What's wrong with heavy guns?

[Dutch Vanya]

I never said it was easy to kill them personally. Just easy to counter two galleons.
This isn't a contest. Its a thread on either heavy guns or galleons being weaker plays than, say, stuff with an abundance of light guns, and why.

That is correct. So if they are so easy to counter, why has no team successfully been able to do so? I'm referring to competitive matches, since that is what most of the forum goers seem to base the balance discussions on.  What do you know about countering, that no one else does?

[RearAdmiralZill]

You cannot focus on only competitive for the sake of a balanced game. Competitive usually just manages to break something really well if it's indeed broken (Think heavy flak before arming times and proper damage modifiers, or 1.0 mercs. Now apply competitive teams.) It can also make things look OP, but in reality they are just being used extremely well in the precise situation that makes them strong. (LJ cries from eons ago?)

Again, I haven't watched those games. I have no idea what others took, nor the builds the galleons used. I never claimed to know more than anyone else. It is my opinion that two galleons are easy to counter. Clearly you think otherwise for your own reasons. Fine by me.

[Squidslinger Gilder]

You cannot focus on only competitive for the sake of a balanced game. Competitive usually just manages to break something really well if it's indeed broken (Think heavy flak before arming times and proper damage modifiers, or 1.0 mercs. Now apply competitive teams.) It can also make things look OP, but in reality they are just being used extremely well in the precise situation that makes them strong. (LJ cries from eons ago?)

Again, I haven't watched those games. I have no idea what others took, nor the builds the galleons used. I never claimed to know more than anyone else. It is my opinion that two galleons are easy to counter. Clearly you think otherwise for your own reasons. Fine by me.

Testify Zill!!

Yes, I'm in agreement. 2 Galleons are easy to counter. I haven't see the matches either but something had to have gone wrong for them to have swept everyone with that build. However, if they played on Duel with that...that could potentially be a decent combo but it would be a situation where you'd be constantly moving and broadsiding, taking advantage of respawns to meat grind them.

[VomAct]

Biggest problem with galleons right now is it only takes one hwacha or one heavy carronade on a goldfish with half-decent positioning to effectively counter one.  Or any carronade or disabling build for that matter.

As for heavy guns, they are just too easy to disable.  One shot from heavy clip carronade or merc is an instant gun disable, which is bad news for a ship that relies on its heavy guns as its main advantage against lighter, faster ships.

Also I watched a match where the Ryders (double galleon) were taken out by the Thralls (Blenderfish/Pyra) on Paritan a number of weeks ago in SCS.

[Mezhu]

Neither galleons nor heavy guns are weak kek, quite the contrary. They just have quite high a skill requirement to fly effectively, which most teams and individuals fail to meet. A well positioned galleon with accurate gunners is nothing you want to be faced against. As usual, though, people are so eager to strongly comment on stuff from a safe distance. If you think a blenderfish can negate a galleon's threat you clearly haven't played on or against a good gally.

[IvKir]

I second what Mezhu said. I'm, maybe, not the best captain in this thread, but good crew makes Galleon do wonders.

Buuut... he also need a decent ally and tactics. If you pick galleon with Hwacha and Carro in Dunes against merk\artemis pyramidion, you will be, of course, in tears.
But in Ambush, or even Paritan Rumble, you can deal a lot of damage, even to experienced crews.
Only thing, that, i think, must be improved - it's, maybe, rebuild time on big guns. But... thats just thought.

[ShadedExalt]

Still very much a noob here, but the few times I have faced a Galleon in matches I was carried to, they were pretty damn effective.  I think the first time, the enemy team had 2 Galleons, one all hwacha, back flamer and a merc on the side, the other the heavy flak/hwacha preset, a Blenderfish and a gat/mortar Pyra.  We had our Blenderfish, a dual mercury Pyra, Hwacha/Heavy Flak Galleon, and a Lumberfish.  I think it ended up 12/10, us.  When they weren't being pinned by our Lumberfish/Mercurial Pyra, or having a pirate battle with our Galleon, they blew everything to kingdom freakin' come.  As an engineer, I have a tiny spasm of sympathy when someone mentions getting a full broadside from a Galleon.

[Moike]

Biggest problem with galleons right now is it only takes one hwacha or one heavy carronade on a goldfish with half-decent positioning to effectively counter one.  Or any carronade or disabling build for that matter.

I second this, and put forward the addition of lumber fish as an effective counter. I would like to say rather than the medium guns being underpowered (excluding Hflak... unless the hull is down  But I'm fine with that) that it is the galleon and spire that are countered too easily by anything that can pop a balloon. The fact that three out of four medium guns make a respectable goldfish build means I don't think they need any kind off buff or help

I'm also fine with the medium guns being easy to disable though - if you don't want your guns down you should kill or disable the other ship first.