Fellow Ex-Gunners Of Icarus Lend Me Your Ears!

[Carn]

The way you worded it made it seem as though you should be able to fix something else during the reload. EVERY good gunner fixes his gun if needed during reload. As for over privileged gunners, I've rotated with crewmates as to who is gunner and who is an engie. We never squabbled about it. As for who gets to be gunner, its a simple matter of who was there first. If I land as a second gunner on a ship, I always let the guy who was there first be gunner. A good gunner develops good habits. They aren't the same as an engie's but they are not bad. A gunner can develop bad habits, but so can engies and pilots. And if so many of these tougher fights require a triple engie crew, why do so many clans successfully field crews that have a gunner in the competitive scene?

[Riggatto]

The way you speak makes me think you think it is bad that some people take gunners. They aren't hurting you.   If you don't want them, don't take them. I would say your (or anyone else's) job to say what way people should run their ship.

Edit:  Carn ninjad me, but I stand by my statement

[BlackenedPies]

If you're against a good opponent with 3 engi and 2 buffs while you have a gunner then you need to switch or you will fail. Practicing with 3 engi prepares you for this. Gunners don't always hurt when compared to a main engi or an ineffective buff engi. Gunners do hurt when compared to a good player with spanner mallet buff. It's math.

You need to make sure that there's nothing to fix every reload. If you're an engineer then you chem/repair and if you're a buff engi then you chem/repair and buff. Sure a good gunner may not develop bad habits, but they might not be prepared for when they need to switch to a buff engi. It's not difficult and I regularly teach brand new players who quickly develop the skills.

I've observed two main reasons why clans bring gunners in competitive. They're either against another clan who's bringing a gunner or they're well practiced with a gunner. They also might not perceive that they're against a particularly tough fight. This is no credence that gunners are viable against a good buff engi. Math

[BlackenedPies]

Being a Gunner is lazy.

That's mean.

Koali is right, and it's the wrong word.

I don't think that gunners are as balanced as they should be and gun buffs are too easy. Gunners need 2 engineer tools to compete and gun buffs last too long. Gun buffs should be more difficult to maintain and disable should be better against them.

Currently the math doesn't make sense to be a gunner. It isn't viable compared to a buff engi. Give gunners two tools and decrease gun buffs, that's been my stance.

[Xylo Wenchbane]

Has anyone tried mentioning having say a limit on specific ammo types? Say I dunno 300-400 rounds per ammo slot. Gunners would clearly have the bigger advantage here.
You could also limit the ship but give it more along the lines of 600 or so per gun on board.

Metamidion ran out of gat? Guess you can start doing broadsides from the portside. Mobulas would work interestingly. I think the Squids and Goldfish would suffer most with this suggestion.

Sounds pretty basic but it could help flesh out gunners more and provide more opportunities to learn how different ammo works for newer players.

[c-ponter]

Has anyone tried mentioning having say a limit on specific ammo types? Say I dunno 300-400 rounds per ammo slot. Gunners would clearly have the bigger advantage here.
You could also limit the ship but give it more along the lines of 600 or so per gun on board.

Metamidion ran out of gat? Guess you can start doing broadsides from the portside. Mobulas would work interestingly. I think the Squids and Goldfish would suffer most with this suggestion.

Sounds pretty basic but it could help flesh out gunners more and provide more opportunities to learn how different ammo works for newer players.

interesting idea but I don't think it would work because you would need different ammo amounts for different guns eg flamethrower carries 350 rounds per mag, and 2 flamethrower mags won't get you anywhere, whereas 600 rounds on a heavy flak will easily last the whole game.
Then like you said a pyra relies heavily on its front guns, take away one of those and it is practically useless.
overall I think it would require a lot more effort than the final pay out would be worth.

[BlackenedPies]

Unless default ammo count was also limited it would hurt gunners more than buff engi who have a major dps advantage. It would hurt ranged guns the most like hades and lumber which rely on lesmok. Each ammo generally serves a specific purpose and has no substitute.

[Koali]

Alright, Moriarty, I lent you my ears. Can I have them back now? I have to go to school.

[Omniraptor]

Maybe in a future mod, but limited ammo would not fit in vanilla goio.

[Koali]

I think limiting ammo would be a pretty bad idea. If you use all of it, you have no way of fighting besides ramming. And Moonshine rams hurt both parties. I'm more in favor of nerfing gun buffs, and/or giving classes their own specific stat boosts separate from item slots.