Guns Of Icarus Online
Main => Gameplay => Topic started by: Redorio diVario on June 02, 2013, 11:56:23 am
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It's also a tactic, right? I haven't found any guide to ramming on this forum but I would totally love to hear some advices about it. How to ram good, when, with what ship into what ship and with which loadout?
We can just discuss it here :). In the end someone could make a guide about it.
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Here's my advice on the use of Moonshine for effective rams:
https://gunsoficarus.com/community/forum/index.php/topic,1056.msg17422.html
Only thing that's not explicitly stated there is that the Pyramidion is the only true ship for focusing on ramming. The reason is the huge "beak" that extends off the front of the ship. The "beak" is made of hull, and will prevent damage to other components during a ram, allowing one engineer to be fully ready to effectively repair the entire effect of the ram on your ship, while the enemy is unprepared and potentially has heavy weapon/balloon damage to deal with. The fact that the "beak" comes to a point also means that all the damage associated with the impact will be focused on the single part of the ship that you collide with, rather than possibly being spread over all of the ship components that would make contact during the ram using a different ship.
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The other thing with the Pyra is that it has a fairly high top speed and is the second-heaviest ship in the game. These two characteristics give it an immense amount of force when ramming.
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The only other basic is if you're ramming for a kill you want at least their hull armor to be down. If you're ramming for positioning you don't want your hull armor to be down. The thread posted above is great for that positioning stuff.
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Ofi's 5 thought guide to ramming.
one
Why the hell am I ramming? moving gun arcs, saving a friendly, slamming someone into a wall?
two
How can I accomplish this best? light bump, or full force ram.
three
Think about the directions everyone is moving in. Bumping a guy in the ass when you're flying right behind him pretty much does nothing.
four
Don't ram for a kill just wait for a gun reload.
five
Teabag of destiny aka chute vent slam. Some of the best ramming ever is getting above someone then chute venting on their heads. It moves their gun arcs and screws up their altitude.
TIPS
Light taps are easier to recover from.
Don't rear-end people.
Booty first ramming is a viable tactic.
Don't ram when your armor is down.
Yeah I know really bad guide but it might help some people.
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Another tip: if you see a Spire, and you're flying a Pyra, just ram it at full speed with kerosene or moonshine. It'll almost certainly die.
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Bumping a guy in the ass when you're flying right behind him pretty much does nothing.
It is a setup for a dirty joke. Some times those are as much fun as winning.
As for the actual act of ramming Ofiach sums it up quite well.
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another reason to ram, is to actually push an opponent off a point in a cp match... I really do enjoy doing that :P
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Ofi's 5 thought guide to ramming.
one
Why the hell am I ramming? moving gun arcs, saving a friendly, slamming someone into a wall?
Don't forget about ramming just for lolz, an absolutely valid tacticfour
Don't ram for a kill just wait for a gun reload.
True 90% of the time, though sometimes a ram while your guns are reloading and their armor is about to come up can be clutch. Knowing when this situation arises and being in the position and speed to pull it off requires a lot of experience; if you make a mistake with this you'll often come out much worse for the error.
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Here is a question about ramming. I know ship mass matters in terms of ramming, but is mass also ont he balloon? Is a Galleon Balloon different in terms of ramming than a Squid Balloon?
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I think it's velocity x mass. So, if you're ramming down, the balloon controls your vertical speed.
That said, different balloons have different amounts of health... and I think they take a decent amount of damage from rams.
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Ummm, pretty sure unless something has changed all balloons have the same amount of health.
Balloons do take a much higher multiplier of damage though from a ram than any other component, so they usually get decimated during large impacts.
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The general tips that I follow when it comes to ramming-
1. Don't ram without armor. As an extension, don't ram when in critical armor- around 25% or lower. It hurts.
2. If the enemy's armor is down, it is an acceptable time to ram.
3. If you use Impact Bumpers, the effect will last for 5 seconds after activating. Using this, and then switching to moonshine will add the angular drag, which keeps your ship from turning away during and after the impact.
4. If I am taking fire from the target, I aim to ram one side of the ship in order to turn it in some other direction.
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There is a tactic I'm working on that involves a slow ram, first aimed at the nose of the enemy and then sliding to the back of their ship, making slow contact the entire time. It usually causes the enemy's ship to rotate in a seemingly counter-intuitive way that ends up with you behind them. Very useful, if I could just nail-down how to pull it off almost 100% of the time.
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My notes are based on gat/flak Pyra with moonshine and phoenix claw. (i have tried the rest. this is the best)
How to ram:
Moonshine durring impact. This will keep your ship facing straight. Moonshine should be used in bursts, not left on.
Use moonshine to aim. Turn fast using phoenix clam until you arm aimed at the target then hit moonshine to lock on.
Aim well. If you miss your ram you are useless to your team for a long time while turning around.
Get as much gat shots in as you can before the ram.
PRACTICE! Good ramming is the hardest thing to master as a pilot.
When to ram:
Don't
If you must ram do it when:
it's a spire.
When you can pin the enemy to a wall. This doubles their impact damage and can kill any full health ship.
Ramming a galleon WILL NOT HURT it. You can turn the galleon's guns away from you but it's easy to screw up.
intercept enemies who are about to kill your friend.
Other use for ramming:
Ram walls with phoenix claw on to turn around fast. be ready to hit moonshine when you are aiming the way you want during the spin.
The best thing to know about ramming is when NOT to use it. Just keep your gat flak going
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If you overshoot on an attempted ram, keep your face and kerosene reverse instead of turning. The enemy ship will most likely turn in your direction to chase, so if you reverse, you have a good chance at a flank.
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Yeah. I always feel bad for my engines and engineers though.
I'm always a bit rough on my engines. Ramming sort of makes that so much worse.
There is a sense of perverse joy I get when I pull it off successfully.
Also, I was wrong about the balloon thing. Apparently they have the same health. Sorry Smollett.
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Oh one more tip about ramming that I forgot.
Ramming a friendly doesn't damage you. I don't do it much but i have used friendlies as springboards for fast turning when they are being complete morons.
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Oh one more tip about ramming that I forgot.
Ramming a friendly doesn't damage you. I don't do it much but i have used friendlies as springboards for fast turning when they are being complete morons.
I do that too! cept I'm usually ramming Zill's ship.... and he yells at me :P
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Oh one more tip about ramming that I forgot.
Ramming a friendly doesn't damage you. I don't do it much but i have used friendlies as springboards for fast turning when they are being complete morons.
I do that too! cept I'm usually ramming Zill's ship.... and he yells at me :P
That moment when an ally hits you on Dunes, and you were holding steady for flak shots.
Nah its cool brah. It's not like there's much room around here, lol.
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when i ram i just moonshine straight to the other ship not turning it off
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I used to love this.
I called it a 'jackhammer'. You just repeatedly slam into the enemy over and over again. Until they die or your engines just stop.
But.
I don't fly Pyrs as much anymore. I experienced being on the other side of this (me Junker, them Pyr). Thank god for Chute vent is all I have to say (and curse you, ground!)
I now hate myself for employing this tactic a bit.
Plus is it just me, or does moonshine not hold me as straight anymore?
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I ram birds on Duel at Dawn.
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I've wanted to build a Pyramidion just for ramming. Two gats up front, kerosene, moonshine, impact bumpers, and only on 3v3/4v4. I'm a Ram happy pilot, and though it's screwed me many times, I'm getting better. It's all about timing, gotta ram right after their armor is down. Can you continue to ram and push them away from whatever they were doing?
I've found poking (what I like to call it) to work best when you have an ally already attacking the Pokee.
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I'm surprised I haven't seen it mentioned but using the balloon as the point of impact, means any ship can do it and come away with repairable rather than permanent damage not just the Pyra. Though clearly the reasons why you would be doing this are more to do with forcing your target to reposition for your guns, and/ or cause an environmental kill, rather than the joy of flying through ship themed confetti.
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I'm surprised I haven't seen it mentioned but using the balloon as the point of impact, means any ship can do it and come away with repairable rather than permanent damage not just the Pyra.
Direct impact damage does have modifiers against all components- at a constant speed of collision:
The balloon will take 1.8x more damage,
The hull will take 1.2x more damage,
The armor will take 0.8x less damage,
The guns and engines will take 0.6x less damage.
While it is a smart choice to use a balloon instead of the armor in order to ram, it is important to remember that this maneuver shouldn't be used like a Swiss Army knife- in all situations. Generally, I always expect my balloon to go down after a balloon ram. While the ram does do damage... because that balloon goes down, I will lose gun arcs on my ship, which would allow both ships to repair back to normal.
I keep impact damage in mind when I ram larger-armored ships, like the Galleon and the Junker. One huge ram will pop them and put us in a better tactical position.
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thanks for the info on the damage modifiers involved Cullen - I'll do some experimentation on damages to the hull via the ballon later today.
Ramming for damage however isn't what I was suggesting but rather the use of mild impacts to reposition ships favourably to your killing them - for example a glancing blow on the beak of the Pyra to spin it's guns away from you and expose it's mid sections.
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While it is a smart choice to use a balloon instead of the armor in order to ram, it is important to remember that this maneuver shouldn't be used like a Swiss Army knife- in all situations. Generally, I always expect my balloon to go down after a balloon ram. While the ram does do damage... because that balloon goes down, I will lose gun arcs on my ship, which would allow both ships to repair back to normal.
I keep impact damage in mind when I ram larger-armored ships, like the Galleon and the Junker. One huge ram will pop them and put us in a better tactical position.
The only ships I find ramming doesn't really work on are galleon and mobula. They got too many hitpoints to die from it and can usually even return fire. The rest are rammable provided they do not evade you. If done properly in my case, I take no hull damage during a ram. This is doubly important when running through spires and junkers. Oh, and I ram using the pyramidion, because I can use a front gatling gun to disable armor, do hull damage with the flak cannon and finish him off with the ram itself(again, galleons tend to survive this). I've experimented quite a bit about this and it is definitely a staple you can use when done correctly.
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The only ships I find ramming doesn't really work on are galleon and mobula.
A classic pyra hydrogen uppercut works well on the mobula provided you allow for the ship dropping after it's ballon goes down.
Inversely, balloon ramming with a mobula is a bad strategy - I got a kill on a mobula yesterday while I was in a squid due to the fact the mobula's hull went down first.
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Ramming a Mobula isn't bad. In fact, it'll get wrecked by it. The balloon and the hull will both take a hit, and it's a very squishy ship. The only reason why it wouldn't be a good idea to ram one is its ability to dodge the ram with its immense vertical acceleration.
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The mobula isn't that squishy. I was ramming with it to finish off opponents last night.
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One problem with Mobula ramming is that your hull and balloon will both get hit every time, unlike the Pyra where your balloon is protected (one of a number of reasons why the Pyra is by very, very far the best ramming ship). Also, the Mobula is extremely light and not very fast. That means that its rams don't really do very much damage.
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Well that's why you have 3 guns firing nonstop untill you hit him! I know it's not ideal but it was effective for me last night.
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Heh, I suppose three gats could set up for a ram quite nicely.
That makes me want to pair a Pyra with a triple gat Mobula.
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Ramming with a Mobula is pretty much a bad idea all around. Flying close enough to get your guns in maximum effective range is great but unless you ram a squid you risk your ram impacting an opponent with armor which will always end up worse for the mobula.
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Every ship can ram effectively if timed right.
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One of the most evil rams I've seen was a Galleon crashing into a Mobula... I had no clue ships could could fly that fast. That Mobula was easily going twice the speed of a Squid on Shine, right into a smoke stack... Total obliteration.
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Junkers can't ram.
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Junkers can't ram.
Junkers can ram but not usually for a kill. Knocking the enemies gun arcs off can be just as important as doing damage to their health.
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Junkers can't ram.
Every ship can ram.
The effectiveness of said ram, however, differs widely ship by ship.
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Ramming a Mobula isn't bad. In fact, it'll get wrecked by it. The balloon and the hull will both take a hit, and it's a very squishy ship. The only reason why it wouldn't be a good idea to ram one is its ability to dodge the ram with its immense vertical acceleration.
I don't understand that... Why does the mobula have good vertical drop/lift when its basically a flat semicircle.
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It has two huge vertical turbines to assist with upward and downward acceleration.
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I've finished off a couple of ships with a well timed kerosene ram on a Mobula. It's definitely possible but it's incredibly risky and I only did it because the blenderfish was right in front of us (side on), it's armour was down and our guns had been chipping its health down over the last couple of minutes. It was do or die, and we did. I didn't want them spinning that carronade on us again basically. I can't remember what the other ship was.
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The Mobula's whole thing is that it is a huge experiment with balloons. I still think people tend to ignore the huge amount of vertical play you get with it's lift drop rate and use of only light weapons. You can fire on a lot of ships without them firing back simply because you have more vertical play space.
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One interesting advantage of ramming with a Mobula is the fact that it's very difficult to miss, the ship's so fat. I'm not saying you should ram with it, it's an incredibly risky and suicidal strategy, but if you want to teabag your enemy and force them into the ground the Mobula's surprisingly effective.
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Yeah exactly, it's a very wide ship to ram with, with tremendous vertical movement. With good timing it can be instrumental in securing a kill. I did it last night against a Squid on Paritan Rumble and a Goldfish on Dunes. It's funny hearing your crew's reaction as you start picking up speed towards your enemy "We're too close! We'r-- oh, ah. Whoa." It's usually a desperate measure for me rather than a go-to tactic because my Mob's not built for brawling. Sometimes kerosene backpedaling while shooting just isn't enough.
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It has two huge vertical turbines to assist with upward and downward acceleration.
Oh... huh... why didn't I notice that?
Anyway I actually just finished writing a ramming guide about an hour ago.
https://gunsoficarus.com/community/forum/index.php/topic,2666.0.html
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=186818519#-1