Press Start Community Guns of Icarus Tournament - Sign ups extended to April 30

[Thomas]

I really don't want to rain on your parade, but here goes.

-This is event is both short notice and not properly organized. Even signing up on your site and reading the details, there's still a lot of "maybes". (prizes, betting, etc). A lot of the information seems geared at the PS community, mostly giving away keys and such so they can participate.

-Who's participating? As far as I can tell, there's no roster of current signed up teams. Often seeing others signed up will encourage teams to sign up themselves.

-How are you getting attention for it? Right now there's just this forum post. Most of the GoIO community doesn't check the forums, so you're going to need to spend some time in game if you want to get more players interested. And you're going to have to convince them to sign up to your site to view the information and then email you their team information. That's actually asking quite a lot of the average gamer.

-When is this happening? Days, times, etc. People are going to have a hard time committing to a tournament/event when they don't know when it's happening. What if it conflicts with other events?

-How do you 'win' the tournament? Is it point based? You say that it's 2 matches, but that can lead to what we in the industry call 'A Tie' (each team wins a round). Which is often why most competitions do a 'best of 3', which just means someone needs to win twice. Is it single elimination? Double elimination? No elimination?

-The match details. Just a lot wrong here. The creator can set the server if they want to. Otherwise it will auto-set it to what works best for you. 15 minutes of active combat? Please head over to http://cesports.org/matches and watch some of those videos. Matches rarely ever end in 15 minutes. There isn't much need for calling out to their team and the enemy. Or waiting 5 minutes to make sure everyone loads. The game actually does a 30 second or so loading screen to make sure most everyone is ready to go immediately.

-"Drop into ships and listen to crew chat". This can't happen. There's no tools or resources for it. I would recommend spectating some matches to become familiar with how it works, and what you can and can't do. While you can see players on ships, it's difficult to get close ups of them. It's also impossible to listen in to the crew chat. More importantly, most veteran competitive teams use their own voice systems (skype, steam, teamspeak, mumble, etc). So if you ask nicely, this may allow you a way to listen in on them and record. Otherwise you just can't.


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It's mostly a nice idea, and sounds fun, but you really should start smaller. You're trying to pull off a large scale event, and at this rate it's just not going to happen. You don't have the trust of the community, the organizational experience, or fundamental understanding of the game mechanics.

You need to get all of that and more very very soon if this is going to work.  ((and it also does seem very super scammy when you put that much emphasis on players giving you cash for the chance at virtual goods and the promise that you'll donate the money to a charity. Is there anything to guarantee this? You really want to build the trust before you start asking for money.))

[ZeckPressStart]

I really don't want to rain on your parade, but here goes.

-This is event is both short notice and not properly organized. Even signing up on your site and reading the details, there's still a lot of "maybes". (prizes, betting, etc). A lot of the information ared at the PS community, mostly giving away keys and such so they can participate.

-Who's participating? As far as I can tell, there's no roster of current signed up teams. Often seeing others signed up will encourage teams to sign up themselves.

-How are you getting attention for it? Right now there's just this forum post. Most of the GoIO community doesn't check the forums, so you're going to need to spend some time in game if you want to get more players interested. And you're going to have to convince them to sign up to your site to view the information and then email you their team information. That's actually asking quite a lot of the average gamer.

-When is this happening? Days, times, etc. People are going to have a hard time committing to a tournament/event when they don't know when it's happening. What if it conflicts with other events?

-How do you 'win' the tournament? Is it point based? You say that it's 2 matches, but that can lead to what we in the industry call 'A Tie' (each team wins a round). Which is often why most competitions do a 'best of 3', which just means someone needs to win twice. Is it single elimination? Double elimination? No elimination?

-The match details. Just a lot wrong here. The creator can set the server if they want to. Otherwise it will auto-set it to what works best for you. 15 minutes of active combat? Please head over to http://cesports.org/matches and watch some of those videos. Matches rarely ever end in 15 minutes. There isn't much need for calling out to their team and the enemy. Or waiting 5 minutes to make sure everyone loads. The game actually does a 30 second or so loading screen to make sure most everyone is ready to go immediately.

-"Drop into ships and listen to crew chat". This can't happen. There's no tools or resources for it. I would recommend spectating some matches to become familiar with how it works, and what you can and can't do. While you can see players on ships, it's difficult to get close ups of them. It's also impossible to listen in to the crew chat. More importantly, most veteran competitive teams use their own voice systems (skype, steam, teamspeak, mumble, etc). So if you ask nicely, this may allow you a way to listen in on them and record. Otherwise you just can't.


---

It's mostly a nice idea, and sounds fun, but you really should start smaller. You're trying to pull off a large scale event, and at this rate it's just not going to happen. You don't have the trust of the community, the organizational experience, or fundamental understanding of the game mechanics.

You need to get all of that and more very very soon if this is going to work.  ((and it also does seem very super scammy when you put that much emphasis on players giving you cash for the chance at virtual goods and the promise that you'll donate the money to a charity. Is there anything to guarantee this? You really want to build the trust before you start asking for money.))

You pose interesting points yet some of these have been answered all ready. However I will answer everything here to make it easy.

I'll be making a post shortly about who is already participating i've been working on confirming one last team. I will put it on both the public accessible forum on the site as well as here.

This event was fairly focused on the press start community since it is a community event. However I didn't want to leave out the GOIO forum or other players. I probably should clear up PSC goals as a site. PSC aims to grow gaming through a friendly community. We hope to grow the number of gamers by providing a welcoming environment for newcomers. This is why the event was first focused on the community giving keys to participants to help grow the guns of icarus online playership. Hope this explains that bit you mentioned

Currently awareness for the event is being spread multiple ways. We don't want to make many announcements too early since the event will not go up to watch till april 21st. Other ways im going to start bringing awareness is with the interview muse gave PSC I'll be using that to make posts around the internet branching out to contact other sites to feature the interview. Also the co-commentator of the event "The Gentleman Gamer" has already made posts about this on their website including a play with bubbles video. From there I also have podcasters Video Game Bang making an announcement about this event. And those are just some small already planned announcements. All participants who have a youtube channel will be announcing their participation in the event. There are more announcements in planning as well ill be posting in other gaming forums and communities. Next topic

I thought I mentioned the time frame already but in case I haven't yet there is no set days for the matches there will be three weeks in advance were we will schedule and record 4 matches. Starting next weekend i will start scheduling the matches working with the teams to allow some flexibility for others. This way it will help to prevent clashing with other events.

As for the matches this has been brought to my attention much earlier in this forum and a change is being made. I will be updating the details on the site soon the new detail is a single 40 minute match winner takes all. Ties will enter a sudden death first kill wins. as for the 5 minute load this was before i tested a little in spectator mode and found you to be correct. I've also thought about that more and have decided that you are correct and it isn't needed.  I also found out what you have clarified with tbe servers this originally was something someone else had brought up to me. This was our work around which has since changed. Thus the single match now.

As for drop in chat the gentleman gamer has a dedicated ventrilo server that we will REQUEST others use. It is nit required but by using it better footage and a better event can be done. Using this system and providing each crew with their own channel this will mimic the system used in the game however will allow us to drop in at any time. At the same time if a team or crew does not wish to use ventrilo most of these team chat programs have built in recording systems and they can still choose to record thier in game chat and using editing add that to tbe show. It can be done with participation from the teams.

I really hope this shows I've thought this out a lot. I know im still polishing a little but I am confident ill be ready in time. Ill admit reading these criticisms are tough but im hoping my determination and willingness to adjust will help to show you that I will no allow myself to fail muse. Keep the criticisms coming! :-)

As for the charity sketchy bit the entire event will also have the ability to donate directly to child's play as well for those who do not care for the raffle or do not trust PSC with handling the money. It has been shown that when you include the ability to win something or just provide involvement in something people are more interested and also more likely to donate more then normal. I have a question for you all. Have you ever took part in a real life charity event? A raffle event at a business or location that isn't run by the charity directly. Have you ever put cash into the donation bin at a store? Hagee you ever made a donation to a charity to a third party person or business. You do that without any proof of trust that they give every penny of your donation to the charity. The thing is I've told muse in emails what I plan to do. If I fail to give child's play the money I am legally liable under fraud. I need go earn the trust of people some way however the way you earn trust is by being given a little at first. There will be a direct link to the child's play donation and if no one does the ticket raffle bit and all donate directly I won't care in the least and nothing will get raffled that way. Ill find another way in that case. This is something im offering to viewers if the choose to participate otherwise they can donate directly. I hope this clears up any confusion. With the charity im trying things and offering the chance for people to give us trust so we can then earn it. If people choose to not trust us in that way yet then that is fine.

Ps I have started playing I the game mentioning the event recently to build awareness as well.

Any more feedback? This is a very hard learning process but im determined and willing to learn.

[Byron Cavendish]

Well, here is what I see. First, the first post has to be updated with the current information. That means all the information, organized in a clean and clear manner. No one is going to want to sign up to your website. I know you can't modify it now but a CA or MOD can help with that if you ask.

Your going to need the "big three" to really have a successful event. Those being the Merry Men, Ducks and Gentlemen. We are a small but robust community and we talk to each other about these sort of things. You need the big guys to get rolling, but you're not going to get them until we can see what we are getting into without having to jump through hoops.

Finally, in reference to your last post, there is no way we are hopping into a foreign ventrilo or sharing recordings of our communication and tactics to the public and enemy clans.

I do absolutely love more publicity and interest put into GOIO's e-sport. But we act and compete as professionals, and we expect this to be presented as such.

[ZeckPressStart]

Well, here is what I see. First, the first post has to be updated with the current information. That means all the information, organized in a clean and clear manner. No one is going to want to sign up to your website. I know you can't modify it now but a CA or MOD can help with that if you ask.

Your going to need the "big three" to really have a successful event. Those being the Merry Men, Ducks and Gentlemen. We are a small but robust community and we talk to each other about these sort of things. You need the big guys to get rolling, but you're not going to get them until we can see what we are getting into without having to jump through hoops.

Finally, in reference to your last post, there is no way we are hopping into a foreign ventrilo or sharing recordings of our communication and tactics to the public and enemy clans.

I do absolutely love more publicity and interest put into GOIO's e-sport. But we act and compete as professionals, and we expect this to be presented as such.

Hm you bring up a good point I never though of with the recording of voices or dropping I to chat... I didn't think of that. That is a good point I will considler removing that idea. Thank you for pointing that out. As for updating the original post I will try to get in touch with a mod when I finish typing up the updated details. Thanks for the information I was trying to think of how I was to update the original post to show the changes and the open link.

[Thomas]

I wouldn't say you need 'the big three' to have a successful event, but rather it's a sign that an event is successful if those clans do participate (they and others try to participate in all the events).

It seems there's a larger focus on getting players to raffle (donate money) and watch, as opposed to the tournament itself. It's always been difficult to get people interested in competitions when they're not actively participating. If you could accomplish that, I would be very impressed. Very likely it will be hard to get a lot of GoIO community interested in paying attention to it if the bigger clans aren't participating. Not a lot of people are going to place bets on a collection of novices.

Since the sign up deadline is closing fast, you should do your best to solidify tournament details and get that information out there; as well as getting teams to sign up. I believe the time this event begins is around the conclusion of the Sky League, so you might have some difficulty with that.

[Mattilald Anguisad]

I'm certain all this criticsm is aimed at helping you make best tournament you can. We cartainly apreciate you effort, and interest.
Generaly events are scheduled at least 3 weeks in advance and set on Saturdays&Sundays (comunity is relatively evenly spread over the world it seems). As suggested you can ask Urz for advice on running competitive events, becouse he is the most experienced in this regard (he is running a tournament event that will be spread over a month or so and will start this weekend) - if you want to fun it on weekends, you'll have to coordinate with Urz, becouse he runs weekly mini events (Saturday Box Social, and The Sunday Rumble), so there won't bee scheduling conflicts and all people can join.

Considering the goal is to raie money for donation, and the fact a lot of the casual gaming public doesen't read the forums, you might want to ask Muse to hilight your event in the newsletter (come to think of it they haven made a newsletter in a while, it's a goot time to make a new one ).

Also I personaly I'd love to participate, but I don't get the final say in my clan.

[ZeckPressStart]

I'm certain all this criticsm is aimed at helping you make best tournament you can. We cartainly apreciate you effort, and interest.
Generaly events are scheduled at least 3 weeks in advance and set on Saturdays&Sundays (comunity is relatively evenly spread over the world it seems). As suggested you can ask Urz for advice on running competitive events, becouse he is the most experienced in this regard (he is running a tournament event that will be spread over a month or so and will start this weekend) - if you want to fun it on weekends, you'll have to coordinate with Urz, becouse he runs weekly mini events (Saturday Box Social, and The Sunday Rumble), so there won't bee scheduling conflicts and all people can join.

Considering the goal is to raie money for donation, and the fact I  a lot of the casual gaming public doesen't read the forums, you might want to ask Muse to hilight your event in the newsletter (come to think of it they haven made a newsletter in a while, it's a goot time to make a new one ).

Also I personaly I'd love to participate, but I don't get the final say in my clan.

Thank you very much and yes I know this criticism is all designed to help so I want to thank everyone else as well. With everything you guys are telling me im thinking it might be in my best interest to delay the event. Since I am out of state till sunday night I can not post replies or make the necessary adjustments to posts... also with the upcoming Hrs event I feel it might be best to postpone to allow for other teams and clans to have a chance to join. As of now the deadline is no longer valid I will try my best to edit the title of this topic or try to get a hold of a mod to assist me with this.

I again want to thank everyone for all the feedback and help. I really want to make a great event for guns of icarus. Great idea on the newsletter by the way I will mention it to matt the next time I email him.

[Alistair MacBain]

There are no big three.
The weekly events of the last months were only permanently visited by one of the big three.
The gents.
The other included clans just made some of those events.
Nothing to blame. Everything has its reasons.

There is a whole bunch of active and great clans out there. The Aerodrome had the gents and the MM. No ducks and it still was an awesome event.

Take the competetive clans into consideration and thats it.
Just to list some:
Rydr, Sir, Thralls, OVW, SAC, BFS and so many others.
They may just make some of the events but they are always up for a surprise.

[Mattilald Anguisad]

Or to list them in full name for your convinience: Ryders (Rydr), Sky Invarind Rhinos (SIR), Glowwater Thralls (GwTh), Overwatch (OVW), Sacrilege (Sac), BlackFlight Squadron(BFS), The Art of War (TAW), Cake (Cake), Crimison Marauders (CsM). there is IRIS clan (I'm sorry I cant remember what your abreviation means). Last event was rounded up by an unafilliated group of players under tag of MERC (as in mercenaries). Plus some competitive clans I havent heard or seen in competitive matches for a while: Polaris (PLRS) - not to be mistaken with youtube MCN Polaris (part of Maker Studios), The Flying Dutchemen (TFD).

[N-Sunderland]

Sky Invarind Rhinos (SIR), The Art of War (TAW), Crimison Marauders (CsM).

Just a couple of corrections: it's Sky-Invading Rhinos, The Art of Warfare, and Crimson Sky Menace.

[Alistair MacBain]

Finally some cleanup what csm means .
Always confused what it stood for.

[Mattilald Anguisad]

I think Corvus Marauders used to have CSM tag, before we were renamed into Glowwater Thralls, now Crimison Sky Menace took the tag. I appologise for the typo in SIR name, and the errors in TAW and CSM names.

[ZeckPressStart]

Ok so I don't see any way to edit this post... I'm going to contact a mod today to see if I can edit this topic or if I should create a new topic. Not sure which would be easier... Hold up for the next update. Thanks for all the info by the way. So I will have an update up shortly or a new topic will arise soon.

[ZeckPressStart]

An updated post has been sent to a moderator and should be up eventually. I've skipped linking to the site as the only way to get the info and provided everything to be posted here directly. I have also pushed back the event and everything will be listed on the new post. Thank you everyone for your patience and information! I'm learning a lot. 

[Velvet]

that's a great improvement, thanks. I would still encourage you to leave out the cash prize. I don't think any team would take the money for themselves so it seems a rather unnecessary choice to offer.