and if you're around at that time, we'll bring ya in.
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So the next few days I welcome anyone who is interested to look over player actions with an eye for "specialized" actions.
What we are going into now is stepping up from the core systems and onto add on features that will further diversify the games atmosphere and let players make the kind of characters that they really want to, but maintain the balance of play as it currently is.
In last weeks game a change to Melee weapons was proposed, and promptly added so we could test the function in the game space. The idea was to add the attribute Dexterity instead of Strength for the use of some Melee weapons.
The concept isn't unknown in Pen and Paper games and is often referred to as "Finesse". That isn't exactly the same idea we had, typically in most Pen and Paper games Dexterity based characters are ranged, rogue or ranger type characters. In DPT(Diesel Punk Tale) Dexterity doesn't have the same utility, as most ranged weapons, firearms, have been moved to a mental attribute "Awareness" as their base attribute for creating a dice pool.
So, for now "slashing" type melee weapons will use Dexterity as their base attribute.
Additionally I've added another utility for Dex in the Actions "Snap Shot" 1/2 action -3 you may use Dex instead of Awareness for a Firearms roll
Also - "Spot Check" Free action Awareness+Poise, notice something that is hidden, or active stealth.
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Count me in if you're doing any future tests.
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Certainly interesting. I've never played an tabletop RPG (or whatever you call them) before, and I've never planned on doing so. But if it would be anything that would change my mind it would be this.
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Well Spoon, Noghog, add myself or PapaParadox to your steam friends, same names. Next test will be Wednesday at 10PM Eastern, we had 3 players and myself last time.
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Hehe as said, I'm certainly interested and I might join you in the future. I'd probably have to get myself to learn the basics of tabletops first.
Though 10PM Eastern is 4AM for me, and with going up 5:30AM for work it's a bit tough. But yeah, maybe in the future.
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Since that timing is very bad for you, I can definitely work out a different play time to allow for a test of the system. Tuesday/Wednesday morning (8-9AM eastern) I can do fairly easily as well, but it wouldn't go on for very long as I work nights and try to keep a night schedule for sleep.
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Players are sitting down to dinner with Han Tzu at a poche, expensive restaurant, they are served small avian meals covered in a light, orange sauce and garnished. The make insight roles that I ask for, each of them, on the symbolism of the meal they are eating, not a single character passes the check. After receiving troubling news that Han Tzu's wife means to assassinate him, he asks to retire to the lavatory so that he may compose himself, feeling rather sick to the stomach from the sudden news.
This entire night, evidence leads to Han Tzu as being a shrewd businessmen but not a violent or aggressive person, even going to lengths to provide his wife with considerable estates and wealth for a divorce he is planning. (his wife is a Baronies Baroness, this is important).
Suddenly men arrive, in full military grade body armor and weaponry and shoot up the restaurant. Han Tzu had planned the entire thing it seems. The party survives the encounter, and kills Han Tzu. They might have been forewarned to his treachery had they noticed they had been served ravens for dinner.
He called me low born, so I gatted him in a toilet stall, so it's fine.
Don't forget me cutting his arm off and then saying "Grass grows, birds fly, and broda... I hurt people."
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@Tim: Oh it's fine, I'll just observe the development from afar. Thanks for the offer though.
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We are on for Wednesday nite people!
Send me or PapaParadox a steam friend hit if you want in for the play test. We don't "Need" more people, but more people would generate more ideas that will hopefully find a break in the system that would otherwise sneak it's way in.
Next week, if all things go as planned, we implement Air Ship combat and stats. More on this to follow, when I write it -.-
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We are on for Wednesday nite people!
Send me or PapaParadox a steam friend hit if you want in for the play test. We don't "Need" more people, but more people would generate more ideas that will hopefully find a break in the system that would otherwise sneak it's way in.
Next week, if all things go as planned, we implement Air Ship combat and stats. More on this to follow, when I write it -.-
Time is EST still?
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Yes it is. We've managed to get another game in with two new players, they were able to pick the game up very quickly, one didn't even have any experience with previous pen and paper type games so thats a huge plus for the direction we've been going with while developing the systems.
We might not get to airship combat next week as I hoped, the story took a different turn and unless I blue lightning the event into place it'll seem awkward and out of place, plus I get more time to adjust and set stats to a few starter ships while flushing out the lore and feel of ships that don't exist in GOI.
Added more clarity to Death and Dying and the way in which characters can be healed inside and outside of combat. The balance to Dex giving it some shooting power worked out well, though it has to be watched as we add experience and "level" gain to the pool to allow for the characters to grow their stats and become greater threats, which will also increase the challenge.
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(http://s9.postimg.org/8egdgr95q/Fade_got_owned.jpg)
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Oh, wait, you folks don't mind D&D newbies? In that case I may sign up for the next test, but be warned, I'll probably be very frustrating and due to sod's law very lucky.
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Lol, don't worry about being overly lucky in this game, a bad luck streak quickly results in death.
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i'll jump on this idea too! just tell me how to get set up and i'll be there :3
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I ran into a few glitches with some of the ship systems after a short play test.
I need another week to get it into full push, then we can have a play session, though it won't be on the normal time. If you want in when I have enough, add me on Steam, same name, and give me a shout so I can group my friends list into a testers package.
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Is this still working? Can we get some updates?
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Any updates on this? My friends and I are really interested in playing!
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I will come back to this at a future date, I screwed up a lot of the writing parts and needed to balance the sheets out. The last play test presented some glaring errors in the game, and I don't have a lot of easy answers for them, though I've managed to work out a good amount of them by finding answers in other projects.