Guns Of Icarus Online
Info => Feedback and Suggestions => Topic started by: Vainamoinen on October 24, 2013, 03:20:32 pm
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Hello everyone,
I'm here to present an idea that has been in my head for some time, and that would, I think, be a nice feature the game could offer to the players.
I have searched some key words in the forum and couldn't find anything about this already, I hope this topic is not a duplicate.
The idea:
The idea is that players could create bonds of Tutor/pupil in the game, with an interface (maybe next to friends) dedicated to it .
The aim would be to reinforce the bonds of the already fantastic community, provide even more help to the newcomers so that they capture quick the essence of the game and finally,
give some sense to these teacher achievements that I think are really a lackluster currently.
How would it work:
Very simple.
There would be requirements to become a tutor. Currently I'm thinking of something like level 8. I know it doesn't reflect being good but we can consider that someone level 8 is already someone able.
There would also be requirements to become a pupil. Basically be under level 4.
If both meet the requirements, an option is shown available under become friend which would be either: "propose tutorship" or "ask for tutorship" depending on who is who.
If the tutorship is accepted, the 2 users for a bond of tutorship.
Benefits:
Here is the list of benefits I was thinking about, they are nowhere gamebreaking but offer some advantages for both players:
- The pupil and tutor would see each other speach with a different color than the normal speach in the chat
- The pupil and tutor would have a dedicated voice chat when they play together
- The pupil would get on his gamer tag: "Pupil of : [Duck]Captain Smollett, [Sir] Phelan"
- The tutor would get on his gamer tag: "Tutor of : KwakKwak, [Sir] Mistress"
- The teacher achievements would change. Remove "Play 240mn with ... in the sandbox" (which is just stupid if you ask me)
- The teacher achievements would change. Add for example: "Win 20 match with your pupil as the captain fo your ship","Get you pupil to repair 10 hulls" and "Get 5 pupils to reach level 5"
More incentives could be added to the list but is it really necessary?
I might have more ideas to add on the subject but I would like other players to propose their view on the system first.
Do you think it would be a good asset for the game?
Would you participate if this system was available?
I'm personally getting more and more beginner players adding me as friends and asking me t play with them.
That could be a good occasion to reward the help "experienced" players to help beginners, and beginners to feel the thrill of the game as early as possible instead of just getting bashed by high levels in quest of achievements (I do it too of course don't get me wrong ^^).
Best Regards,
Väinämöin3n
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I like the idea.
I think the suggestion to replace the sandbox achievement with a tutorship achievement is particularly brilliant.
This could be a really good thing for GOI.
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I think we have a teacher program, but I'm not entirely certain on how active or effective it is.
http://gunsoficarus.com/novice-deck/#trainingDays
Overall I think it's a great idea, and I'd be interested in it. I know a lot of players bring their friends along and like to play with them as well.
My only suggestions would be a couple tweaks:
- Rank Limit may need to be adjusted (8 is a good solid number, but I've seen very experienced players at rank 6 as well. What about needing 4 in each role?)
- Adding Tags would only work with a limit of 1 tutor for each pupil, and 1 pupil for each tutor. I'd suggest having a 'pupil limit' instead, and just having current pupils and 'graduated' pupils listed on their in-game profile.
- I like the idea of achievements for tutoring, but they'd have to be adjusted to promote tutoring, and not just collecting pupils and waiting for them to rank up.
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I like the idea aswell but with this you would mainly speak to pilots. Im a decent player myself and would count myself as good enough to do so. And i know many others who are able to teach.
But not everyone is a pilot or flies much. Me and others dont even have lvl 4 pilot.
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- I like the idea of achievements for tutoring, but they'd have to be adjusted to promote tutoring, and not just collecting pupils and waiting for them to rank up.
Well this is the reason why I added the rewards:
"Win 20 match with your pupil as the captain for your ship","Get your pupil to repair 10 hulls (while you are on the ship)".
On this list you can add a lot, actually nearly all the current achievements.
Like buff, destroy X balloons with lumberjack, play X times on this ship.
And all the time you have to be on the same ship as your pupil (or in the same team/spectator?)
I'm definitely against the pupil collection and achievements that would be only towards that.
The achievement "get X pupil to reach level 5" should be hard enough to avoid people doing it in 2 minutes but easy enough so it's not bothersome to do, like a passive achievement. And you can couple this one with one of the above achievements so that the tutor has to play with the pupil.
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Yeah, I was just looking at the 'get X pupils to rank 5'. Some achievement junkies might try to gather up as many low ranks as they can, and then just let them be while they wait for them to reach that rank.
I think the other achievement suggestions are spot on though.
I could see a "Play x Matches with your pupil on Y ship" (for each ship), and even "Play as an engineer for your pupil as they pilot/captain" (so players teach them how to pilot as well. Then some play on different maps, etc. Mostly things that require the tutor and pupil to be on the same ship, perhaps with some near the end being to play against your pupil.
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Hmm, I'd be wary of dropping the level cap to 6 to be a tutor- especially in terms of engie, but more so when concerning gunner. A number of players are rushing achievements and getting to these levels pretty quickly, resulting in (anecdotally seen this several times) mid-levels performing as typical low-levels, such as rebuilding the hull with a mallet- the achievement system is not a direct reflection on knowledge of the game. There's also the question of communication, and whether the person would be an effective in their methods of teaching, such as usage of voice chat etc.
I suggest to do it by hours as each class, rather than achievements. I'm still thinking over the exact boundaries, but it's a more reliable measure than achievements. You could have a dual boundary, such as you have to have X hours in each class to teach at all, and Y hours in the class you want to teach, with Y being a higher value, naturally.
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Achievements are much easier to do now than they used to be. I'm still finding level 4-5 players that still need to be taught tons of things.
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Well another limitor for tutor could be a number of hours player (well if you are afk in the lobby I guess it still increases the number of hours played, so might not be the best) or a number of match played (which proves a "dedication" to the game) but both are much less visible to the user as valid tutors.
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I'm all for changing that stupid teaching achievement. Lets do eet!
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This sounds like a fantastic idea to me, very much in the spirit of GoI and playing to its strengths. You get a salute from me Vaina!
I'd personally go for matches played as that seems the most reliable metric of experience. A couple of great suggestions from Thomas too.
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Another thing that I was thinking about is that to avoid people getting too many pupils at the same time (because after all you can't help everyone at the same time), the number of pupils at the same time could be limited.
Then this brings the issue of people clogging your pupils because they just left the game and then you are stuck with this one for the next coming year.
So it would be necessary to be able to remove a pupil in the UI
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I think we have a teacher program, but I'm not entirely certain on how active or effective it is.
The teachers I know of are pretty active! But there are too many pupils for every teacher to provide a good standard of teaching (as already written many times in threads about this topic before) in my opinion.
I kinda like your ideas, but we would need many more willing, active teachers that know enough about the game mechanics (and teaching itself) to actually help their pupils to become really good players.
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The teachers I know of are pretty active! But there are too many pupils for every teacher to provide a good standard of teaching (as already written many times in threads about this topic before) in my opinion.
I kinda like your ideas, but we would need many more willing, active teachers that know enough about the game mechanics (and teaching itself) to actually help their pupils to become really good players.
I personally would and will not register to the tutor group as it ends up being more a hassle than anything else (I don't want it to feel like a job).
I don't want to spend all my games having pupils on my sides, while I definitely enjoy training nice guys I meet from time to time.
I think that if there was incentives to train pupils, people would take on pupils from time to time, to teach them and at the same time go toward some minor achievements.
Also we should not forget about the CAs that are here to provide help to the community.
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If there's any thread that needs a Necro and needs to be seen by Muse, it's this.
I've read all the OP and this sounds like a great idea for GoIO. Like Coaching in TF2, however, in GoIO it would actually work.
Kamoba, mind sending in another one of your giant emails to Muse?
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If there's any thread that needs a Necro and needs to be seen by Muse, it's this.
I've read all the OP and this sounds like a great idea for GoIO. Like Coaching in TF2, however, in GoIO it would actually work.
Kamoba, mind sending in another one of your giant emails to Muse?
I don't have to send every email ya'know :p
Feedback@musegames.com, say David Ferrari sent you. (you don't have to say I sent you ;) was going for that line "tell them I sent you." You get the the point. 8) )
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If there's any thread that needs a Necro and needs to be seen by Muse, it's this.
I've read all the OP and this sounds like a great idea for GoIO. Like Coaching in TF2, however, in GoIO it would actually work.
Kamoba, mind sending in another one of your giant emails to Muse?
I don't have to send every email ya'know :p
Feedback@musegames.com, say David Ferrari sent you. (you don't have to say I sent you ;) was going for that line "tell them I sent you." You get the the point. 8) )
Actually was just asking you because you make awesome messages, but sure, I'll work on trying to make something worthy of you :P
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I was reading through this post and once I got to the levels, I was a bit suprised, and then I saw the players he mentioned and was super confused
this idea is super rad
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I am going to ask them right now on dev firechat
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clans... makes this redundant... just make them clan related...
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But some people do not want to get into a clan. I personally avoid clans whenever possible, and would rather only get in touch with one or two people I have previously played with. Then again, I am also not big on mainstream rpgs where clans rule the world.
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@Mag, let us know what they said :)
Also, I agree with Lanliss, making a clan based thing would not be beneficial to those who don't want to clan, or only want to clan with their friends (for example the bundle pack clans who form a clan while novice)
Also take into account if clan based, it becomes reliant on not interacting outside of the clan, I know many people who would enjoy/benefit this from this if they got to do it with people not in the same clan or in a clan, as well as players who avoid joining a clan until they've played the game and learnt more about it (which is a bigger volume than active players who would join a clan soon)
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So, the Devs didn't know about it and I will send an email (so you should too, reader) linking to this thread as requested.
Little experience that I had today: I really want to learn Hades, but it is difficult to be handed one in a game, so as usual I warm up by shooting down drones in practice mode. After a few minutes some people popped on my squid (friend listed?) and even after they learned what I was doing, how boring it would be and possibly the least team working moment of GOIO, they wanted to stay and learn too. Why not giving the chance for real high level players to gain achievements and recognition by running practice "lessons" where people would join, mostly as spectators, so that they could see first hand how to play at the best of their capabilities? It would be a good way to publicize your own clan, find good perspective players and increase customer's retention.
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As much as i like these types of ideas, it just shows that goio has an odd learning curve that is kind of needed for most or all players to enjoy. And most of it is based on player inputt, so there will always have to be a player inputt, there may be communication barriers such as language or hardware.
What the game should do is ENCOURAGE communication, teamwork and cooperativity at all times! Perhaps lingering tips at some part of the screen that pops up that says small reminders like "Work with your team ship" or "Remember to command your crew of anything important" and "Not everyone performs well, try to work with that!".
Matchmaker waiting tips i think arent enough, but would be nice for more tips that encourages what the game is about.
Another thing, i rather not make muse take too much workload with making a system like this, it feels way too player dependant and there is a higher chance it wont work as we imagine it to be. What we have to look at is muses new releases, how will this make players good at the game? Coop will make players more familiar with their own ship and team layout versus ships that will show whatever they are doing is working (or not) and there will be no one to blame but themselves. Bring THAT knowledge over to Skirmish and we have good enough crew allready.
In short: We dont need this, Coop will make players in general better, all we can do is encourage teamwork (Guides, videos etc to showcase this)
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So, the Devs didn't know about it and I will send an email (so you should too, reader) linking to this thread as requested.
Little experience that I had today: I really want to learn Hades, but it is difficult to be handed one in a game, so as usual I warm up by shooting down drones in practice mode. After a few minutes some people popped on my squid (friend listed?) and even after they learned what I was doing, how boring it would be and possibly the least team working moment of GOIO, they wanted to stay and learn too. Why not giving the chance for real high level players to gain achievements and recognition by running practice "lessons" where people would join, mostly as spectators, so that they could see first hand how to play at the best of their capabilities? It would be a good way to publicize your own clan, find good perspective players and increase customer's retention.
again. remedied by clans.
I just finished up a 3 hour achieve whoring spree and pubbed around with crazy chieve whoring builds. my babies had to adapt to what they were given and win with it while achieve whoring (which is essentially what this tutor/pupil thing is... another achieve tree).
They got practice on whatever they wanted and I get to play in a style that isn't retard proof.
clans. they're a thing.
also... novice is set up with these hand holding things in mind. No noob ever has the patience to put in the time to learn. They just wanna play and flail around like idiots. You can provide as many teaching tools you want, but at the end of the day they want to just go in a match and shoot crap than watch people do it. or be told how to do it.
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also... novice is set up with these hand holding things in mind. No noob ever has the patience to put in the time to learn. They just wanna play and flail around like idiots. You can provide as many teaching tools you want, but at the end of the day they want to just go in a match and shoot crap than watch people do it. or be told how to do it.
that's harsh :(
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also... novice is set up with these hand holding things in mind. No noob ever has the patience to put in the time to learn. They just wanna play and flail around like idiots. You can provide as many teaching tools you want, but at the end of the day they want to just go in a match and shoot crap than watch people do it. or be told how to do it.
The thing you forget is that every single one of us were noobs at some point. I was, you were, we all were. I've directed many many new players to this very forum when they've asked for good advice or guides, and if one of them happened to ever stumble on one of your less friendly posts, I'm sure they'd be turned off to this whole thing immediately
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But valid. Look at the amount of guides on the forum and the amount of clans that are willing to help new players at least learn the basics. Many people say that they want to learn but they get discouraged by people 'not wanting' to learn.
I'd really like to see nano's opinion on this since he created a tutoring clan.
Also, for a while I suggested a possibility of clan creating "trainee divisions", like a clan inside their clan, but especially for new players to learn. But nobody cared.
@Logic
The difference is some people want to learn and use resources they have. I've stayed in novice as long as I could and asked (and added to friends) smart and experienced players I met so I could grow. I've read guides. There are many people who helped me, sure, but I was the one to put the first effort.