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Suggestions about AI improvement

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AlienOvermind:
We all know AI crewmen are bad. Here's what I believe should be done to improve them.

We need more control over AI crewmen. I want some interface to set my own AI presets for each ship (like 3 presets per ship) and I want to be able to add my custom AI crewman on my ship in the same way as with human players.

As for customizing AI I want this:
1) Limiting devices AI crewman should interact with. For example on a Junker I should be able to set AI to interact only with "cellar" guns and main engine and I won't ever see this AI crewman running on a main deck. Or limit AI to right engine, baloon and bottom-right gun on a Mobula and he won't run around our huge deck like a headless chicken. This is the most impornant part of the plan — with just that we will organize somewhat effective co-operation of humans and AI.
2) Setting priorities. And it's not just "armor / baloon / guns", I want behavior patterns like:
  - putting down fires on <X part> (X is armor / baloon / gun 1 / gun 2 / gun 3 / main engine / left engine / rignt engine etc);
  - repairing <X part> if it's damaged more than by <Y>%;
  - rebuilding <X part>;
  - shooting the enemy with armor condition: <any / active / inactive> and hull condition: <any / mildly damaged / severely damaged> (hull condition should use the same damage stages as with ship's visual looks);
  - destroyng enemy's baloon / engines / guns.
3) Ideally I'd like to set ammo they use (one slot, like a normal engineer), engineer's kit may stay fixed at Spanner / Mallet / Extinguisher.
4) I have mixed feelings about Chem Spray — maybe it would be okay to be able to change Extinguisher for a Spray and add pattern "spraying <X part>" or maybe we should leave Chems for humans after all.

Priority patterns may seem a bit overcomplicated, but I believe, that if we limit AI operations to only 3-4 devices if would work just fine.

As for GUI. We would obviously need a new screen to edit AI presets — it should be done in the same manner as player / ship customizing screens are done. And then setting customized AI in an actual crew should be done similar to loadout recommendations — i.e. click on crewman icon and if the slot is empty you should see a window with all your Custom AI Crewmen. After you set AI Crewman this slot should be considered not empty, i.e. some random player shouldn't be able to connect there.

And the last point is some ethical stuff. I heard an opinion, that if AI is good, the captains will often prefer them to humans and that will harm the community. But I want to throw a couple of counter-agruments:
- Good AI will improve overall expirience, because matchmaking queue will become shorter and we will get less frustration about useless orange weirdos.
- Good AI will force players to learn, so they can at least play better than AI. And in the end community will benefit from this getting less powder monkeys and more competent skyriders. Also using custom AI crewmen may be banned in novice matches, so players would have a place to learn.

And that's it. Tell me your thoughts please.

Kamoba:
This is on several other threads, and while its a good idea, I will sound like a broken record when I say this...
Being able to control the AI in such ways, and improve the AI beyond their current abilities will only encourage antisocial behaviours ingame.
People would start demanding players leave their ship, knowing they'd be able to play with AI, which would pretty much destroy the game for lower level players, making the player retention too low.
Also the anti-social behaviours which are risked by improving AI are something Muse wants to avoid, they have even stated this themselves.

AI are a last resort for if you can not fill your ship within lobby time.
If you're in a good lobby with good players, you can increase the wait time as long as needed for the queue to load your lobby.

The problem of people being stuck with AI crews comes from impatient players pressing ready too soon and screwing it over for the other pilots in the lobby.for not showing the consideration to allow their ships to be filled.

Real players should always be given priority over AI. And the only time I can see it changing is the coming of Co-op and in Co-op mode...

BlackenedPies:
AI aren't bad, in fact they're better than most new players without communication. The problem I have with AI is their behavior with manning guns, or specifically manning a different gun when their current gun has no arcs on the designated target. An extra important command that could be added is set 2 AI to attack and one on repair.

Muse wants the AI to be as simple as possible and able to function- which they do. Build your ships around AI, for example depending on how many AI I have I know which ship I'll pick. AI behavior can be improved but there likely wont be any AI customization. AI will have the same loadout and a predesignated repair cycle that works.

In the old system pre match making when there were no recommended loadouts and it was near impossible to get new crew to bring loadouts, I played with only AI for over 100 matches in ships named the AI ONLY PLEASE or DONT JOIN AI ONLY. AI work well on many ships, and I had a 43 match win streak in an AI flame squid. Flares are essential when using AI on most ships (AI don't shoot flares).

AlienOvermind:

--- Quote from: BlackenedPies on July 09, 2015, 01:20:34 pm ---AI aren't bad, in fact they're better than most new players without communication. The problem I have with AI is their behavior with manning guns, or specifically manning a different gun when their current gun has no arcs on the designated target. An extra important command that could be added is set 2 AI to attack and one on repair.

Muse wants the AI to be as simple as possible and able to function- which they do. Build your ships around AI, for example depending on how many AI I have I know which ship I'll pick. AI behavior can be improved but there likely wont be any AI customization. AI will have the same loadout and a predesignated repair cycle that works.

In the old system pre match making when there were no recommended loadouts and it was near impossible to get new crew to bring loadouts, I played with only AI for over 100 matches in ships named the AI ONLY PLEASE or DONT JOIN AI ONLY. AI work well on many ships, and I had a 43 match win streak in an AI flame squid. Flares are essential when using AI on most ships (AI don't shoot flares).

--- End quote ---

You're getting wrong idea. Yeah, AI is ok if all ship is maintained by AI and ship is build around using AI. But that use-case is kinda too weird for a normal player. AI crewmen should fill the gaps, not doing all work. And I want them to good at filling the gaps — because it's the most common task for AI.

Kamoba:

--- Quote from: BlackenedPies on July 09, 2015, 01:20:34 pm ---AI aren't bad, in fact they're better than most new players without communication.

--- End quote ---

Which leads to anti-social behaviour such as this:


--- Quote from: BlackenedPies on July 09, 2015, 01:20:34 pm ---I played with only AI for over 100 matches in ships named the AI ONLY PLEASE or DONT JOIN AI ONLY.

--- End quote ---


And I don't think I can stress enough how Buffing AI would only encourage pilots to act like the above, or worse like complete idiots by insulting and otherwise trolling newer players just because AI are better.

The aim should be to fill your ship with players who wind up as your friends, and regular crew mates.

This is a co-op team play game! The team does not mean Muse provide AI crew for you! Otherwise this is not a teamwork based game if everyone decides AI only because mediocre players would suck in comparison!

There is a problem with the system if people are finding AI on their ships too often, and the answer is not to "fix" the AI, the solution is to make sure ships only get AI as a last resort.

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