Guns Of Icarus Online
Main => Gameplay => Topic started by: Indreams on November 18, 2014, 10:20:28 am
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To those who aren't familiar, Reagan's star wars is the idea that you can shoot down ICBMs. I was wondering if the same can happen in the game.
Recently, I've noticed enemy projectiles showing hit markers whenever they run into flames. (I've seen this most with incoming mortar shots)
Are projectiles taking damage? Is it possible to shoot down incoming projectiles?
I think it'd be cool (and uber laggy) if two Hwacha barrages negated each other, or if a heavy gatling sniped out lumberjack shots.
Any thoughts, knowledge, or anecdotes?
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I noticed the same effect on projectiles. This would be interesting, but I think it's rather unnecessary...
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Might be tied into mine launchers... as you can shoot both the balloon, and mine if you're good enough
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I doubt this works. The hitmarkers are most likely only there due to the way projectiles are implemented.
Can't confirm though.
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But if something is there. There has been numerous suggestions for a weapon that specificaly takes out projectiles.
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I remember someone telling me months ago when I asked about this that projectiles were invincible. But, I cannot confirm if this is true. (Maybe it was awkm, or another player, I dunno though...)
But also, I've been on many a ship where people where like "Did I just shoot that hades out of the air?" Again, I cannot confirm if this happens for sure.
Hmm.. *Performs muse summoming spell*
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It's been too long since I was in that code and I'm fire-walled out of the database info :P
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Hmm... *imitates muse summoning spell, but this time with a flamer and cake hoping for a cake dev to show up*
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I've had occurrences where flak shots from opposing spires hit in midair
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I've had occurrences where flak shots from opposing spires hit in midair
So the flak was shot down? Or did it just hit the end of its range?
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This seems to happen most often when I hit things flamers. I, too, was curious why projectiles have hit markers
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Well lets consider mines. They're projectiles that float like a mini airship and are programmed to detonate with proximity. Consider sandbox mode's drones. Similar to mines except they have engines and guns, thus can move. So lets say for everything projectile, Muse basically starts with the same concept. This means that all projectiles are actually mini airships with rules tweaked for when they come into contact with another object. This also means the airships we fly are actually giant projectiles. Which would explain why Muse would have to redesign the entire game to make silliness like boarding possible. Projectiles can spawn more projectiles but if they can't enter one another without a reaction taking place then I wonder if human players are categorized as projectiles too. We can exist inside the giant projectile but cannot exist outside of it, at least not for very long before the game polices us to prevent something insane going on with the engine.
So a redefine of everything would need to happen for them to allow it. Far too much work. But this does give a hint at how towns and other objects will work in Adventure mode. If it is similar then we can infer that when we walk around a town it'll be like we're in a giant stationary airship. We won't have a literal dock where ships land at and be able to see them coming and going, we'll have port buildings. Then perhaps instancing where a static airship model is docked and when we take control of it, we get a load screen which then spawns us in the air outside the city.
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But does this mean, with enough focus fire, projectiles can be shot down?
Or are missiles and such do not have the special rule (hull and armor) that ships have and therefore cannot be shot down?
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One of my Pastries swears that he took out an artemis rocked mind-flight with another artemis rocket.
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I have definitely seen projectiles hit eachother midair. I'm not sure if they cancel out but it very much looked like it. Good luck trying to do this on purpose though.
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Projectiles definetly can be shot down. Hitting projectiles with projectiles from the same weapon will destroy both (i.e. a mortar shell hitting an enemy mortar shell). Happened to me occasionally. I did not happen to see projectiles from different weapons hit each other, so I can make no statement about that. (btw mines hitting eachother before arming will also destroy both, an armed mine however can not be shot down by a single unarmed one)
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Now I'm interested to see a Hwacha Galleon fight. I wonder if opposing Hwacha fires would reduce the effectiveness of both Hwachas.
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I've been in enough novice matches to know that the rockets hitting each other is not the reason such a fight takes so long.
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Now I'm interested to see a Hwacha Galleon fight. I wonder if opposing Hwacha fires would reduce the effectiveness of both Hwachas.
I've done it a couple of times.
If you have Heavy Clip and the other Galleon doesn't, you win if you keep your distance. If you get in close with Burst while the enemy still has Heavy Clip loaded, you win. If you get shots on their Hwachas before they have you in their own arcs, you win. The fires don't matter as much as a solid volley being enough to disable the guns.
At least, that's my experience. YMMV.
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I haven't seen it happen, if it does at all, but I don't think its such a good idea to implement it. It would buff Gat and Carronade, and any high spread, high fire rate weapon. Imagine a Junker with its armour down, and someone fires a big ball of fuck you in the form of a Heavy Flak round. Someone sees/hears it and fires their carronade at the right time, the flak shot blows up. Someone fires Hwacha, and as they're traveling the target opens up with a gat. Gat shots hit the rockets and they disappear. I DO think its a cool idea, but I don't want it.
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I haven't seen it happen, if it does at all, but I don't think its such a good idea to implement it. It would buff Gat and Carronade, and any high spread, high fire rate weapon. Imagine a Junker with its armour down, and someone fires a big ball of fuck you in the form of a Heavy Flak round. Someone sees/hears it and fires their carronade at the right time, the flak shot blows up. Someone fires Hwacha, and as they're traveling the target opens up with a gat. Gat shots hit the rockets and they disappear. I DO think its a cool idea, but I don't want it.
You know those scenarios you described are an argument FOR this, because they sound badass.
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You know those scenarios you described are an argument FOR this, because they sound badass.
But muh balance! Screw it, that does sound pretty awesome.
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I haven't seen it happen, if it does at all, but I don't think its such a good idea to implement it. It would buff Gat and Carronade, and any high spread, high fire rate weapon. Imagine a Junker with its armour down, and someone fires a big ball of fuck you in the form of a Heavy Flak round. Someone sees/hears it and fires their carronade at the right time, the flak shot blows up. Someone fires Hwacha, and as they're traveling the target opens up with a gat. Gat shots hit the rockets and they disappear. I DO think its a cool idea, but I don't want it.
Yeah right. First of all we do not know how much damage a shell/rocket must receive in order to be destroyed. Second, nobody reported any hitscan raycast weapon to have shot down projectiles and third, if anybody manages to hit those projectiles midair intentionally, he/she deserves to shoot it down.
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Just thinking... Pretty sure projectiles wouldn't have a value for health. Thus right now cannot be destroyed.
It would be a good feature though. Maybe. If it was balanced. Things most certainly would change. That's for sure.
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Go to practice mode with a buddy, have an artemis on both ships, shoot eachothers artemis at the same time. Begone, none believer.
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Isn't that because they 'deploy'?
I don't think a carronade pellet or gat bullet would have the same effect.
I think if two weapons who' deploy' shoot each other, (H. Flak, hades, etc.) and hit the impact 'deploys' them, as you have observed.
Raycast weapons can't.
I dont think they are 'destroyed' but it counts as an impact.
I think i repeated myself, and i think that was awfully formatted. Whoops.
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Isn't that because they 'deploy'?
I don't think a carronade pellet or gat bullet would have the same effect.
I think if two weapons who' deploy' shoot each other, (H. Flak, hades, etc.) and hit the impact 'deploys' them, as you have observed.
Raycast weapons can't.
I dont think they are 'destroyed' but it counts as an impact.
I think i repeated myself, and i think that was awfully formatted. Whoops.
Carronades and gats are the only raycast weapons right? Then there's the flamethrower and all other weapons spawn a physical projectile.
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Projectiles have 200hp.
Its not know which (if any) damage modifier applies.
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Projectiles have 200hp.
:O
How was this test done?
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There in fact are very specific modifiers for projectiles. I've seen them. They are SEEEEEEEEECRET!
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Yeah right. First of all we do not know how much damage a shell/rocket must receive in order to be destroyed. Second, nobody reported any hitscan raycast weapon to have shot down projectiles and third, if anybody manages to hit those projectiles midair intentionally, he/she deserves to shoot it down.
Wow, OK, that was oddly argumentative. In any case, just because nobody reported raycast weapons shooting them down doesn't mean they can't. I doubt they can, but still. Also, say you were a ball of molten metal, or an explosive. Now let's say you're hit by a gat round, an ARMOR PIERCING BULLET. You'd explode too. Yes, I know, it might miss the explosive, and it might not work at all for the hades, BUT. Thirdly, as we all ought to know, unless you're using heavy clip, you aim gat/carro by pointing in the general direction of what you want to hit, the end. It may or may not be intentional, it might be a fluke. And let's just say someone makes a one in a million shot and hits an h.flak round with a Mercury or something. Hell yes that's an achievement, but its not reason to implement this.
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Hell yes that's an achievement, but its not reason to implement this.
I don't know about the implementation, but is this actually a thing?
Does projectiles have 200 health, or do they explode when they hit other projectiles?
There in fact are very specific modifiers for projectiles. I've seen them. They are SEEEEEEEEECRET!
Oh, come on Queso. Can't you like dumb-down explain this to us? We aren't asking for the entire code for the game or anything.
In fact, can anybody from Muse confirm that projectiles have hit points?
Thanks,
Indreams
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1) Yes, projectiles have health. They also have their own "health type", meaning the damage type modifiers are unique for projectiles.
2) With the exception of the armed mine, projectile hitboxes are quite small and moving fast enough for hitting them to be problematic for the physics engine (we already have special-case logic to prevent them from passing through targets that are much larger and slower-moving)
So, yes, it's in theory possible to shoot down projectiles but I've never seen it mean much in practice. It's been this way basically forever, too; some changes to hitmarker display just meant you could start seeing them relatively recently. It was a mechanic we experimented with early on but never found to work in practice - since it also never seemed to be causing problems in practice, no one's ever done the work to remove it.
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Thanks! I think that answers everything!
Impractical, but legendary when you can pull it off. I like that.
Who wants to shoot down one lumberjack shot with a full heavy hwacha barrage? :D
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Make the ammo lochnagar and I'm down.
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[...]
Also, say you were a ball of molten metal, or an explosive. Now let's say you're hit by a gat round, an ARMOR PIERCING BULLET. You'd explode too. Yes, I know, it might miss the explosive, and it might not work at all for the hades
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Arguing with reallife logic won't help you in a game.
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Hell yes that's an achievement, but its not reason to implement this.
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Of course it is, every game needs unreliable point defense.
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[...]
Also, say you were a ball of molten metal, or an explosive. Now let's say you're hit by a gat round, an ARMOR PIERCING BULLET. You'd explode too. Yes, I know, it might miss the explosive, and it might not work at all for the hades
[...]
Arguing with reallife logic won't help you in a game.
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Hell yes that's an achievement, but its not reason to implement this.
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Of course it is, every game needs unreliable point defense.
A) I know. It's still a point though.
B) I already said I'm on board. And in any case, its already in game. Hell, unless I get hired by Muse and screw around in the game files there's not much I can do about it.
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As far as I understand, the reason projectiles have health and modifiers is simply due to a quirk of the unity engine.
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Unity doesn't really have anything to do with it. It's all custom game logic. It's a design choice. If it weren't for mines actually using both projectile health and the damage modifiers it probably wouldn't be problematic to remove, but there is also no reason to. In code it's usually a lot easier to build a feature initially, even if it won't be used, than to try and implement it later if it turns out you needed it.