Author Topic: Poor Squid  (Read 30188 times)

Offline Spud Nick

  • Member
  • Salutes: 130
    • [✦✦45]
    • 40 
    • 45
    • 45 
    • View Profile
Poor Squid
« on: October 23, 2014, 08:53:19 am »
I have never seen a squid win a match without using a carroande or a flamethrower. Is this a problem with the pilots or the ship it self?

Offline GeoRmr

  • Member
  • Salutes: 178
    • [Rydr]
    • 45 
    • 1
    • 45 
    • View Profile
    • Storm Ryders
Re: Poor Squid
« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2014, 09:41:31 am »
Mid - long-range squid can work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8P53d9TGfwE

Offline Indreams

  • Member
  • Salutes: 105
    • 17
    • 24 
    • View Profile
Re: Poor Squid
« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2014, 10:18:41 am »
I've seen a squid equipped with mercury field and flak that was quite devastating on the dunes.

It'd snipe, run, and repeat. Our pyramidions could never catch him.

But yea, squids are most effective when they get close and engage on the blind side. It's easier to stay out of the gun arc near the enemy.

Offline Dementio

  • Member
  • Salutes: 135
    • [Rydr]
    • 43 
    • 45
    • 45 
    • View Profile
Re: Poor Squid
« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2014, 10:57:44 am »
The lack of the gat/mortar or hades/flak bifecta makes it rather hard to kill something quickly for a Squid, especially since the pilot needs to turn and have a second engineer ready on the side gun immediately, who might be buffing or helping repair/rebuild other stuff.
It doesn't help either that the squid has almost non-existent armor and thus needs to be perfect in term of sneaking up on the enemy to get a minimum amount of damage while killing the enemy.
An alternitive, and more often than not a safer route to quick killing, is to disable the enemy repeatedly until the enemy dies. Carronade and flamer are without a doubt the most reliable close range disable guns.

A decently played mine Squid would probably be more effective in close range since with the quick speed the mines could be everywhere, but mines are usually not as reliable.
A longish range Squid usually loses to most prolonged battles in long range, I believe, especially if the Squid is against long range disable, but the Squids speed allows the ship to reposition rather quickly. Another problem here is that the only longish range light piercing guns are hades and mercury which both have limited horizontal arcs making it either hard or impossible to get a bifecta with the side gun, so long range killing is rarely seen from a Squid.

The problem is the ship's stats. The Squid is probably the hardest ship to fly since it relies more on the initial position of itself than most other ships do, as well as the position of it's ally.
With that I mean, if the Squids gets looked at then there is a high chance that it's armor is almost dead, which takes the main engineer away from the engines and the balloon, which decreases the Squid mobility, which is the ships strongest asset.
Also, most Squids that are not carro/flamer are a bit slow in support because they lose that instant disable power or have no quick killing potential, which often results in a 2v1 against the Squids ally, while the Squid gets ignored for the duration.

You don't see more than carro/flamer Squids, because this is probably the easiest ship in pug games because:
no coordinated enemy team
no reliable chem spraying on the enemy team
carro/flamer are rather easy to shoot even on a full speed squid

In a competitive-ish field most teams just don't try the effort on the Squid, either because it takes too much practise and they like practising what they are already good at or because they fly, or want to fly, ships that are superior to the Squid for the role they are supposed to execute (Metamidion kills quicker than a Squid, Blenderfish is a more tanky disabler than a Squid and so on).


I hope this helped in terms of answering your question.

Offline Spud Nick

  • Member
  • Salutes: 130
    • [✦✦45]
    • 40 
    • 45
    • 45 
    • View Profile
Re: Poor Squid
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2014, 11:29:29 am »
I think many players see the squid how they saw the goldfish a few months ago. Under powered and in need of a buff. I wonder if it's the ship that needs a change or the mindset of the pilots.

Offline GeoRmr

  • Member
  • Salutes: 178
    • [Rydr]
    • 45 
    • 1
    • 45 
    • View Profile
    • Storm Ryders
Re: Poor Squid
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2014, 11:33:37 am »
I think many players see the squid how they saw the goldfish a few months ago. Under powered and in need of a buff. I wonder if it's the ship that needs a change or the mindset of the pilots.

Mostly I think its just the mindset of the players. Having said that I would be happy giving the squid a buff to its perma-hull.

Offline HamsterIV

  • Member
  • Salutes: 328
    • 10 
    • 45
    • 45 
    • View Profile
    • Monkey Dev
Re: Poor Squid
« Reply #6 on: October 23, 2014, 11:47:52 am »
My standard kill squid is F:Gat S:Banshee A:Merc, but  I have had the most success as a armor stripping support F:Gat S:Gat A:Artemis. Where F=Front, S=Starboard, A=Aft. Two gats will pulp armor pretty quickly and start tearing off engines and guns leaving a fat juicy target for my ally to finish. Alternately once they are stripped I can turn to finish with the rear.

I like putting a long range gun on the back of the squid to support my ally if they decide to play the sniper game. Since two of my crew will be out of action during this phase, I normally have one bring a buff kit so that the long range gun can output more damage.

Offline DJ Logicalia

  • Member
  • Salutes: 191
    • [♫]
    • 35 
    • 45
    • 45 
    • View Profile
Re: Poor Squid
« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2014, 12:19:17 pm »
I saw some of the [PLRS] guys the other day running a Merc, Mortar squid and cleaning up with it. I guess the strategy is to come in from far off with the merc and then put the side on them. It was super badass, but I can't get it to work my self.My pal SlicedAndDiced had it going a few times, but it's pretty difficult, and seems way to impractical for any sort of competitive match

Offline Ruairi

  • Member
  • Salutes: 6
    • [ƤƦ]
    • 39 
    • 45
    • 45 
    • View Profile
Re: Poor Squid
« Reply #8 on: October 23, 2014, 01:09:34 pm »
The problem the squid faces is it's very easily countered and over powered. If it can't disable you by the time you get your gun arcs on it, then it's in trouble. The other problem is that it's skill requirement is very high for the entire crew not just the pilot. Even if you use hit and run tactics, the chances of your ally also making it out are fairly slim. Basically put, name something the squid can do that another ship can't do better that will contribute positively to winning? :S

Offline GeoRmr

  • Member
  • Salutes: 178
    • [Rydr]
    • 45 
    • 1
    • 45 
    • View Profile
    • Storm Ryders
Re: Poor Squid
« Reply #9 on: October 23, 2014, 01:55:58 pm »
Basically put, name something the squid can do that another ship can't do better that will contribute positively to winning? :S

Bait enemies quickly to distract them and allow your ally to ambush kill them while providing support.

Sneak up on an enemies blind side - stay in the blind side - and lock them down.

Block points in CP by zerg rushing.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2014, 01:59:31 pm by GeoRmr »

Offline Zirilfer

  • Member
  • Salutes: 12
    • [◉‿◉]
    • 15 
    • 34
    • 45 
    • View Profile
Re: Poor Squid
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2014, 01:58:30 pm »
I've been having a lot of luck with banshee front, mine side as of late. Albeit not it excessively competitive lobbies.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2014, 02:22:00 pm by Zirilfer »

Offline Ruairi

  • Member
  • Salutes: 6
    • [ƤƦ]
    • 39 
    • 45
    • 45 
    • View Profile
Re: Poor Squid
« Reply #11 on: October 23, 2014, 02:38:32 pm »
Basically put, name something the squid can do that another ship can't do better that will contribute positively to winning? :S

Bait enemies quickly to distract them and allow your ally to ambush kill them while providing support.

Sneak up on an enemies blind side - stay in the blind side - and lock them down.

Block points in CP by zerg rushing.

Baiting is a gamble and doesn't always necessarily work. (Besides isn't there an old rule, don't chase the squid? :P )
Blind sides somewhat negated by phoenix claw, and teamwork. (Formation flying kills squids)

Blocking points the squid can do very well... Shame its a minority game type. :/

Offline sparklerfish

  • Member
  • Salutes: 124
    • [Clan]
    • 45 
    • 45
    • 45 
    • View Profile
    • DJ mixes and original tracks on SoundCloud
Re: Poor Squid
« Reply #12 on: October 23, 2014, 03:19:20 pm »
I've been having a lot of luck with banshee front, mine side as of late. Albeit not it excessively competitive lobbies.

Can confirm that this build is pretty effective with a skilled crew, but as Z said, I haven't been on it in exclusively high-level/competitive lobbies.  With a gunner on the side mines it's kind of like flying a faster, more maneuverable single-sided munker.

That said, I do think the ship is in need of some sort of a buff.  There is a reason you don't see them in competitive play.  I don't know what the solution is.  I think one of its disadvantages is that while it is fast and maneuverable, the engines are vulnerable due to being difficult to repair.  The rear port engine in particular often gets neglected, and running to fix it leaves other components vulnerable because you're so far away from them.  Perhaps merely moving the rear engines closer would help, or having a ramp between them.

Offline HamsterIV

  • Member
  • Salutes: 328
    • 10 
    • 45
    • 45 
    • View Profile
    • Monkey Dev
Re: Poor Squid
« Reply #13 on: October 23, 2014, 03:23:17 pm »
I don't think we need another ship for competitive play. I think we need a ship that a high level crew can handicap themselves with when facing a lower level lobby.

Offline Spud Nick

  • Member
  • Salutes: 130
    • [✦✦45]
    • 40 
    • 45
    • 45 
    • View Profile
Re: Poor Squid
« Reply #14 on: October 23, 2014, 03:39:35 pm »
I don't think we need another ship for competitive play. I think we need a ship that a high level crew can handicap themselves with when facing a lower level lobby.

Thanks for reminding me of that. I will fly the Tug of War Mobula more often.