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Thomas:
Generally speaking a mine launcher build is fairly easy to beat. Of course if they have good gunners the difficulty goes up dramatically. Mines have a very specific range. This range can be changed with a proper use of gunner tools.

https://gunsoficarus.com/community/forum/index.php/topic,3059.0.html

The mine launcher can go from about 80 meters to about 340 meters (with tools, although in practice these numbers seem a bit off). As far as I can tell, they'll explode on 'impact', but both ships and the mines have larger hitboxes than they seem to. So it's really about 20-30 meters or so (closer than it sounds). Considering that ships are volumes, this actually gives quite a bit of room for a good gunner. You're not actually trying to strike the ship directly, but the area around the ship.

Knowing this, a gunner on a mine launcher is taking into account a lot of information. They need an estimate on the distance (usually through experience), their velocity, and the target's velocity. (velocity includes direction).

Personally I'm a one mine launcher kind of person, but that puts a lot of pressure on the gunner to get hits. A munker (and other ships with lots of mine launchers) are usually reducing the need for accuracy with sheer numbers of mines. Creating whole fields. This makes it difficult to chase them. And once you start getting hit, you'll likely continue to get hit (you'll take damage and suffer the impact, often slowing you down and making you an easier target).


To beat a ship who's primary weapon is a mine launcher, you have two options. Option one is stay out of their range. This means getting too close to them, or too far for their mines to explode on you. This can be a problem with munkers in particular, since they don't really have a blind spot, and the mine launchers have a large turning arc.

Assuming you have a gat/mortar build and not something long range, you should try to stay just inside of the gat range and pepper them. Ideally you'll be just out of mine range. You likely won't kill them, but they won't be able to kill you either. If they start trying to chase, just back up. They'll have trouble going around their own mines. At a certain point you'll actually want to change directions and charge at them. They're likely still using lesmok and trying to get you at range. Right when you're just about in lesmok range, burst forward. You might take a mine hit, but if you time it right it will just hit your ship. Now they're reloading and you're already ramming them. Unless they have lochnagar, they're very unlikely to hit you; and lochnagar comes with the downside of reducing the aoe size. So even when they start getting you, it's going to mostly be hull damage. Your engines and guns should be relatively fine.

But assuming you're that close, they should be destroyed in a relatively fast manner. The mines use impact damage, so things like moonshine can be used to reduce the amount of rotation to your ship. If they can't turn you or slow you down, they'll have a hard time keeping you in their active range.



Option two is probably easier. Ignore them and go for their ally. A mine ship by nature is more defensive. If you hug their ally, they can't mine as effectively for fear of killing their own team. Of course some players could care less about that. However, going for their ally also causes them to try and move in on you, instead of you chasing them. This again makes it easier to charge them and take them down, instead of trying to follow them through a mine field.

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tldr:
Be aware of their effective ranges. Kerosene is you friend. Don't be afraid to take a mine or two to get in their face. You can always go for their ally.

Squidslinger Gilder:
You assume a munker cares if they mine their ally. One of the key rules to successful mine combat...allies are expendable and often times key mine placement, while damaging the ally severely, will also wreak havoc on the enemy. Multiple enemies turn it into a pinball game and the chaos can allow the crippled ally to limp away. It is ok if you kill your ally as long as you kill the enemies attacking.

You're also assuming the munker has no means of closing range or escaping. In that respect, they are very much like squids where you are at the mercy of the engines. Balloon going out isn't a biggee as long as your miner has incendiary and you have kerosene you can control the engagement and recover from a bad situation. Pilot should take a spanner too, not a wrench as you'll spend more time rebuilding the balloon than repairing. Plus it frees up crew to watch the hull. Engine tools also allow the munker to go from defensive to offensive and even if most of the guns are lost, all it needs is one mine to create an opening.

Its a silly boat at face value but it becomes very complex when used correctly. Design and combat theory on it emerged from CP battles in Scrap so it isn't meant to be a build that doesn't draw fire. Its meant to engage 2-3+ enemies at once and survive long enough for allies to reengage. That is with crew members moving constantly between shooting and repairing while one holds off attackers. Pilot must know ranges and the crew must be in sync with the pilot's movements to predict placement. Again like a squid, it is unforgiving if things go wrong.

Tropo:
in reply to some stuff above mine lunchers should always aim up
shoot lesmok behide or neexted to and not at the emeny


how to aim in short aim about 30degress up whats that ? ok so your in  range with standard rounds it should be aiming for balloon high

lesmok has 30+ projectle left so aim almost where to are shooting

range
lesmok 340metres
incendiary 150 metres  add 50 degress aim almoost looking at your own balloon
greased rounds 160 metres add 40 degress aiming
heat sink rounds 160 metre fire same as standard
lock range 80 metres  aiming should be aiming for nexted to there hull this round will not do much but the impact is increased and it will stop a emeny charge and take down hull armor in most cases
charged is the best round by fare and range is 200 metres
burst also 200metres

standard mine range is 200 metre same specs as flame thrower

so if above hasn't helped try running a flame throw with lesmok when flames in range start firing the mines enjoy

Thomas:
I'm not assuming any of those. I mention that some players care less about mining their own team.

For running and chasing, mine ships are generally better at running. I wouldn't advise chasing them, as it's easier for them to predict where you're going to be, and they don't have to worry about running into their own mines.

When closing distance they have to be aware not to put mines in front of themselves. It's not as big of an issue on the junker because they're often at an angle and not charging straight in.

What I'm saying is to take advantage of the mine launcher itself. It has a very specific range and a single shot (although the reload is pretty fast). Generally when they're tying to close, they'll have a certain ammo (usually lesmok). Back away and let them push forward, you'll often see them deploying mines and can judge how long before they'll be in range. Right before that moment happens, charge in. (You'll normally want to slow your retreat first so you can change directions faster). Often they'll still have lesmok or such loaded. If you time it right, that shot will hit your ship directly and not explode. If you time it wrong, you'll take a mine in the face. Assuming you have kerosene or such, you'll continue going forward and brush it off. You'll normally be ramming them before they can get another shot off. Once you're inside of this range, it's almost impossible for them to escape. Great gunners can still get shots off to your sides, but you can normally disable their guns with the gat (or they'll break their own guns with loch shots). Be prepared to pop your kerosene (or just leave it on) so you don't rotate off target.




These type of all mine builds do better in capture point than actual death matches. This is because in capture points, you have to go to them and get inside their range. The stuff I talked about usually only works in DM.


I do like the flamethrower tip though.

HamsterIV:
This reminds me of a funny quote from a completely different forum that might be applicable:

--- Quote ---The countersolution, for the good fighters to put themselves at a disadvantage, almost makes things worse: if you're so good that you have to fight left-handed to have a challenge, eventually you'll be murdering people while fighting lefty and armed only with a dagger. That'll really make them want to come back.
--- End quote ---
Source:
http://www.electricsamurai.com/main_page.pl?action=view_article&file=20140103104641-Guests.txt&dir=General

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